nontraditional and postmodern bonsai

[tantric]

If you were serious you would approach this community with a humble heart not a condescending attitude that "I know more than you will ever know". There is nothing more sad than someone who comes into a place like this and refuses to learn anything but instead tries to teach every body how he thinks it should be. The truth is you cannot possible know anything significant if you have not experienced it yourself. Again: To imagine an idea without the attempt to make it happen is fantasy. I don't want to be privy to your fantasy. You want to learn bonsai as it is; then ask and shut your boasting, condescending, holier-than-thou, prideful, boasting, arrogant and offensive mouth and listen.

so, i went back and reread the thread, as i've been told i have a gift for annoying net mod-gods. i didn't do this - we were having a pie in the sky discussion of aesthetics when you the great bonsai masters of this community thread crapped:

Stupidism!

The "tree" would have a branch growing out of his ass if I had my way. Make it look like a rocket plume. The F.T.D. man could look even more stupid. I don't like Penelope either but that's me and she is the best one out of the bunch. Something like that could actually happen in nature. All of the rest are just plain ludicrous.

Nah. We're just a pimple on an elephants ass. We've only been here for a mere speck of time. We think we own and shape the world but we dont. Pretty soon something will wipe all of us out and things will start over. It's happened before and will again. It was fish first. Then the dinosaurs. Now it's the mammals turn. My guess the next things to rule the earth will be insects. They need their turn. Dung beetles in charge!

thread crapping v. Thread crapping occurs when a person comes into a thread and posts something contrary to the spirit/intent of the thread, often derailing the discussion or turning it into an argument.
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my mistake was paying attention to the threadcrapping, but i'm new here, so i took the bait. after this i start to go on about wabi-sabi, zen, etc. and get a bit off, but it shouldn't be anything y'all don't already know. i had this idea that by showing my familiarity with other forms of classical japanese art, i could demonstrate some kind of credentials. another mistake, never try to prove yourself.

Dude, for a Buddhist, you are pretty aggressive and confrontational. Not to mention pretty clueless about bonsai. We don't care if you're using crappy dirty pots from Home Depot.

that's offensive, but it took me a second to peg exactly how. it's classic Orientalism, and a backhanded compliment - i'm not meeting the stereotype of the reserved, polite asian/buddhist. i'll take it - but *please* don't tell me how to live my religion. do you go up to christians and say, "Dude, for a Christian, you're pretty rational and logical"?

shut your boasting, condescending, holier-than-thou, prideful, boasting, arrogant and offensive mouth

how do you hear this in my polite lowercase text? you may have heard it, but i didn't write it - except a bit about the pots. if the above is your response to me telling you your bonsai pot is tacky, dude, valium. you can show me - quote it back, if you like.

RE: the pots

i've decided to go out and collect nice pots, probably from yard sales and thrift stores. my poor little pot is *not* some masterpiece of zen, it wasn't aged deliberately and thus is only 'acceptable' in my own view. when i have pics, we can holler and whatever about those in a new thread.

 

[tantric]

See there you go being pedantic condescending and in a way your own version of esoteric understanding. Do you know Pendejo.

this is going to get me called out again, but for yokai fans, i used to do roleplaying games and for halloween one year i wrote up some of the yokai and made a PDF. even if you don't know the game, it's visually appealing and informative: yokaiPDF http://tinyurl.com/tantricYokai

 

[M. Frary]

thread crapping v. Thread crapping occurs when a person comes into a thread and posts something contrary to the spirit/intent of the thread, often derailing the discussion or turning it into an argument.

That's me all the way. And Rockm. And I guess Vance.
But the problem you see,is the whole thread is crap anyway.
Grow a tree over a brick. Who cares? Grow one over or on or in something. At least you will be growing a tree.
What garage sales can you find bonsai pots?
Oh man! There I go again! Thread crapping.
Hahahahahahahaha!

 

[jk_lewis]

What garage sales can you find bonsai pots?

Actually, I've found two in garage sales. My son found me another. Of course they all were cheap-o Chinese high-glaze pots that I wouldn't dare keep outside for a winter.

 

[Vance Wood]

Actually, I've found two in garage sales. My son found me another. Of course they all were cheap-o Chinese high-glaze pots that I wouldn't dare keep outside for a winter.

You mean like the one our zen master was showing us earlier?

 

[michaelj]

I know I am probably going to regret posting this because I was told by someone with whom I shared it, pre-posting, it was going to go over the heads of those who need to understand it.

Saying we don't understand your meaning is almost a demeaning as telling us that we don't know what the H we are doing.

It's not really fair to be imparting both of these takes in the same thread.

 

[Vance Wood]

Spoken by another authority of questionable credibility. A member here since 2012 but only 149 posts. I think I have posted that many this week, not that that makes a difference but it does show who is involved.

 

[Giga]

Fun thread..... I ate a bowl of popcorn reading this one!

 

[Vance Wood]

I'm truly glad someone had fun, as for me I have come to find that threads like this are no longer enjoyable or productive so I am leaving this thread to die it's own painful death. It is obvious to me we are dealing with a troll and no matter what you say; profound, stupid insightful or profane, it is not going to make a bit of difference to this guy. He is either so set in his opinion of himself that he can conceive of nothing else, or he's just jerking us bonsai dorks around and has us chasing chickens.

 

[rockm]

"that's offensive, but it took me a second to peg exactly how. it's classic Orientalism, and a backhanded compliment"

No, it's not any of those things really, except the offensive part, which I can't really control and is completely up to you. I just know a few Buddhists and they aren't obnoxious at all.

"i'm not meeting the stereotype of the reserved, polite asian/buddhist. i'll take it - but *please* don't tell me how to live my religion. do you go up to christians and say, "Dude, for a Christian, you're pretty rational and logical"?

Wow. What's Buddhism have to say about hypocrisy?

"i've decided to go out and collect nice pots, probably from yard sales and thrift stores"

good luck with that. The pots you will wind up (if you can find an actual bonsai pots with any regularity) shopping at those places can kill your crappy trees. If you didn't have your head so far up your posterior and took some time to actually understand bonsai, you'd discover that sometimes cheapo, mass production pots (which is what you're going to run across in thrift stores and flea markets) can actually kill your trees because they don't drain very well, if at all.

 

[Lazylightningny]

This thread must die

 

[Cypress187]

picView attachment 75827

I like the skull very much, only the root should grow out of his eye or something (or more close to the sculpture).

 

[michaelj]

Spoken by another authority of questionable credibility. A member here since 2012 but only 149 posts. I think I have posted that many this week, not that that makes a difference but it does show who is involved.

Post count smack? Seriously? Isn't that sort of thing supposed to come only from 15 year old Internet tough guys? If you think my comment was unreasonable, call me out on the merits of what I said; how much time I spend posting in this forum doesn't really make what I say any more or less true.

That's me all the way. And Rockm. And I guess Vance.
But the problem you see,is the whole thread is crap anyway.
Grow a tree over a brick. Who cares? Grow one over or on or in something. At least you will be growing a tree.

Yes, and if that's how you feel, this thread really isn't for you. Why bother even clicking on it?

People who only like bonsai that follows certain standards and rules won't like alternative non-traditional bonsai. And that's fine. But, really, all of these preferences are subjective, including your preference to traditional bonsai rules. I'll bet a lot of self-identified traditionalists would look at outstanding penjing styled by masters trained in the Yangzhou School or the Sichuan School and think them to be ugly crap. And I don't like all of it, either, just like I don't like some of these non-traditional trees. But wanting every tree that anyone sees, shares or shows to fit into the traditional Japanese styles, I think that's boring. I love traditional Japanese bonsai and I'm working hard to develop good trees trained in that manner, but I also like seeing more than just traditional Japanese bonsai. I like penjing. I like hòn non bô, and saikei, and Walter Pall's fairytale style trees, and oddities like Hobbit holes and root-over-skull and Nick Lenz trees and maples in a hedge and all these other things that some people think suck. And that is also fine.

So all y'all who don't like this sort of thing, why not just leave the thread to the people who are interested in it? You'll be happier, and so will we.

 

[amcoffeegirl]

O

maples in a hedge

ooooh I love maples in a hedge

 

[M. Frary]

You'll be happier, and so will we.

But.... I am happy.
I have an old hard hat laying around somewhere. And a poison ivy vine..... hmmm.
I can just about picture this masterpiece coming together and becoming the showstopper I've always wanted.
What color hard hat goes with poison ivy?

 

[sorce]

But.... I am happy.
I have an old hard hat laying around somewhere. And a poison ivy vine..... hmmm.
I can just about picture this masterpiece coming together and becoming the showstopper I've always wanted.
What color hard hat goes with poison ivy?

I don't know if you're serious but I like it. Though , you were correct in stupidism.

Fun thread..... I ate a bowl of popcorn reading this one!

I took a shot, a long shot. Does that make me a thread Crapper.?

Watch this next easy to understand post fly over heads.
Why?
I've presented myself as a Crapper before, so nothing I say can be valid ever again.!

Sorce

 

[sorce]

YOU are a Bonsai ARTIST when humans care enough about your art to keep it cared for.

Goshin, Penelope, the fact that these will be cared for and RESPECTED enough to be kept and remembered makes this ART.

However, any tree on Penelope and she will still be Penelope, so is this Bonsai Art? I say no.

Goshin? If you change anything, it will no longer be what it was. That is Bonsai Art.

So Penelope will last. But does it matter?

Finding the next shiny thing to put a tree on is like a remix artist. A fad.
Puffy Combs will be forgotten, Tupac Shakur will not.

Sorce

 

[sorce]

May I add, we have no bonsai artists on this forum. Only practitioners.

And few of us will ever become ARTISTS.

Sorce

 

[sorce]

Who originally sculted the Penelope statue?
Do they get royalties every time that gets sold?

Sorce

 

[M. Frary]

I don't know if you're serious but I like it

What? Me serious about something so ludicrous as plantin a tree on a brick?