BTW, for anyone interested in a more academically-inclined answer from me about whether or not bonsai is an art, I find - via a search of my name and "Aristotle," - that my input into this matter still exists on this site in a thread found in the
General Discussion forum started by
Chris Johnston,
Oct 10, 2007! It still contains one of my attempts to sort this matter out via Aristotilian logic (perhaps with a nod to Plato's take on logic, which I often throw in for counterbalance in the "Is bonsai art?" wars here and else where). Don't know how I can link it here directly, but a search can probably get you there.
Hey Grouper. ..
Glad to see you back. Was sad to hear you had sold off your trees. I always liked them and found them inspirational, as well always appreciated that you took the time to message me regarding to tell me you appreciated mine. That was really cool of you and in a lot of ways I think the style of our individual trees was very similar. And I know you were greatly inspired at the time by Dan... who personally out of the west coast movement going on at the present... I ferl is probably the most talented out of the lot and sadly is just not recognize at much as he should be, at least in my opinion. .. in comparison to the rest.
I do have a couple of things I would like to throw by you and ask your thoughts... and perhaps you can better help me understand?
The first being the concept going on within this thread of if one calls oneself an Artist... they are somehow a narcissist?
This I find confussing...
Why? Because, from my own perspective I am not actually calling myself an Artist, because I think I am somehow better than others... Quite the contrary... we have gone down this road time after time with multiple discussions regarding the subject... and time after time I have actually stated, that seems to always be missed... perhaps through a willingness of some? Who knows... that being an Artist is not actually something that necessarily involves some great skill, or some great talent... that in fact anyone can actually be an Artist... and that this is evident in the vast majority of the Art that is out there... where often some of the creators of the work, knew very little about skill and had actually very little in the way of talent.
That I call my self an Artist. .. why? Because this is quite literally what I am and what I do...
As I have stated... it is my opinion that what defines someone being an Artist from someone doing a craft... is the willingness in my view, to show the craft in such a way where one is trying to intervene their own personal thoughts, feelings, emotions, etc. of their view of the world in what it is they are creating.
This is what I do daily... with the items I create daily... I am always asking myself what it is I want to show within the piece of Art I am doing. When I get people that come to me and ask me to paint a picture or a Scroll for them... they come to me for one reason... they like that often I usually approach what ever subject they are wanting... let's say a bird... in such a way, that even though they have seen paintings of birds five million times... I have somehow managed to now show a bird in a different way. And usually tell me after... that this is why they came to me.
Now to get back to the narcissist question...
I have not said that I have done anything special. As well, as I have mentioned... I have not said their was any special talent or skill...
In fact... I have not actually said anything!
Which is where the problem apparently lies, with me not fully understanding not only a lot of the discussion going on here... nor why you perhaps and some others might refer to one doing as what I am doing as being a narcissist?
I mean... this does not quite add up?
Right?
So, if I have said yes... anyone can actually do Art... anyone can actually be an Artist... that it does not take some special skill, no special talent... that the only thing it takes is a willingness to interject one's own identity into their work... which here again.. Absolutely Anyone Can Do?
What are people fighting?
Me telling them that they can as well, do Art, and that they themselves can be an Artist?
If so... this is just about the most rediculous thing I think I have ever heard.
My next question...
If I have not actually said anything. .. as I mentioned before... than perhaps you could explain to me how I somehow would have the problem of thinking I was somehow better than people... when again I did not say anything?
Actually... strike that... I did say something just now... that they could do it as well.
So my question would be the following... it has been said as well regarding these comments ... that there seems to be some problem with people wanting to call themselves Artist, being insecure...
Yet, if you go back and look through the 8 pages of posts... what you actually find is that the people wanting to call themselves Artist... don't actually seem to be the one's having this problem.
They are not the one's writing the silly thoughts of how others think they are better than anyone else... they are not the one's telling people that they want to just call themselves Artist so they can not actually work and just live off of rich people... and that their work can only be considered Art if it has hung in a gallery for centuries, or even that their work cannot actually be considered Art... unless a group of their peers says it is so... as though it is somehow up to these same people to decide when and where Art can become so?
So, my question would be... what would you clinically call people who say others have a insecurity problem... when in fact it is just the opposite?
One last thing... I am sorry.. I know this is long, and I apologize.
You mentioned that if anyone was interested in a more "Academically-inclined " explanation of what Art is to check out what you had written...
I mean... if anything posted by anyone here sounds like someone thinking they were better than anyone else... it would be this statement right?
I mean... some of us not so smart people... us common man so to speak. .. might want to think that their reasoning... that their logic of what art might be... might also be worthy of an "Academically-inclined " point of view as well. Right?
The only difference is... that I guess I don't have a chip on my shoulder... that I am not going to hold a personal grudge against someone because they might have a view that differs from myself here...
That I think you are a smart person... a talented person... and just because you are... I will not hold it against you. I will take what you said as you meaning that you have just put a lot of thought into what it was you felt Art was. But, I will say this... you are not alone.
