Redwood Ryan
Masterpiece
Everyone seems to quote that article, but no one seems to understand that Jacks been growing under lights for 25 years. He's got a heck of a lot more knowledge than most indoor growers do, especially beginners.
Hello I recently
- Thread starter Austin
- Start date
Everyone seems to quote that article, but no one seems to understand that Jacks been growing under lights for 25 years. He's got a heck of a lot more knowledge than most indoor growers do, especially beginners.
LMAO OMG he explaind almost word for word what I'm doing...
If you are a beginner and have read this far without being too intimidated, finish this article and go get yourself some plants --- more than a few --- that you don't have too much invested in monetarily and emotionally, then start your own experiment to find out what it takes for you to keep them alive. Oh yes. If you really want to grow bonsai under fluorescent light or any other way, don't give up too easily!
mean from lighting temps humidity wicks in pots and soil mixture hell even the amount of time my lights are on during a day.
but thank you guys for bringing up that article
If you are a beginner and have read this far without being too intimidated, finish this article and go get yourself some plants --- more than a few --- that you don't have too much invested in monetarily and emotionally, then start your own experiment to find out what it takes for you to keep them alive. Oh yes. If you really want to grow bonsai under fluorescent light or any other way, don't give up too easily!
mean from lighting temps humidity wicks in pots and soil mixture hell even the amount of time my lights are on during a day.
but thank you guys for bringing up that article
and he started out under similar cirumsatnaces and with the same or similar idea I have started with this year.
daygan
Chumono
All the more reason to learn from him, and learn from his example.
coh
Imperial Masterpiece
Redwood Ryan said:
Exactly!
It's funny, every time someone posts on a forum about wanting to grow non-tropical bonsai indoors, he (or she) gets shouted down, told it's impossible, junipers (for example) won't survive indoors, etc. And yet Jack Wikle has been doing exactly that for many years. That's why we post links to the article. I'm sure it's not easy and there will be a significant learning curve for anyone trying to duplicate his results, but impossible? Obviously not!
Chris
mat
Chumono
And every time there's a discussion about growing difficult trees indoors, Jack's article gets brought up. I never see any other references, and I also never see someone say "I've been using Jack's methods for 5 years, and here are my awesome bonsai that have resulted."
I don't mean to say that Jack isn't doing what he says, just that it doesn't seem to be an easy to replicate process.
No-one is telling Austin not to try. Go for it. Just don't start claiming breakthrough results with less that a year's experience and a link to Jack's article.
I don't mean to say that Jack isn't doing what he says, just that it doesn't seem to be an easy to replicate process.
No-one is telling Austin not to try. Go for it. Just don't start claiming breakthrough results with less that a year's experience and a link to Jack's article.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
"Exactly!
It's funny, every time someone posts on a forum about wanting to grow non-tropical bonsai indoors, he (or she) gets shouted down, told it's impossible, junipers (for example) won't survive indoors, etc. And yet Jack Wikle has been doing exactly that for many years. That's why we post links to the article. I'm sure it's not easy and there will be a significant learning curve for anyone trying to duplicate his results, but impossible? Obviously not!"
This is a headslapper... We're not shouting anyone down, as much as telling them that they're headed mostly for a disappointing time and the road they're headed down is pretty well-traveled with meager results.
Jack Wikle is referenced all the time--why is it that he's mostly the only one referenced? Because he's mostly the only one who's been even moderately successful with Junipers (not oaks, maples or other temperate species) indoors. Why aren't there more articles and experts to quote? Mostly because people have found that it's not worth the trouble.
That said, if you can point to success (beyond a couple of years) and have replicable methods to show others, go for it. Yeah, QUESTION EVERYTHING, including claims of success after six months...
It's funny, every time someone posts on a forum about wanting to grow non-tropical bonsai indoors, he (or she) gets shouted down, told it's impossible, junipers (for example) won't survive indoors, etc. And yet Jack Wikle has been doing exactly that for many years. That's why we post links to the article. I'm sure it's not easy and there will be a significant learning curve for anyone trying to duplicate his results, but impossible? Obviously not!"
This is a headslapper... We're not shouting anyone down, as much as telling them that they're headed mostly for a disappointing time and the road they're headed down is pretty well-traveled with meager results.
Jack Wikle is referenced all the time--why is it that he's mostly the only one referenced? Because he's mostly the only one who's been even moderately successful with Junipers (not oaks, maples or other temperate species) indoors. Why aren't there more articles and experts to quote? Mostly because people have found that it's not worth the trouble.
That said, if you can point to success (beyond a couple of years) and have replicable methods to show others, go for it. Yeah, QUESTION EVERYTHING, including claims of success after six months...
Last edited:
Redwood Ryan
Masterpiece
Jack does say that the Pines he tried to grow indoors did die, which Austin is trying to do...
october
Masterpiece
I remember seeing pictures of Jack Wikle's indoor set up years ago. I think that is what is being missed here. It is really not a set up. It is a whole micro climate area. I mean metal halide lights mounted and hung throughout the ceiling exactly the heights they need to be, air circulation, windows etc.. I mean the whole room is climate controlled where it is almost like a science lab.
Most of us could not and would not spend or be able to spend this amount of money on a set up like his. Most would rather spend the money on trees. Jack spends this money because he has to.Key phrase "has to". I remember reading his article years ago that he lives at a high elevation so frost can happen anytime.
Jack is not experimenting, that has been done. Now he has done what he can to be able to grow bonsai successfully because he loves and respects it.
Rob
Most of us could not and would not spend or be able to spend this amount of money on a set up like his. Most would rather spend the money on trees. Jack spends this money because he has to.Key phrase "has to". I remember reading his article years ago that he lives at a high elevation so frost can happen anytime.
Jack is not experimenting, that has been done. Now he has done what he can to be able to grow bonsai successfully because he loves and respects it.
Rob
Last edited:
Dav4
Drop Branch Murphy
- Messages
- 13,464
- Reaction score
- 32,081
- USDA Zone
- 6a
I have a hard enough time keeping my temperate trees healthy and strong growing OUTSIDE, and I honestly don't need any more challenges in my life. Good luck with your experiment.
coh
Imperial Masterpiece
I hope you didn't slap yourself too hard! I'm speaking in generic terms about what I've seen in forums over the years, and perhaps exaggerating a bit - not accusing you (or anyone specifically in this thread) of shouting someone down. I've just seen it written so many times ("you cannot grow whatever indoors") that I probably over-reacted. Jack has shown that it can be done, for some species at least.
You do bring up a good point, and that is "why is Jack Wikle the only one referenced?" I think, as you note, it's probably that it's just not worth the effort for the most part. If you live in a cold climate area, you either (1) grow hardy trees and let them be dormant for the winter, or (2) grow tropical trees that can tolerate the indoor conditions during the winter. One only resorts to Wikle methods if there is no choice.
As for the original posters claims of success...I confess to not having read most of the thread in detail, so I probably should have refrained from posting (I was initially just correcting the reference to Meislik/Wikle). I do agree his short-term claims should be questioned and will be interested to see how things work out in the future.
I'll go back and read the rest of the thread now...
Chris
coh
Imperial Masterpiece
OK, after slogging through the entire thread, I have come to the conclusion that everyone has covered the bases pretty well.
Austin, I understand what you are trying to do - protect the plants from the harshest winter weather and extend the growing season by waking them up earlier in the spring. Please let us know how things go with your experiments.
Speaking from my experience trying to keep a small group of tropicals healthy and growing indoors in western NY, your biggest problem is probably going to be giving the growing plants enough quality light once they wake up.
Chris
Austin, I understand what you are trying to do - protect the plants from the harshest winter weather and extend the growing season by waking them up earlier in the spring. Please let us know how things go with your experiments.
Speaking from my experience trying to keep a small group of tropicals healthy and growing indoors in western NY, your biggest problem is probably going to be giving the growing plants enough quality light once they wake up.
Chris
Over all I am trying to emulate a month long fall indoors, the three month long winter for less cold hardy plants in an air cooled thermostat controlled "cooler", and emulate a month long spring inside the "cooler". I NEVER intended to make them grow entirely indoors.
This is all for trees that are not native to my area to make sure they make it thru the winter.
I have a similar climate to Jack Wikle because frosts can happen at almost anytime in spring or fall from beginning to end entirely unexpectedly, Example we frequently get forecasted 40-50 degrees nights for our first frost of the year (as we all know the forecast is not all ways accurate) and I believe this is due to the fact that I live almost exactly where 3 planting zones swirl and converge according to the planting zone maps in high detail. (with the A's and B's)
The plants I am using now as test subjects do not need to be wintered with my theorised method. Just simply wanted to learn how to grow the trees this winter be for I start digging up saplings this spring so I have fewer losses when I actually get started along with settling on a soil mixture to use with my saplings.
As far as micro climate goes, I posted a drawing of how I intend to build one over the summer.
At this point I have built my own micro climate out of some plastic lights and steel racking placed in front of a south facing window to eliminate the need for metal halide bulbs to supplement my florescent lights, the heat generated by the base board heater and the sun during the day (combined with a ceiling fan) create the air moment needed the leaves wiggle just a bit when the sun is on them or the heater kicks on due to the hole I left on the top of the "green house" and the side facing the window and heater is left open at all times allowing it to breathe more easily and not over heat. (my set up has changed drastically sense I posted pictures, and my soil also changed from the beginning of the thread Based on what has been said in this conversation from all sides)
Does this post make my idea anymore clear to any of you?
This is all for trees that are not native to my area to make sure they make it thru the winter.
I have a similar climate to Jack Wikle because frosts can happen at almost anytime in spring or fall from beginning to end entirely unexpectedly, Example we frequently get forecasted 40-50 degrees nights for our first frost of the year (as we all know the forecast is not all ways accurate) and I believe this is due to the fact that I live almost exactly where 3 planting zones swirl and converge according to the planting zone maps in high detail. (with the A's and B's)
The plants I am using now as test subjects do not need to be wintered with my theorised method. Just simply wanted to learn how to grow the trees this winter be for I start digging up saplings this spring so I have fewer losses when I actually get started along with settling on a soil mixture to use with my saplings.
As far as micro climate goes, I posted a drawing of how I intend to build one over the summer.
At this point I have built my own micro climate out of some plastic lights and steel racking placed in front of a south facing window to eliminate the need for metal halide bulbs to supplement my florescent lights, the heat generated by the base board heater and the sun during the day (combined with a ceiling fan) create the air moment needed the leaves wiggle just a bit when the sun is on them or the heater kicks on due to the hole I left on the top of the "green house" and the side facing the window and heater is left open at all times allowing it to breathe more easily and not over heat. (my set up has changed drastically sense I posted pictures, and my soil also changed from the beginning of the thread Based on what has been said in this conversation from all sides)
Does this post make my idea anymore clear to any of you?
Similar threads
