Sweetgum / Liquidambar Thread

[luvinthemountains]

I repotted mine last week, and they didn’t skip a beat. No root pruning, just combed them out and potted them up into larger containers. @Zach Smith recommends repotting in May.

Looking good, Brian! I have a couple of seedlings coming from an eBay seller. Now I see your group of three, I am kind of kicking myself that I didn't go in for one more. I might choose to plant a parent/child style group, or I might plant them separately. If I do plant them alone, I think I will start twisting one of them with wire, and use the other for a root-over-rock. With these being aggressive rooters do you think I can safely just tie it directly onto the rock, or should I still grow some longer roots in a deep container first and add the rock later?

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Looking good, Brian! I have a couple of seedlings coming from an eBay seller. Now I see your group of three, I am kind of kicking myself that I didn't go in for one more. I might choose to plant a parent/child style group, or I might plant them separately. If I do plant them alone, I think I will start twisting one of them with wire, and use the other for a root-over-rock. With these being aggressive rooters do you think I can safely just tie it directly onto the rock, or should I still grow some longer roots in a deep container first and add the rock later?

If the roots are long enough, I’d probably do it when you receive it as opposed to waiting until the roots are bigger when they’ll be less compliant. If May is the right time to repot, you’re in the window.

 

[Firstflush]

My micro forest coming along. Trees may be a little too equidistant.
Might do a tiny bit of defoliation to let the sun in the middle canopy to help inner branches thrive.

 

[BonsaiNaga13]

Whenever I collect seedlings around this time I still cut the tap root and by autumn they're rooted through the pot I chose for them. My issue with sweetgum is they get potbound fast and seem to die in early spring.

 

[Joe Dupre']

This is the second year for this collected sweet gum. They seem to grow plenty fast and backbud readily. Internode length has to be controlled through regular pruning. No dead branches YET. At collection, the trunk up to almost the first branch was below ground level and almost horizontal. Last year, that part of the trunk looked different than the upper part. This year it weathered to a better appearance. I just pruned several bigger leaves and a couple of long shoots today. I'm letting it grow out a bit while keeping an eye on the internode length. The big leaves need to be constantly pruned to keep new, smaller ones coming. All in all, I would say I like this species.

 

[luvinthemountains]

My micro forest coming along. Trees may be a little too equidistant

Liked mainly just for using "equidistant" in a sentence.

 

[Corrado]

Liked mainly just for using "equidistant" in a sentence.

heres mine. Ive been working on the American Sweetgum tree for 39 years from a seedling . Last one is a Oriental Swetgum which has smaller and tighter growth .

 

[TN_Jim]

Any updates here? I collected a swervy one of them today with some fence - grown through it. Not a significant amount of feeder roots but not terrible.

Any post collection aftercare best practice thoughts? Shade or sun for a while..?

Where’s the sweetgums?

 

[Joe Dupre']

Mine looks about the same as 1 year ago in the photo a few posts back. It's gotten a bit more dense and has smaller leaves. Large leaves still have to be pruned often to make way for smaller leaves. I pruned 8-10 leaves off just today. Average leaf is about 1 1/2" in diameter................quite a difference from a normal tree.

Oh, the leaves tend to form a clump on the ends of the branches. Pruning does help to backbud closer to the trunk.

 

[badatusernames]

Any updates here? I collected a swervy one of them today with some fence - grown through it. Not a significant amount of feeder roots but not terrible.

Any post collection aftercare best practice thoughts? Shade or sun for a while..?

Where’s the sweetgums?

Mine didn’t wake up last year - I took a seedling from my yard when building my benches though and it seems to be coming. Far better protection this year, and the knowledge to harass my trees less well instilled

https://imgur.com/b6PsLz8

 

[TN_Jim]

Mine looks about the same as 1 year ago in the photo a few posts back. It's gotten a bit more dense and has smaller leaves. Large leaves still have to be pruned often to make way for smaller leaves. I pruned 8-10 leaves off just today. Average leaf is about 1 1/2" in diameter................quite a difference from a normal tree.

Oh, the leaves tend to form a clump on the ends of the branches. Pruning does help to backbud closer to the trunk.

View attachment 434231

Good things. I like the aggressive nature I’m hearing of this species. I’ve been watching them a bit and see this clumping of leaves at tips, looks almost oak-like. Is a weird back-budding Pando thing.. Wranglin’ to be had, hopeful. Looking keen, you gonna let that leader run fat? That’s a nice pot too

This one I got yesterday, I ended up putting in a shadier spot. Went pretty hard on the roots. Collecting a tree in May that’s not an elm is something new to me -almost thought to leave it till late winter though heeding Zach and BVF etc…
It’s not wilting this evening, should put into the sun?? Perhaps?

Thing collected is almost too wonky after seeing them in the wild, especially with some fence in it.. leave it in!!? It has some wings, for what that’s worth. I didn’t make these chops, was in a tangle of poison ivy, yeesh.

 

[Joe Dupre']

Good things. I like the aggressive nature I’m hearing of this species. I’ve been watching them a bit and see this clumping of leaves at tips, looks almost oak-like. Is a weird back-budding Pando thing.. Wranglin’ to be had, hopeful. Looking keen, you gonna let that leader run fat? That’s a nice pot too

This one I got yesterday, I ended up putting in a shadier spot. Went pretty hard on the roots. Collecting a tree in May that’s not an elm is something new to me -almost thought to leave it till late winter though heeding Zach and BVF etc…
It’s not wilting this evening, should put into the sun?? Perhaps?

Thing collected is almost too wonky after seeing them in the wild, especially with some fence in it.. leave it in!!? It has some wings, for what that’s worth. I didn’t make these chops, was in a tangle of poison ivy, yeesh.



View attachment 434380View attachment 434381View attachment 434382

Good movement. The left trunk is pretty chunky. Maybe cut it off and get pretty good taper with the remaining trunk???? The fence tells a story, for sure.

Thanks for the compliment. Yes, I'm letting the leader run. The leader is actually not as vigorous as it was the first year. So, maybe this species is not as top dominant as some other species I have.

The pot is a homemade concrete creation painted with $1.00 Walmart acrylic.

 

[badatusernames]

Good movement. The left trunk is pretty chunky. Maybe cut it off and get pretty good taper with the remaining trunk???? The fence tells a story, for sure.

Thanks for the compliment. Yes, I'm letting the leader run. The leader is actually not as vigorous as it was the first year. So, maybe this species is not as top dominant as some other species I have.

The pot is a homemade concrete creation painted with $1.00 Walmart acrylic.

I agree! I mean, i wouldn’t ever see myself disagreeing with someone like Joe, but that would really make cool taper, and the fence bit could make for a really interesting Nick Lenz-y composition, leaning into that for a sort of industrial bonsai would be a really interesting statement.

I’m still more of a paint-by-numbers guy to try to drill in “the rules” but I could see myself pursuing more once I’m more comfortable. That’s why I keep sticking with Japanese pots, too, I don’t have enough of an eye just yet for deviations.

Liquidambar would be a great choice too I think, not uncommon to see growing in and around things like that.

I wonder if one could pour asphalt around the base of a tree and just leave it somehow, eventually creating something impressive as it grows like a landscape tree taking over a city sidewalk…

 

[TN_Jim]

Good movement. The left trunk is pretty chunky. Maybe cut it off and get pretty good taper with the remaining trunk???? The fence tells a story, for sure.

Thanks for the compliment. Yes, I'm letting the leader run. The leader is actually not as vigorous as it was the first year. So, maybe this species is not as top dominant as some other species I have.

The pot is a homemade concrete creation painted with $1.00 Walmart acrylic.

$1.28 concrete… yeesh holmes, with the thinness, good on ya, concrete and mortar is good, excellent example

lack of apical dominance makes sense. feel I’m surrounded by these sweetgums now, all trying to propagate themselves in runner clusters and backbudding like shrubs, is their aggressive strength in numbers and lower resilience related to why good to collect in May??

I think of boxwood and crape myrtle as the aggressive ones in the warm, as in summer bare root, perhaps Liquidambar is where these meet in the middle of spring??.was in the witch hazel family Hamamelieaceae, I guess it’s in Altingiaceae now, what the hell is that? How dare they!!? Named after a Dutch general..fuck on

Willem Arnold Alting??? <-why, botany, plants, anything??​

so, luckily this one collected isn’t wilting. look at it it makes ya almost mad, mad, or me at least…..I think I partially attribute this madness to listening to this Dan Robinson interview..The Bonsai Time Podcast #1.. good grief, hit me, these trees that look like a bonsai (I’ve made some trying for trees) have heard so many times, resonated in a different way.. luckily this one I nabbed still has leaves, thanks to you sweetgum folks. looking forward to chasing this rascal. dang curve corkscrew….don’t look like trees around me…is literati?? Sweetgums in the fence..leave it in I suppose

 

[TN_Jim]

Good movement. The left trunk is pretty chunky. Maybe cut it off and get pretty good taper with the remaining trunk???? The fence tells a story, for sure.

Thanks for the compliment. Yes, I'm letting the leader run. The leader is actually not as vigorous as it was the first year. So, maybe this species is not as top dominant as some other species I have.

The pot is a homemade concrete creation painted with $1.00 Walmart acrylic.

$1.28 concrete… yeesh holmes, with the thinness, good on ya, concrete and mortar is good, excellent example

lack of apical dominance makes sense. feel I’m surrounded by these sweetgums now, all trying to propagate themselves in runner clusters and backbudding like shrubs, is their aggressive strength in numbers and lower resilience related to why good to collect in May??

I think of boxwood and crape myrtle as the aggressive ones in the warm, as in summer bare root, perhaps Liquidambar is where these meet in the middle of spring??.was in the witch hazel family Hamamelieaceae, I guess it’s in Altingiaceae now, what the hell is that? How dare they!!? Named after a Dutch general..fuck on

Willem Arnold Alting??? <-why, botany, plants, anything??​

so, luckily this one collected isn’t wilting. look at it it makes ya almost mad, mad, or me at least…..I think I partially attribute this madness to listening to this Dan Robinson interview..The Bonsai Time Podcast #1.. good grief, hit me, these trees that look like a bonsai (I’ve made some trying for trees) have heard so many times, resonated in a different way.. luckily this one I nabbed still has leaves, thanks to you sweetgum folks. looking forward to chasing this rascal. dang curve corkscrew….don’t look like trees around me…is literati?? Sweetgums in the fence..leave it in I suppose

 

[TN_Jim]

 

[Cmd5235]

$1.28 concrete… yeesh holmes, with the thinness, good on ya, concrete and mortar is good, excellent example

lack of apical dominance makes sense. feel I’m surrounded by these sweetgums now, all trying to propagate themselves in runner clusters and backbudding like shrubs, is their aggressive strength in numbers and lower resilience related to why good to collect in May??

I think of boxwood and crape myrtle as the aggressive ones in the warm, as in summer bare root, perhaps Liquidambar is where these meet in the middle of spring??.was in the witch hazel family Hamamelieaceae, I guess it’s in Altingiaceae now, what the hell is that? How dare they!!? Named after a Dutch general..fuck on

Willem Arnold Alting??? <-why, botany, plants, anything??​

so, luckily this one collected isn’t wilting. look at it it makes ya almost mad, mad, or me at least…..I think I partially attribute this madness to listening to this Dan Robinson interview..The Bonsai Time Podcast #1.. good grief, hit me, these trees that look like a bonsai (I’ve made some trying for trees) have heard so many times, resonated in a different way.. luckily this one I nabbed still has leaves, thanks to you sweetgum folks. looking forward to chasing this rascal. dang curve corkscrew….don’t look like trees around me…is literati?? Sweetgums in the fence..leave it in I suppose

Hey, so I've got a lot of decent sized sweetgum. I do find them to be apically dominant, sometimes to a fault. They do throw out multiple buds on the end of each branch, and you have to stay on top of them to reduce it to just one. That being said, you can't prune the branch tip buds in the winter- I've found that when you hard prune the end of the branch, the tree will drop it. By keeping at least one but, it will live- reminds me of American Beech. You can do it during the growing season with caution, I haven't had an issue with branch loss yet during the spring/summer.

I love liquidambar. They have quirks, they have long internodes, but man can they develop cool bark and beautiful fall color. They're also hardy- most of mine were collected as stumps with little to no roots, and I only lost one that didn't root out.

 

[Cajunrider]

I'll share a few comments/observations about developing sweetgums. These are in no particular order.

1. I've had my best success collecting them in May rather than late winter. I don't know why, but I don't argue with success.
2. They do not come out of the ground with any fine roots, but as with the other deciduous trees I've worked with it doesn't matter. They will produce a nice fibrous root system in a couple of years.
3. Watch your first internode when developing branches - if the shoot extends too strongly/quickly you're likely to have your first node too far out on the branch, and that is tough to correct.
4. Once you have your basic branches established, constant pinching of new growth is the ticket to building ramification and keeping leaf size as small as possible. Do not remove terminal buds in winter, as this can cause the entire branch to die (I mention this because I've read that you should remove terminal buds on Oriental sweetgum).
5. Sweetgums will drop branches on occasion and without warning. But they also backbud readily, so it's usually easy to adjust your design to the tree's idea of what it wants to do.
6. Their roots are sensitive to summer heat on ceramic pots, so be prepared to shade your pots by May in the South.

That's all I can think of for now.

Great go-by advice for me. Thanks Zach!

 

[TN_Jim]

that sweetgum I collected in may looks like garbage, really messing with my success stats…suppose doing all the right things…what am I doing or did wrong??

unless something turns around, post standard collection time ideas go back to crape, boxwood, privet…..not sweetgum ideal, not May

still pending, staying alive

 

[TN_Jim]

Hey, so I've got a lot of decent sized sweetgum. I do find them to be apically dominant, sometimes to a fault. They do throw out multiple buds on the end of each branch, and you have to stay on top of them to reduce it to just one. That being said, you can't prune the branch tip buds in the winter- I've found that when you hard prune the end of the branch, the tree will drop it. By keeping at least one but, it will live- reminds me of American Beech. You can do it during the growing season with caution, I haven't had an issue with branch loss yet during the spring/summer.

I love liquidambar. They have quirks, they have long internodes, but man can they develop cool bark and beautiful fall color. They're also hardy- most of mine were collected as stumps with little to no roots, and I only lost one that didn't root out.

Did you collect them in May?