Air layering azalea + pieris?

[ForeverRaynning]

Hope this is the right place for this.

I have some big shrubs in the front garden, a large pieris and a large azalea and am thinking of air layering off them.

I know cuttings root easily on azaleas but I’m not sure how large an initial trunk you can get that way so hoping I can airlayer a thicker branch from low down?

Is there a maximum diameter to branches that can be air layered?

When is the best time to perform the air layer? How long can they take to root?

If anyone has any advice I’d really appreciate it.


This is the base of the Pieris, far too big for me to work with at the moment.


Heres a bit higher up, some nice chunky branches here (though not very interesting, I’ll admit!)

Heres the trunk/some branches on the Azalea (I have no idea if its deciduous or not, haven’t paid that much attention if I’m honest)



Some nice gnarly bits just off to the left there that may have some interesting movement.

Also what whould I pot these in? I’ve see Kanuma mentioned a lot?

I seem to get conflicting information on sunlight for these too, some sites say full sun, a lot say partial shade. Currently grown in a north facing front garden in acidic soil and thriving.

I might be being unrealistic wanting to do air layers of these when I’m so new, but I’m after some thicker material than my seedlings and nursery juniper! wasn’t even looking at the pieris originally till it caught my eye with the foliage colours.

Any help/suggestions/thoughts appreciated I may be barking up the wrong tree (or shrub!) for all I know.

 

[Paradox]

No idea how well these air layer

 

[Shibui]

Azalea strike and layer very easily. Any trunk or branch close to the soil will self layer so using layering techniques will only enhance that ability.
I haven't tested the upper limits of layering for either species but would hazard a guess there's no upper limit to trunk diameter. The real test will come when you separate the new rooted layer because a thicker trunk is likely to be feeding a lot more foliage with relatively few new roots.
The good news is that I've transplanted large azaleas with relatively few roots and they survive well so you should be optimistic about your layers surviving.

Best time and how long will vary from one place to another, the cultivar, your skill, how healthy and vigorous the parent plant is and lots more. I'd allow 6 months to a year though. Spring/Summer is generally a good time to layer because the plants are actively growing so root production is quicker.

Kanuma is widely used by bonsai growers with Azaleas but that's only really because Japanese growers use it and many of us love to follow the leader. Many others use a good potting soil mix successfully so Kanuma is by no means mandatory. I have a number of healthy Azalea bonsai here growing in the same standard bonsai mix I use for all the trees.
Azaleas do not tolerate alkaline soils. Most town water supplies are treated to be slightly alkaline to avoid pipe corrosion and lead poisoning. Long term use of town water can harm potted azaleas so most growers recommend an acidifying fertiliser to counteract the alkaline water. You'll need to check your water supply and what options are available in the UK.

No idea if Pieris layers easily or not. It takes very little time and cost to try so why not give it a go? Feel free to post the results so we'll all be better informed.

 

[ForeverRaynning]

Azalea strike and layer very easily. Any trunk or branch close to the soil will self layer so using layering techniques will only enhance that ability.
I haven't tested the upper limits of layering for either species but would hazard a guess there's no upper limit to trunk diameter. The real test will come when you separate the new rooted layer because a thicker trunk is likely to be feeding a lot more foliage with relatively few new roots.
The good news is that I've transplanted large azaleas with relatively few roots and they survive well so you should be optimistic about your layers surviving.

Best time and how long will vary from one place to another, the cultivar, your skill, how healthy and vigorous the parent plant is and lots more. I'd allow 6 months to a year though. Spring/Summer is generally a good time to layer because the plants are actively growing so root production is quicker.

Kanuma is widely used by bonsai growers with Azaleas but that's only really because Japanese growers use it and many of us love to follow the leader. Many others use a good potting soil mix successfully so Kanuma is by no means mandatory. I have a number of healthy Azalea bonsai here growing in the same standard bonsai mix I use for all the trees.
Azaleas do not tolerate alkaline soils. Most town water supplies are treated to be slightly alkaline to avoid pipe corrosion and lead poisoning. Long term use of town water can harm potted azaleas so most growers recommend an acidifying fertiliser to counteract the alkaline water. You'll need to check your water supply and what options are available in the UK.

No idea if Pieris layers easily or not. It takes very little time and cost to try so why not give it a go? Feel free to post the results so we'll all be better informed.

Thanks for the info, very helpful. Will definitely try both shrubs and see, will just have to use a larger amount of growing medium to make sure theres enough room for plenty of roots.

What best to use? I know sphagnum is the go-to but also seen some people say they use normal pots with other growing mediums in instead around the girdled part. I know they made plastic balls for air layering but those probably only come in small sizes. If Azalea will self layer, I wonder if a large pot with the same soil the main plant is in would work.

Any idea how wide a girdle to take? I know the most common problem airlayers face is the tree just bridging the gap but theres presumably an upper thickness limit as well where it’ll fail?

The shrubs are a good 20+ year old and grow really well when pruned back hard so hoping thats a good sign they’ll air layer fairly well.

Seen a thread from a good 10 year or so back saying it would be difficult to layer a big piece and get enough roots before the weather was too cold/frosts? This is all oit of my depth but would be nice to have some new material and don’t think my dad would let me dig up a full plant (theres a lovely white azalea out front as well but its a bit small)

 

[Shibui]

Moss is useful for layers because it is light and holds air and water but by no means the only option. Nor is wrapped balls. many successful layers using pots around the trunk/ branch to hold potting soil. Ground layers work well when the layer point is close to the ground. Simply mounding the soil up over the layer point is often enough.
Wrapped layers retain water better so great if you can't check regularly. Pots great if you can water every day.

A girdle cut around the width of the trunk/branch diameter is usually recommended as that usually prevents bridging but reality depends on species. Azalea are quite slow to callus so I'd be confident a narrower girdle would be OK but wide should still be OK.
Upper diameter limit will definitely depend on species. Age of the wood is probably more relevant than size but hard to gauge age so we look at diameter. Azalea root very easy so I have no doubt any size will root. I would certainly try any size.

Frost will depend on how cold the 'frost' gets. Down here and, I suspect, most of UK cold is relatively mild. Layers can stay on all winter if not enough roots by the end of Summer.
'Enough' roots is related to the amount of foliage above. Reducing the above parts can help the newly separated layer cope immediately after separation. having said that, I have frequently been amazed at how few roots a layer can survive on. Nothing stimulates a plant to grow more roots than need. Let's cross that bridge if and when we arrive.

 

[ForeverRaynning]

Been out and had a bit of a measure, looking at 4-5cm thick branches. The pieris at the very bottom is 10cm. Looking at twin trunks just for some interest being so new I don’t know what to look for so much. Pieris branches pretty straight and uninteresting. The bit of the azalea I have my eye on is right at the base, so could ground layer if i really wanted I suppose. Don’t THINK its a seperate trunk, must be a clump at the base under the soil? Otherwise I may be able to just seperate it from the rest of the shrub and dig it up on its own roots??

Hard to know what to look for, what would make a good trunk for plants like these. Or how to develop them after, but they’ll be good learning oppertunities.

 

[ForeverRaynning]

This is the azalea


Orange/at the base was my original plan? But the inverse taper was throwing me… then realised I could airlayer at that point (blue circled area) then get a nice wide base like I see in pictures online? Then two decent thickness trunks?

Only issue may be this

Unsure how easy it will be to extract the airlayer once its ready!

Pieris is proving hard to find a nice bit, plus how close the branches in the middle are to each other its finding part I can get to properly to girdle!


Only bit I can think of taking but those branches are a bit akward, may have to take the left off? But that’d be a big wound if I want to get rid of the taper (I THINK the left branch has been pruned back and just ends in more a clump of shoots so probably won’t twin trunk) :/ plus its that low down I don’t know if I can gridle it. The other pieris we have is the same in terms of nothing that looks much use (or branches being too crowded to get into). So may have to abandon that. Unsure if they’d make anything decent anyway, not really a common shrub to use. But would be nice to try :/

 

[ForeverRaynning]

Hmm. Thrown a picture into photoshop and tried to follow the trunks. Maybe I’ve been looking at the base too much and not looking high enough up. I think this may not be a good trunk pair? Suppose it depends where I cut them back to. Can azaleas be trunk chopped and developed further like deciduous?

This is the issue with me having no experience developing anything.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Thread 'The science of air-layering'

Apr 2, 2017

Because of the number of questions regarding air-layering on the site, I have attempted to pull together an overview of the science behind air-layering which will directly lead to a list of "best practices" and "frequently asked questions". I am going to try to keep the science really simple (because it gets extremely complicated very quickly) while at the same time ensure that everything I write is scientifically grounded.

Introduction
Air-layering as a way of propagating bonsai material that has some unique advantages. First, the material being layered is a genetic clone...

• Bonsai Nut
• Replies: 235
• Forum: Grafting, layering & propagating

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[Deep Sea Diver]

Hmm…

The first thing that came to mind was this is a rather large job for a first experience with azaleas

However, what the hey…

Cheers
DSD sends

 

[ForeverRaynning]

Hmm…

The first thing that came to mind was this is a rather large job for a first experience with azaleas

However, what the hey…

Cheers
DSD sends

Yeah, it is a big job. But I at least have a while to cram as much research into them as possible. I know they’re lime-hating so I have to be careful with the choice of substrate and firt. I know it will need careful overwintering once in a pot. Step one is performing the air layer successfully (but given what I’ve been told about azaleas that seems relatively straightforward), step two is keeping the separated plant alive and that's the biggest learning curve. Then I can start looking at development. So, I have time and a willingness to fall down research rabbitholes. Throw me in at the deep end!

But if I am being too ambitious, I may be better rethinking. I feel like it’ll be a good learning experience at the very least.

 

[roberthu]

I think getting them to root is fairly easy. However, the challenge is going to be the after care after separation considering the size of the trunks and the leaf mass on top to keep the tree rolling.