New apple tree

[Deep Sea Diver]

Apple and crab apple trunks grow like ever expanding cylinders with out outside interference.

The best apple bonsai I saw to date was field grown and every year run over by a riding lawnmower. Once dug up the same process was used to grow out the trunk and branches.

So if incredible character and taper is what you want, that’s what your process is going to be.

Here’s a thread of a crabapple project I’ve been working on for a couple years that might show this better than words can.

Thread 'Crab Apple Wars - Creating a Craggy Crab Apple Forest…'

Nov 16, 2023

Four years ago @Mike Hennigan sent over some Crab Apple seedlings he’d sprouted from trees in Ithaca NY. We were excited as this would be the second forest experiment here

Spindly Sticks in a Pot!

In March 2020 the seedlings arrived from Mike. We promptly planted these in a large training oval, with many holes bored into the bottom. (Holes both for wire and for PacNW drainage.)

The result was the usual bunch of sticks jammed into a pot, with a bit of wire to give a few of the trees a little movement, slight differences in girth. A frequent sight on the BN Forum. Yet...

• Deep Sea Diver
• aged bonsai clip and grow crab apple crab apple forest craggy forest bonsai
• Replies: 19
• Forum: Fruiting

• 

Best
DSD sends

 

[bonsai-max]

Apple and crab apple trunks grow like ever expanding cylinders with out outside interference.

The best apple bonsai I saw to date was field grown and every year run over by a riding lawnmower. Once dug up the same process was used to grow out the trunk and branches.

So if incredible character and taper is what you want, that’s what your process is going to be.

Here’s a thread of a crabapple project I’ve been working on for a couple years that might show this better than words can.

Mhhh but now is late to do big cuts on the trunk or not ? This is why I was thinking to cut where the red line is. And for the branches ?

 

[Wulfskaar]

I don't know about the timing of the chop, but I love the plan! Cool tree.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Agree, if you do not want to trunk chop lower, the red cut will do.

Once finished, choose the best placed of the three new top branches. Wire one up, one sideways and remove the other.

Cut branches as needed in an appropriate place to foster taper and movement.

We cut the crabs/apples and cherries in winter frequently. Just spray wound with alcohol and seal.

Best
DSD sends

 

[bonsai-max]

Agree, if you do not want to trunk chop lower, the red cut will do.

Once finished, choose the best placed of the three new top branches. Wire one up, one sideways and remove the other.

Cut branches as needed in an appropriate place to foster taper and movement.

We cut the crabs/apples and cherries in winter frequently. Just spray wound with alcohol and seal.

Best
DSD sends

Ok, something like this, or if you have other point of view it's always very welcome. And for the first long branch, I leave it longer last year to make diameter.

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

From the images, this is what might work well. Many of the outward part of the branches are excess to good design. The job , as I see it from the image is primary prune then clip and grow.

Might make big cut and preliminary cuts now. In Jan/Feb as winter closes and epicormic buds pop out inward of those cuts, make a better choice.

However, you are on scene and there is no better place to be when choosing!



Best
DSD sends

 

[bonsai-max]

Might make big cut and preliminary cuts now. In Jan/Feb as winter closes and epicormic buds pop out inward of those cuts, make a better choice.

Ok I will do it, honestly with your advices my pines are much better and you have literally saved them, so lets go, and you have much more experience than me.
I hope that the new apex will bent easily, because it is quite hard to move and I have fear to broke it .
About the yellow cut on the first branch, why the colour is different , yellow instead of red ? Because of different timing of cut ?

Thank you so much

 

[bonsai-max]

For the big cut is better a flat cut or a concave cut ?
I both cases I will cover with japanese paste

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

For the big cut is better a flat cut or a concave cut ?
I both cases I will cover with japanese paste

Saw it off if possible.

Ok I will do it, honestly with your advices my pines are much better and you have literally saved them, so lets go, and you have much more experience than me.
I hope that the new apex will bent easily, because it is quite hard to move and I have fear to broke it .
About the yellow cut on the first branch, why the colour is different , yellow instead of red ? Because of different timing of cut ?

Thank you so much

Thank you very much Max! Glad to see your trees are doing better.

First - timing of cuts. It is best to do the big cuts during a spell of clear winter weather. imho getting moisture on a non conifer cut is never a good idea. For cuts larger than 2cm it’s best to use alcohol first, then cut putty. (For smaller ones can use alcohol then cut paste.) Please ensure alcohol dries prior to applying either.

On branches - there is are two ways of thinking. First make the cuts all at the same time as the big cut. Most folks do this to save time.

If one has a bit more time. Preliminary cuts, short of the actual intended cut areas early in winter, then wait for the January/February period when the epicormic buds begin to show. ( Again during a clear cold spell.) Then use these to inform the final cuts.

The latter procedure has the advantage of showing exactly where the bud placement is before pruning. It’s my opinion this will also save more energy since energy isn’t expended in pushing buds in the areas already pruned off.

Anyways just my thoughts.

Happy Samichaus!
DSD sends

 

[bonsai-max]

Thanks to you....

Saw it off if possible.

It's a bit complicate with the angle but with the japanese saw should be possible

For cuts larger than 2cm it’s best to use alcohol first, then cut putty. (For smaller ones can use alcohol then cut paste.) Please ensure alcohol dries prior to applying either.

Putty is like this one ? or the japanese hard one ?

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Do your best

Sorry the words are similar.

Your image shows cut paste, similar to the Japanese version


Cut putty is as you mentioned later. This one is used for deciduous trees. The green top one (not shown) is for conifers and azaleas.


Best
DSD Sends

 

[bonsai-max]

Cut putty is as you mentioned later. This one is used for deciduous trees. The green top one (not shown) is for conifers and azaleas.

Oh now understand the difference
... I have the conifers one, may I use it or I need to buy the deciduous one ?

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Don’t see why not.

The only differences I could figure out was the green top one has fungicide in it which the white doesn’t and the colors are different. There may be more to it than that, but have used these interchangeably in a pinch with no apparent difference.

Cheers
DAD sends

 

[bonsai-max]

The only differences I could figure out was the green top one has fungicide in it which the white doesn’t and the colors are different. There may be more to it than that, but have used these interchangeably in a pinch with no apparent difference.

Thank you....

 

[bonsai-max]

I did the big cut, make flat with the saw and refined with the wood tool, then covered with Japanese putty.
Still can't figure out why the picture go always 90° on the right...

 

[Deep Sea Diver]

Greetings!

Here is my perspective on this tree. Please refer to the image below. Again, your call.



#1 this branch is ok where it is for now. The goal for this branch and all others is to create shortish sections to create taper with frequent angle changes, side to side, up and diagonal up or down. Promoting back budding, choosing a well placed bud to grow, coupled with frequent clipping and grow out, supplemented by small amounts of wire will do this.

That said, apple trees can be very vigorous in spring and beyond. One way to help slow down the large internode length this causes is to withhold a lot of fertilizer until later summer, then give moderate amounts going into fall. Coupled with clip and growth this should give you some nice backbudding in spring and early summer.

Another way is to cut off the initial growth and grow out the second flush. You have to really know your tree to do this one though…

#2 and #5. From the images sent, these are both on the same horizontal plane. One should be removed. Not sure which to tell you. My impression is #5 would a good choice. It already has some good movement. The downside on leaving #2 is the fat terminal reddish section on the left has no taper and likely should be pruned. If there is a good set of backbuds going in a similar path, would chop off the fat section.

#3 & #4. Look fine right now. Check these branches from above and ensure they are not on the same vertical plane as the remaining branches below. Be sure these do not shoot out big, long and fat in the spring. If they do, chop these back soon. One can usually be assured backbuds will occur in the apex of apples.

#7 From your images, it looks like this would be a well placed replacement for #5.

# 6. Not sure this is needed. However, grow out early on just in case.

Again please do let any branches push out log, fat and straight. Aim to have each section should be smaller in diameter. Likely one would cut back from 2-3 times a year.

This will require patience and vigilance, which it seems you have been showing.

Cheers
DSD sends

 

[bonsai-max]

Hi, thank you for your time, so for short internode no fertilize until late summer or just a little bit ?
I am thinking to keep the n 5 because the first branch is on the opposite side, otherwise with the n 2 both are on the same side, make sense for you ?
I will post a close up picture af the branches....
6 and 7 I will let them grow and we will decide later.
3 and 4, the 4th is slightly higher than the 4th one....