Rocky Mountain white pines...anyone working with?

[MrFancyPlants]

Vance,
I didn't mean to imply that EWP doesn't deserve the bad reputation that it has has, just that I am always curious to see what is out there since I am an amateur hobbyist that happens to be saddled with an EWP for the long term.

As far as back budding, I have had some luck (admittedly not the most mature specimen) with the EWP detailed here: here

Sorry if I am thread hijacking, I know that the Rocky mountain white pines probably have much more potential then our "Appalachian Mountain White Pines". Feel free to comment on my older thread if you have any styling advise for me. I know it has a long way to go.

Thanks,
David

 

[Vance Wood]

Vance,
I didn't mean to imply that EWP doesn't deserve the bad reputation that it has has, just that I am always curious to see what is out there since I am an amateur hobbyist that happens to be saddled with an EWP for the long term.

As far as back budding, I have had some luck (admittedly not the most mature specimen) with the EWP detailed here: here

Sorry if I am thread hijacking, I know that the Rocky mountain white pines probably have much more potential then our "Appalachian Mountain White Pines". Feel free to comment on my older thread if you have any styling advise for me. I know it has a long way to go.

Thanks,
David

I checked out the link you posted. Your tree has a long way to go as you know. One individual suggested that you bring it in if the temperature drops below freezing. Don't do that. Strobus must be allowed to go dormant and being indoors will kill it quick.

 

[Ang3lfir3]

as my gorgeous wife has already mentioned this summer was to put it in one word.... crazy ....

as far as pinus flexilis goes ... we don't have any however I am interested in them myself .... I had an opportunity to collect them in the past and as we have little white pine success I did not. Now that I know how to manage white pine I am up for the challenge again and hope to collect some relatively soon (which means sometime between now and 3yrs from now )

I know they survive in this area quite well as the ones featured in the National Exhibition books are living here in the PNW (at least some of them)



@Dick -- you sure those are limber pine?? (surprised as I have never seen any there).... I don't remember them having any in stock ...

 

[Dan W.]

Welcome back Eric!

 

[Dan W.]

So... I just learned something new...

I assumed that all 5 needle pines were white pines.

It turns out that there are three classifications:

Pinus - Which includes all of the black and red pines as far as I can tell, along with ponderosa and shore/lodgepole.

Strobus - These are the white's... some western's would be limber and white bark.

Ducampopinus - Bristlecone and pinyon fall under this category.

Crazy! Anyway, I'm sure this is old hat for many of you... but I just learned somethng...lol

 

[Dan W.]

Dick, I did find some info on how to tell limber from white bark here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitebark_Pine

If you have any other tips I'd be glad to hear them.

 

[Dan W.]

Here are a few more pics I took and/or found:

Bristlecone at the ABS/BCI show in Denver this year


Limber at the Denver Botanical Gardens


Some more limber's from the web
...

 

[Dan W.]

Links:

Jerry Meislik on White Bark Pines
http://www.bonsaihunk.us/info/WhitebarkPine.html

Jerry Meislik Limber Pines
http://www.bonsaihunk.us/images4.html

 

[Dan W.]

Limber Pines in nature:

......

Pic's 2 & 3 are both collectible and on the list for this coming spring!

I have some pics of great full size Limber's somewhere...will post when I find them.

 

[fore]

Those are awesome trees Dan!! What a find, and what an opportunity! Glad you can't see how green my face is right now )

 

[wireme]

Here in B.C. both limber and whitebark pines are blue listed species, possibly not possible to collect legally. What's their status in the states?

 

[crust]

I have had a collected 2' Limber for quite a few years (I will look for my bad picture). It is not a super tree or anything but it is what I found--it was in thin dirt on top of solid rock--a roadside Montana tree. It survived collection unremarkably. Other than having doingy branches it is fine. It grew very slowly in my finer soil so I moved half of its roots to a pumice/lava soil last year. This year I plan to get the rest changed out.

I understand Randy K plants these collected trees in pure pumice with good success.

Mr. Pall has a few things to say about Limbers. I read he believes they make superior collected bonsai and have wonderful attributes. I surmised that he feels the key is as with all our western mountain conifers, get it out of the original soil and into a porous non-organic substrate and proceed to energize--lots of fertilizer and little or no green removal (pruning/pinching/needle)---get very healthy then train.

 

[JasonG]

Randy Knight has collected many White bark /Limber Pines from the Rockies. Some very amazing trees with very good deadwood, twisty trunks and amazingly awesome needles. They are great for bonsai and have no problem keeping them alive here in the Portland area. Futher north into Seattle it might be a bit to wet and cold for them, not sure.

Ryan Neil has worked with many over the past few years, one of the better species for bonsai coming out of the Rockies although not as bullet proof as the Ponderosa or RMJ.

 

[Dan W.]

Thanks Crust and Jason,

Crust, that looks like it could end up being a really nice tree down the road And thanks for the info.

Jason, thanks for the info. I know I've seen a very nice one belonging to Scott Elser. Did he get this one from Randy?

 

[Dan W.]

Wireme, to the best of my knowledge, these trees are collectible here in the States. The same rules apply as to any other trees: You have to have a permit or permission from the landowner, and of course no collecting in National Parks.

-- What does "blue listed" mean? Is this some sort of endangered spcies list for plants?

 

[ghues]

The designation "Blue listed" .....Readers digest version........is based on a Canadian Government law to protect native species, sometimes its habitat......based on many things......how healthy the species (animals birds trees flowers etc) population in its natual habitat...I believe blue = threatened whereas Red listed = endangered.....and a plan is in place to protect and enhance its ability to recover to more traditional populations.
Even old growth forests and significant ecological habitats are designated and protected...in our Province we protect 13% of our natural ecosystems..... on public land which is about 95%.

The other issue we have up here with Whitebark Pine is that it is now being attacked by the White Pine Blister Rust (which I believe came from the USSR).....
Cheers Graham

 

[Dan W.]

Thanks Graham. I hope the white-bark's beat the rust!

 

[dick benbow]

Since my last chat I have aquired a few more whitebarks. I dug 6 this spring and one this fall.
When i dig them the needles are no longer than an inch and a yellowish green. (poor soil). By fall, the color increases to a good green. from the ones from the year before, the needle length has doubled and color is blue. I hope to get a few more this coming spring. When you study where they grow and how dependant they are on squirrels and birds, it's amazing how well they do to support so much life yet a few of their seeds to manage to germinate and become life.

I did pick up a bristlecone this fall. They also have a great story. was surprised when I asked around the club that many long time club members have one in their collection.

My limber pines are doing fine. I have 3, one really good one.

I'm really getting into native trees.

 

[Vance Wood]

Since my last chat I have aquired a few more whitebarks. I dug 6 this spring and one this fall.
When i dig them the needles are no longer than an inch and a yellowish green. (poor soil). By fall, the color increases to a good green. from the ones from the year before, the needle length has doubled and color is blue. I hope to get a few more this coming spring. When you study where they grow and how dependant they are on squirrels and birds, it's amazing how well they do to support so much life yet a few of their seeds to manage to germinate and become life.

I did pick up a bristlecone this fall. They also have a great story. was surprised when I asked around the club that many long time club members have one in their collection.

My limber pines are doing fine. I have 3, one really good one.

I'm really getting into native trees.

This is a discussion I was hoping to get started sometimes this fall. I think there is an entire branch of Yamadori that is totally ignored wherein I believe the best trees in American bonsai will eventually be found.

 

[fore]

Since my last chat I have aquired a few more whitebarks. I dug 6 this spring and one this fall.
When i dig them the needles are no longer than an inch and a yellowish green. (poor soil). By fall, the color increases to a good green. from the ones from the year before, the needle length has doubled and color is blue. I hope to get a few more this coming spring. When you study where they grow and how dependant they are on squirrels and birds, it's amazing how well they do to support so much life yet a few of their seeds to manage to germinate and become life.

I did pick up a bristlecone this fall. They also have a great story. was surprised when I asked around the club that many long time club members have one in their collection.

My limber pines are doing fine. I have 3, one really good one.

I'm really getting into native trees.

Dick, do you have a picture of that whitebark? Not sure I've seen one. Thanks!