Alex DeRuiter
Chumono
Not all straight maples are ugly -- especially twins:
Maples - tips & advice
- Thread starter Paulpash
- Start date
MACH5
Imperial Masterpiece
Yes but... The big difference here Alex is that your beautiful example is straight from top to bottom. The maple in question has a very straight trunk with the top portion with movement creating a disjointed effect. You either give movement to the trunk (which I would personally do) or as suggested chop it down to create a top that's more harmonious with the rest of the tree.
gergwebber
Shohin
I just re-read this and can assume you will not be chopping and are happy with the trunk, and just after layering, perhaps there is a good radial spread hiding in the moss? Do you have a pic of it at separation?
I don't think you have to worry about the trunk too much, it is a great tree in my opinion, but if you were to consider chopping why not layer it off? I bet you could do a bit of bending and get it better but you asked about branches in the first place.
as for branches, you could defoliate and hope for good back budding.
or... and I like this option a bit more:
let it grow out un trimmed next year and approach graft the long tips.
this way, you get good branch angles, exact placement, a chance to pick the best front, and a season of vigorous growth.
post some more angle pics and let the guys here make virts
gergwebber
Shohin
#1 a copy to use as a blank
#2 same trunk lines + angle change and branches wired down/grown out
you could do a little but gain a lot with this tree.
#2 same trunk lines + angle change and branches wired down/grown out
you could do a little but gain a lot with this tree.
Paulpash
Masterpiece
The air layer was taken 5 years ago and has been sitting in my back bench in the same Akadama. It's time to repot it but I ran out of time today. I did have time to scrape back some of the muddy akadama (it's broken down and does not drain very well at all) so i hope you can see some of the root spread. I'll take a better one when it's in new soil & the light has improved.
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Paulpash
Masterpiece
Pic 1 - trunk angled as suggested - any better?
pic 2 - scars - someone mentioned 'cleaning them up'. Can you add more details to this please? What do you mean and how do you clean them up?
pic 3 soil brushed / lightly raked back. You might be just able to pick out the roots. Also note that the stub has now been routered off and cut putty applied.
pic 2 - scars - someone mentioned 'cleaning them up'. Can you add more details to this please? What do you mean and how do you clean them up?
pic 3 soil brushed / lightly raked back. You might be just able to pick out the roots. Also note that the stub has now been routered off and cut putty applied.
gergwebber
Shohin
Super Brian (BVF) has a good post on his blog here: http://nebaribonsai.wordpress.com/2012/05/04/more-spring-cleaning-2/ (edit: about scar healing/cleaning)
I don't know about the angle yet. it was just a thought. sometimes it is best in art generally to do as little as possible in the face of uncertainty. Often the key to a good design hinges in the things the designer chooses not to do
anyway, with those nice branches pulled down, and the side trunk pulled down, I think the slanting twin thing could work, but you seem to have a firm footing in bonsai, maybe pm one of the better posters and see if they make you a virt.
I don't know about the angle yet. it was just a thought. sometimes it is best in art generally to do as little as possible in the face of uncertainty. Often the key to a good design hinges in the things the designer chooses not to do
anyway, with those nice branches pulled down, and the side trunk pulled down, I think the slanting twin thing could work, but you seem to have a firm footing in bonsai, maybe pm one of the better posters and see if they make you a virt.
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rockm
Spuds Moyogi
"From my first foray with Bonsai, I have been told by many I cannot do this or that and I recent that. People seem to be too negative just because they haven't tried or done it. Most things can be done if you put your thinking hat on. Sure, there is a learning curve but do not say it is impossible. We should be more encouraging...to experiment and push things. On this case...if the bend did not work, then chop. You lost nothing but a few hours...if you intend to chop anyway. Just another point of view."
Jeez, not trying to be negative, just speaking from personal experience in working with maples. Tried the bending thing with them. Doesn't work well enough to be worth risking snapping the trunk into pieces.
Telling somone to experiment with their material is nice, but inadvertently winding up with two unusuable pieces of material is part of that process. I assume avoiding that is in the interests of the owner of the material.
The consequences of trying to introduce a decent curve in the trunk are not small. Enough torque and you snap off the trunk possibly below where a chop would work. You indeed, could lose more than a few hours...
Jeez, not trying to be negative, just speaking from personal experience in working with maples. Tried the bending thing with them. Doesn't work well enough to be worth risking snapping the trunk into pieces.
Telling somone to experiment with their material is nice, but inadvertently winding up with two unusuable pieces of material is part of that process. I assume avoiding that is in the interests of the owner of the material.
The consequences of trying to introduce a decent curve in the trunk are not small. Enough torque and you snap off the trunk possibly below where a chop would work. You indeed, could lose more than a few hours...
Poink88
Imperial Masterpiece
I better consider myself extremely lucky for not experiencing all the perils that I was warned I will encounter then.
I wish 2013 continue to be as lucky as 2012...happy new year everyone!!!
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
"I better consider myself extremely lucky for not experiencing all the perils that I was warned I will encounter then. I wish 2013 continue to be as lucky as 2012...happy new year everyone!!! "
maybe after your first full year of bonsai in 2013 you might have a different perspective...Good luck.
maybe after your first full year of bonsai in 2013 you might have a different perspective...Good luck.
Poink88
Imperial Masterpiece
Yep, it is very likely all beginners luck. 
MACH5
Imperial Masterpiece
My sense is that adding a gentle curve to the main trunk is all that may be needed in this case.
Poink88
Imperial Masterpiece
I agree. While the links provided showed extreme bends...it is to show how and what can be done and with what tools/method. Doesn't need to done as extreme.
I like your virt.
davetree
Omono
This looks like a good idea if it can be done.
cmeg1
Imperial Masterpiece
One of 'The Bonsai Art of Japan' videos produced by Bjorvala bonsai studios does a great job covering species and dwarf maples.I am just not sure which one though.They are all free and on youtube and also their web-site.There is like 30 or so 10 minute videos.
cmeg1
Imperial Masterpiece
O.k,I did research and found what you want on Bjorvala's website.In their web-sites search,search japanese maple and it will then bring up an article called 'Maple (acer) theory'.Looks like what you want.Also episode #27 is excellent for what you want to do also.When you search japanese maple on there web-site(bjorvala bonsai studio)it brings all this up,but don't forget to watch episode#27 too(bonsai art of japan).
Paulpash
Masterpiece
Thanks for the responses and the virts. It'll be a bit of a heart stopper if I do decide to bend it. I took a look at it's roots while dormant and off work and it had started to encircle the pot. In my opinion it does need to be repotted and roots trimmed back.
It will give me a season to consider the 'big bend' if i decide to go that way. The other solution was cut back and grow - this could easily take 5 years to grow back a convincing continuation of the trunk line so ya pays ya money and makes ya pick. I think on repotting I will first try the angled planting and live with it a season... I'm surprised noone has suggested making it dead straight - that could be done with relative ease but have as much drama as a stick in a pot
It will give me a season to consider the 'big bend' if i decide to go that way. The other solution was cut back and grow - this could easily take 5 years to grow back a convincing continuation of the trunk line so ya pays ya money and makes ya pick. I think on repotting I will first try the angled planting and live with it a season... I'm surprised noone has suggested making it dead straight - that could be done with relative ease but have as much drama as a stick in a pot
fore
Omono
I'd also try to put a bend in the straight trunk. Next spring, try some rebar with a block of wood and start a bend. Something like the virt would be achievable imo.
Paulpash
Masterpiece
A gorgeous JM on Peter Tea's blog: http://peterteabonsai.wordpress.com/2011/12/18/apprenticeship-and-a-japanese-maple/
Bears some similarities with the trunk line here .... straight bottom portion of the trunk then movement above. It's obviously much more ramified and mature and I do like the nebari too..
Bears some similarities with the trunk line here .... straight bottom portion of the trunk then movement above. It's obviously much more ramified and mature and I do like the nebari too..
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rockm
Spuds Moyogi
FWIW, this tree has been chopped very low. Probably at the point where all the trunks emerge and definitely after the nebari was formed.
