Will these wire scars go away? Liquidambar styraciflua and elm.
- Thread starter glacon
- Start date
Maiden69
Masterpiece
A quick search of LA shows a few places, Kimura, Fuji, Eden, Exotic Bonsai. A few hours away you have Boon's (I think close to SF), Maruyama. You can buy trees from online sellers, Bjorn, Ryan, Brent (Evergreen Garden Works), etc...
glacon
Yamadori
Thank you for the answer. I love that elm. And even if they would take it back, I would feel like I lost a part of the whole of the collection. I posted photos of most of it above. My sense is there is much I can learn from this site and forum. Appreciate all of your answers.
glacon
Yamadori
Any good resources to learn about re-growing branches? I am decent at maintaining the shape of my trees, not bad at wiring, but have never regrown a branch.
Maiden69
Masterpiece
glacon
Yamadori
As mentioned I posted photos of my collection. Can you tell from the photos if they do good work, or should I just stop buying from them?
Read Peter Tea’s blog.
He had a nice trident maple before he went to Japan. Once he was there, and saw the quality of the trees there, he realized that his trident back home was not as nice as he thought it was! So, upon his return, he realized that the only good part of his maple was his trunk, but his branches needed to be completely regrown! So, he cut them back, hard! And regrew them.
I think his web page is www.ptbonsai.com.
He had a nice trident maple before he went to Japan. Once he was there, and saw the quality of the trees there, he realized that his trident back home was not as nice as he thought it was! So, upon his return, he realized that the only good part of his maple was his trunk, but his branches needed to be completely regrown! So, he cut them back, hard! And regrew them.
I think his web page is www.ptbonsai.com.
badatusernames
Omono
I'd at least bring them back and say "hey, once I got them home I noticed all this wire scarring. TBH I wouldn't have bought them if I had noticed them before, but I'm curious as to your feedback and suggestions" and see the reaction. That's a lot of scarring and not a lot of trunk for $900 on a species that I don't think is typically that lofty of price.
I think your trees look nice and their reaction will be what determines if and how you shop there in the future. I would think that at point of sale for a cost like that someone should have noticed, or may be understanding if you got it home before you did. It's worth a shot, my general strategy is to just be nice and ask questions. It might be easy to get brushed off in a situation like this, but I just broke my phone and simply by continuing to be pleasant but confused as to why AppleCare wouldn't cover it (it should have, something with their system was wrong) they basically escalated it and sent me a new one at no cost.
Flies with honey and all that! Never hurts to ask if you aren't happy with it. Yes, you can re-grow branches, but for $900 I would be expecting... something else.
I think your trees look nice and their reaction will be what determines if and how you shop there in the future. I would think that at point of sale for a cost like that someone should have noticed, or may be understanding if you got it home before you did. It's worth a shot, my general strategy is to just be nice and ask questions. It might be easy to get brushed off in a situation like this, but I just broke my phone and simply by continuing to be pleasant but confused as to why AppleCare wouldn't cover it (it should have, something with their system was wrong) they basically escalated it and sent me a new one at no cost.
Flies with honey and all that! Never hurts to ask if you aren't happy with it. Yes, you can re-grow branches, but for $900 I would be expecting... something else.
glacon
Yamadori
I have spent around $22,000 there over the past couple of months. I've been shopping there for 6 years. I think they have ample reason to want to keep me as a customer, and I think as a good customer, a certain amount of accommodation is reasonable.
I do appreciate your perspective and advice and will go that route.
glacon
Yamadori
It is a bit much, a lot crazy, no doubt about it. FYI, I was able to return the liquidambar. I purchased a beautiful black pine for around the same price. I really wanted a second pine. It also has some wire marks, but I am less worried about it with a black pine, and happen to love the new tree. I want to thank everyone for their help and time today. I look forward to learning from this community and not buying anymore bonsai for a long, long time.
glacon
Yamadori
They make me happy and peaceful. I have an autoimmune disease so have had to really isolate during the past year. Bonsai and my dog have been my main source of enjoyment. They make me feel peaceful.
badatusernames
Omono
That's great, I'm glad it worked out. I almost mentioned that black pine would probably be what I would be starting to look at once I got to around that price point! I'm by no means an expert, I just know I got a relatively fat trunked liquidambar (which needs a ton of work and might NOT work, but still, I don't think they grow very slowly) for $50. Around here, $1,000 seems to be the price point of entry for more developed black pines.
Once you're able to due to your immune issue, I definitely echo Adair that getting some more education would be useful. That "peaceful" feeling you're talking about is one I find I get when working on the trees too - it's hard to stop myself and let them just grow! Plus, you do have some great stuff, and the long term upkeep will eventually become a part of it - you can hire folks to do it for you from time to time of course, but just something to think about so that they can remain as you enioy them, or even better.
For now, just enjoying them seems a worthy pursuit to me. I've been spending way too much time just sitting in front of my indoor plants, it's cold here so I think between the quarantining, the plants, and the light I have for them it's like a blast of brain chemicals. Bonkers year, but hopefully by summer things will start to ease up...
glacon
Yamadori
I was able to get my first shot of vaccine on Monday. While there are some crazy variants running around, I think I can be a little less restrictive in a a couple of months. I have had some of them for a couple of years, and I enjoy the upkeep quite a bit so far. My doctor says it'll help me live longer
badatusernames
Omono
I was able to get my first shot of vaccine on Monday. While there are some crazy variants running around, I think I can be a little less restrictive in a a couple of months. I have had some of them for a couple of years, and I enjoy the upkeep quite a bit so far. My doctor says it'll help me live longer
That's fantastic! Enjoy!
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
Prevention is far better than cure for wire marks. @Adair M is right that wire does not need to stay on as long as most of us seem to think. Taking wire off often takes longer than putting on so we tend to put that job off. Better to be disciplined and get on with it to prevent this sort of scarring.
In commercial operations it can be difficult to find the time. They may also have purchased these from other sources so sometimes deceased estates and growers cutting back larger collections where trees have been neglected so the wire marks are sometimes even beyond the control of the nursery. That does not excuse bad wire marks and I think prices should reflect faults as well as good points of any bonsai but, in the end, if they an sell trees at a price they would be foolish not to.
Also echo the idea of regrowing branches on many bonsai. We tend to develop structure and ramification too quickly and use shoots with long internodes for basic branching. While quick to get a 'bonsai' it eventually becomes obvious the tree will never be first class. I have had to bite the bullet and remove and regrow branches on most of my earlier tridents and JM. The first is really frightening an the years spent regrowing decent branches is frustrating but the result is worthwhile. Doing it right first time is way quicker and less stress however knowing the pitfalls and how to do it is something that appears experience alone can teach.
In commercial operations it can be difficult to find the time. They may also have purchased these from other sources so sometimes deceased estates and growers cutting back larger collections where trees have been neglected so the wire marks are sometimes even beyond the control of the nursery. That does not excuse bad wire marks and I think prices should reflect faults as well as good points of any bonsai but, in the end, if they an sell trees at a price they would be foolish not to.
Also echo the idea of regrowing branches on many bonsai. We tend to develop structure and ramification too quickly and use shoots with long internodes for basic branching. While quick to get a 'bonsai' it eventually becomes obvious the tree will never be first class. I have had to bite the bullet and remove and regrow branches on most of my earlier tridents and JM. The first is really frightening an the years spent regrowing decent branches is frustrating but the result is worthwhile. Doing it right first time is way quicker and less stress however knowing the pitfalls and how to do it is something that appears experience alone can teach.
parhamr
Omono
All told that’s a nice collection. I appreciate you being vulnerable and honest with us. It’s hard to do that in front of strangers on the internet! I am glad they bring you joy; it’s such a simple, positive thing.
I worry that folks might dogpile on you and I want to head that off.
I wouldn’t choose some of those trees and I wouldn’t pay that sort of money, but that’s not about judgement so much as we have different interests, approaches, and goals. (I’m just not into boxwoods or ficus!)
I’m confident that elm can outgrow the wire scars or grow even better replacement branches. Congrats on returning the liquidambar! That was the right call, even if it’s hard to tell somebody you’re disappointed with something after the fact.
glacon
Yamadori
I am not a huge boxwood or ficus fan either. I have gone very heavy on junipers, I just seem to love so many of them. I wanted to differentiate and really wanted one boxwood if I could find an interesting one (not that mine is that interesting) it's not a favorite. I really loved that ficus even though it was a pre-bonsai when I bought it. I have enjoyed wiring it and do really like it. It was quite a bit cheaper than some of these trees we're talking about. The two attached are my favorites. I actually think that pine was a bit of a steal. I love it. It is not the one I picked up today. The juniper was a decent chunk of change.
Attachments
parhamr
Omono
Thanks for sharing! That truly is a beautiful juniper.
The pine has wonderful movement and deadwood, but I’m worried about its needle color. I don’t know the species, cultivar, or even what it’s like to grow them in your climate but it looks like some combination of too little iron present, a pH problem impacting nutrient uptake, or overwatering. If I’m off base then please disregard, but I’m guessing it could benefit from a little checkup by somebody knowledgeable.
Cheers and welcome to the nut forum!
