"Hard" Akadama?

[nathanbs]

I learned enough in the last few years that I never have and never will need to use akadama... Ironic?

Grimmy

you also don't need wire, concave cutters, or artistic ability either......unless maybe you want to make the best bonsai one can make. There is no disputing the benefits of akadama. Sorry

 

[Smoke]

As far as Al goes he is one of the good guys-----mostly; unless he is in turd mode.

There are probably around a hundred or more people here that I have met and actually know personally. If they are from California I know them and have met or worked side by side with them. Lots and lots from the East Coast as well. Worked side by side with William Valavanis while teaching my workshops, and Dave DeGroot on the other side, and Kenji Miyata on the other.

Al has no turd mode.

turd mode is an effect stemming from a cause.

 

[Nybonsai12]

Al teaches on this forum. Whether one wants to learn from it is up to them.

And Victrina, you posts are like poetry. And just so you know your japanese larch is one I always find myself going back to look at.

 

[Smoke]

I've read hard (high fired) akadama defeats the purpose and would be no better than Turface. Whether that is true or not I am not sure. Just thought I would share since it kinda makes sense.

Damn, I hate it when I totaly miss something and it is staring me right in the face. What is your take Dario about why there would be a difference between soft akadama and fired hard (uncrushable, like turface) akadama?

 

[Jason_mazzy]

so I was looking around and akadama was $6 a bag in japan........................... $40 a bag here. I understand shipping BUT DAMP! that's crazy. I am pissed I bought this Kanuma!

 

[fore]

Damn, I hate it when I totaly miss something and it is staring me right in the face. What is your take Dario about why there would be a difference between soft akadama and fired hard (uncrushable, like turface) akadama?

Actually, the 'uncrushable' truly hard akadama could still be crushed if you pinched hard enough, it just breaks down much slower than what's currently available. This 'hard' akadama available here breaks down within a very short time.


Listen all, this thread has terribly derailed. Whether you think akadama is worth it or not, whether it's organic or not, yada yada yada. It's not important! We should simply respect what people want to use as a substrate, tools, and even aesthetics and designs. I personally want to use a harder akadama that breaks down slower, hence my original question. Look at this thread...I'm pretty sure not a single person answered my question, like whether it's not available, or only the softer akadama...nothing. So seriously everyone, take a breather and let's all, where needed, just agree to disagree.

And Victrinia, great to see you back!

 

[Smoke]

Actually, the 'uncrushable' truly hard akadama could still be crushed if you pinched hard enough, it just breaks down much slower than what's currently available. This 'hard' akadama available here breaks down within a very short time.


Listen all, this thread has terribly derailed. Whether you think akadama is worth it or not, whether it's organic or not, yada yada yada. It's not important! We should simply respect what people want to use as a substrate, tools, and even aesthetics and designs. I personally want to use a harder akadama that breaks down slower, hence my original question. Look at this thread...I'm pretty sure not a single person answered my question, like whether it's not available, or only the softer akadama...nothing. So seriously everyone, take a breather and let's all, where needed, just agree to disagree.

And Victrinia, great to see you back!

How about this then...I'm pretty sure you won't find what your looking for in Chicago.

 

[Colin Lewis]

My my, what a lot of confusion here, while really it's quite simple:

Akadama is NOT organic. It is naturally occurring, but to qualify as organic any substance must be derived from plant or animal matter. It may or may not also contain other CARBON-BASED compounds. Because Akadama is untreated, it does, however, qualify for use in organic horticulture.

As for "high fired" Akadama, you're confusing two things. Since Akadama is not clay (ever tried to make a slurry from the fines?) if cannot be fired to the same consistency as, say, turface. Indeed, firing it to a hard, non-crushable state would render all its desirable properties useless.

Hard Akadama and soft Akadama are the same thing. The hardness depends on two factors: where it is mined, and from how deep it is mined. Akadama is excavated from open cast pits in several locations. Some locations render a harder product than others. Additionally, the upper meter or so provides soft grains whereas that mined from several meters deep is considerably harder.

Akadama is mined, dried, graded and packed. No firing at all. Some producers heat the product to 120 degrees celcius by steam to sterilize the product. Others do not.

S'easy.

 

[coh]

Could have used your post about 100 posts ago!

 

[Deshi]

It is nice when someone chimes in with pure truth. Thank you Colin!

 

[fore]

Thank You very much Colin for jumping into the fray. Very interesting to read the hardness is determined on depth of excavation and not fired for hardness! Thank you for clarifying this for me/us.

Chris

 

[akadama]

Double Red Line Brand Akadama

www.sandersonbonsai.com still has some Double Red Line Brand Akadama in small and medium particles. This akadama is hard because it was mined from deep in the earth, not by firing it. It does not break down immediately when it gets wet like the akadama that is mined shallow.

 

[JudyB]

www.sandersonbonsai.com still has some Double Red Line Brand Akadama in small and medium particles. This akadama is hard because it was mined from deep in the earth, not by firing it. It does not break down immediately when it gets wet like the akadama that is mined shallow.

Woof, that is some pretty high pricing.... Esp. the small grain! $88.? Seems a bit much to me.

 

[Vance Wood]

I'm under-whelmened. One of the major reasons I do not use Akadama.

 

[fore]

Agreed Judy and Vance, that's a ridiculously high price. I just bought Aoki at $45 which is bad enough. Thank goodness I have only a few conifers going into bonsai pots. Hopefully we'll see DRL re enter the market here as I've got more than enough pumice and lava rock for min. cost. So I won't mind paying $45 bag if my other costs are negligible.

 

[markyscott]

Geez that's a high price. Get some friends together and buy it in bulk. For a 100 bag pallet try Wee Tree in Or., Deer Creek bonsai (Jim Gremel) in Occidental, House of Bonsai in LA, Lotus Bonsai in Placerville (looks like they have a shipment coming in), HollowCreek farms in Ct, or maybe Cass in St. Louis. Last time I did this I used Wee Tree, and it worked out to about $25 a bag for 100 15lb bags, including shipping - less than 1/3 of the Sanderson price. If you want to get even more economical, and there is enough interest in your area, I think a 1000 bag container can still be arranged for abt $10 a bag. For this, try B.B. Trading Co., Ltd. (bbtrading@nifty.com). You never know - maybe there are enough nutters in your area to make that work - at that price it is 1/3 less than a bag of turface.

Scott

 

[Smoke]

And really............ a wife jab? I kinda thought you were a more dignified man than that... or did I miss him taking some family pot shot at you recently.


V

She died in 2017 from the breast cancer....The new one died in 2020....I'm pondering if I want to do this again...

Good read otherwise. I miss Dario. The true meaning of a bonsai fanatic. Starts off slow, and tapers right off to nothing.

A sneak peak at "Pedagogy Bonsai"

 

[Vance Wood]

She died in 2017 from the breast cancer....The new one died in 2020....I'm pondering if I want to do this again...

Good read otherwise. I miss Dario. The true meaning of a bonsai fanatic. Starts off slow, and tapers right off to nothing.

A sneak peak at "Pedagogy Bonsai"

So---What's going on with you Al? Are you getting out of bonsai or getting back into bonsai? Did you suffer new deaths in the family or am I reading this post incorrectly?

 

[Smoke]

So---What's going on with you Al? Are you getting out of bonsai or getting back into bonsai? Did you suffer new deaths in the family or am I reading this post incorrectly?

Yes, new deaths, girlfriend of 23 months died last July, Dad died five days later. Just a rough patch. Never got out of bonsai, just have new girl, building a new school at her home on 1 acre. I now have the room to do what I wanted to do for the last thirty years. She has a 30 by 40 foot shop adjacent to the bonsai bunker and landscaping is underway. Put a new electrical service in the shop and ran underground water and electricity to the benches and school table area. The shop will contain a microwave, fridge and freezer. A combo BBQ and Tokonoma will be built soon.
Below is a view with the shop, and the adjacent planter being landscaped. The Japanese Barrel Bridge is being built in my garage and here we can see one of the laminated stringers as well as the laminated foot rail. All my wood working tools will be relocated soon and I will begin setting up shop to build stands on a much larger scale than in the past. So far I have about 6K invested in the project.

 

[Smoke]

Oh....and the lady whom has made all this possible, her name is Lisa. We are headed for great things, she will be catering all my events, and I will be incorporating what I call "Pedagogy Curb Service" where you drive up to the ample parking, you get unloaded by staff, and pay your 60.00 fee for the day and get all day workshop as well as a catered BBQ dinner with the customary libations = beer!! or wine for the snobs. We even made the local news in a photo below.