Help with first tree selection

[BBNJ88]

I'm zone 4 NE Ohio. All my deciduous go into Aoki a Japanese blend except my ginkgo and trident clump. It's what Scott Lee uses...and he was my original go-to guy before he stopped handling a lot of deciduous. Which is why Jason is my now go-to guy.

There is a break down of what it is. For ones to make their own. I happen to not know it. As I prefer buying pre-made.

I don't use pond baskets. I just don't like the look of them. I have good luck with trees in Aoki. I'll say this... this Catlin Elm came from Jason. It's in a small pot. I only needed to build the canopy. The tree's bones there. Was in a small pot since with me.

This is what three years was for me. Jason uses Boon mix. Which is simular to Aoki but doesn't hold as much moisture. Because I use Clay King which is what Boon mix is to compare to. For my JBP and my ginkgo.


Don't get me wrong. I have trees up potted. In training pots or ceramic pots that are bigger than a finished pot. But my first elm...came in a tiny pots and developed great in it. Again I wasn't growing out the trunk. But the structure for the canopy.
View attachment 585656

Followed you on Instagram by the way!

So basically look for either aoki or boon mix for the pre bonsai and you think I'd be fine with either nursery pots or pond baskets for growing it out a bit ?.

Do you buy the aoki anywhere specific ? Don't you bother with pine bark in either mix to retain some moisture ?

Also for fertilizer regarding the pre bonsai stock you're growing out whats your regimen / brand usage like if I may ask ?

Thanks for being so responsive and helpful you're a gem !

 

[BBNJ88]

Private lake front microclimate. It's why I lost my ryusen in my landscape that now is bonsai.

The zone map is wrong for my area. They even went so far to bump it up to be warmer than what it was already. Anyone planting things in the ground here for landscape will lose them. If they follow the map zones. Again...microclimate. I'm completely different than 8 miles into town. Our landscape is even slower to wake.

I had a crazy experience with micro climates when I lived in both Colorado and Long Island. Here in NJ it's a bit more stable.

I think I'm going to reach out to schley or all shapes bonsai this spring and get some of the aoki or boons mix. I will also get some fertilizer once I figure out what's best for that mix

 

[Cadillactaste]

Followed you on Instagram by the way!

So basically look for either aoki or boon mix for the pre bonsai and you think I'd be fine with either nursery pots or pond baskets for growing it out a bit ?.

Do you buy the aoki anywhere specific ? Don't you bother with pine bark in either mix to retain some moisture ?

Also for fertilizer regarding the pre bonsai stock you're growing out whats your regimen / brand usage like if I may ask ?

Thanks for being so responsive and helpful you're a gem !

No, I don't use organic with my medium. Small pots can go into deeper pots with akadama filled in those or, a top dressing or spaghum moss on top. Summer... when the heat hits. My Ryusen actually sits in a tray of water. Bill Valavanis suggested that as he isn't fond of the pot shape. Concern of it drying out weird on the roots.

You have to understand...soil wars are huge. This is the regiment of one I respect who I used to buy from. Who also seen my winters.

Fertilizer... I love BioGold, things in development get it on their pots. I also use fish emulsion once a month in the growing season. And into fall for that. Every two weeks Peter's 20-20-20 on developmental trees. *satsuki gets that half strength.

Refined trees I wait for things to harden off before feeding. I then ... steep BioGold and make a tea for them. They don't get BioGold on their pots. I offer it to them about every 10-14 days. When leaves begin to turn come fall...I switch to soley fish emulsion. They also get fish emulsion once a month during growing season.

Now I've begun to use BioChar and Dasu from Ireland a few years back. I struggle with lake front and fungal issues in my landscape. Since adding it. I am not longer battling it in my bonsai.

I appreciate your following me on Instagram. But feel bad. I'm truly down sick. I've not felt up to the pressure of keeping it active. Once I'm feeling better...and have the energy levels back. I'll resume. But I'm still on breathing treatments...and I can't physically talk without choking on coughs. I just don't have the energy levels to deal with the demand of the page. So I do wish you an apology. When I'm better...I'll resume and I try to post daily. When I'm healthy.

 

[Cadillactaste]

I had a crazy experience with micro climates when I lived in both Colorado and Long Island. Here in NJ it's a bit more stable.

I think I'm going to reach out to schley or all shapes bonsai this spring and get some of the aoki or boons mix. I will also get some fertilizer once I figure out what's best for that mix

Jason makes a mix comparable to Boon. He's mentioned it to me.

I have also bought my medium off of Jonus Dupuich from Bonsai Tonight. Thinking maybe...free shipping when you order so much. But my brain on meds. Is fuzzy there.

Now one here who has a nursery...sent me some of his mix. I've not used it yet. I can't think of his name here to tag him. My memory being sick and on meds. Is pathetic. I've weaned off some of them. So I'm less daft. But...I still have moments I can't think right.

Microclimates are crazy. I had that Ryusen in my landscape for years. Even with burlap protection. Winter 2013-14 stole mature trees ... all over. It dropped us out of our planting zone the manager at the local nursery said. Not to plant anything above a zone 4 from then on out. Or we risk losing it. With our microclimate of the lake.

 

[BBNJ88]

No, I don't use organic with my medium. Small pots can go into deeper pots with akadama filled in those or, a top dressing or spaghum moss on top. Summer... when the heat hits. My Ryusen actually sits in a tray of water. Bill Valavanis suggested that as he isn't fond of the pot shape. Concern of it drying out weird on the roots.

You have to understand...soil wars are huge. This is the regiment of one I respect who I used to buy from. Who also seen my winters.

Fertilizer... I love BioGold, things in development get it on their pots. I also use fish emulsion once a month in the growing season. And into fall for that. Every two weeks Peter's 20-20-20 on developmental trees. *satsuki gets that half strength.

Refined trees I wait for things to harden off before feeding. I then ... steep BioGold and make a tea for them. They don't get BioGold on their pots. I offer it to them about every 10-14 days. When leaves begin to turn come fall...I switch to soley fish emulsion. They also get fish emulsion once a month during growing season.

Now I've begun to use BioChar and Dasu from Ireland a few years back. I struggle with lake front and fungal issues in my landscape. Since adding it. I am not longer battling it in my bonsai.

I appreciate your following me on Instagram. But feel bad. I'm truly down sick. I've not felt up to the pressure of keeping it active. Once I'm feeling better...and have the energy levels back. I'll resume. But I'm still on breathing treatments...and I can't physically talk without choking on coughs. I just don't have the energy levels to deal with the demand of the page. So I do wish you an apology. When I'm better...I'll resume and I try to post daily. When I'm healthy.

So basically you'd suggest aoki or boons mix without any pine ( even for deciduous ?)

And then using bio gold as the main fert in those little net pot type things on top of the soil?

Then fish emulsion once a month and Peters 20-20-20 or similar weekly basically ?

Do you think it would be worth adding some pine to retain moisture if I go with pond baskets or don't bother and just keep up on watering or put it in a water tray ?


Not a concern now but for stuff in net pots or nursery pots whats a decent weathering plan for winter and how often do you check them for water ?

 

[Cadillactaste]

So basically you'd suggest aoki or boons mix without any pine ( even for deciduous ?)

And then using bio gold as the main fert in those little net pot type things on top of the soil?

Then fish emulsion once a month and Peters 20-20-20 or similar weekly basically ?

Do you think it would be worth adding some pine to retain moisture if I go with pond baskets or don't bother and just keep up on watering or put it in a water tray ?


Not a concern now but for stuff in net pots or nursery pots whats a decent weathering plan for winter and how often do you check them for water ?

The majority of collection is deciduous. All with non organic mix.

Now... my tropical...have an organic in the mix. Other than the ones that come from Jason. I've not repotted those. And I'm on the fence what I'll do there. Under grow lights in winter. I see the benefits of that organic.



Fertilizer I use empty tea bags.
Peter's 20-20-20 every other week. The week I'm off. I do once a month fish emulsion.

Many don't use BioGold. I just happen to use it. I follow a regiment of one I respect. There are I'm sure other fertilizer just as good.

LIST OF SPECIES I OWN:

1 Wisteria
2 Sweet plum [sagaretia theezans]
3 Bald cypress
4 Neagari satsuki azalea * [Shuho-no-Hikari]
5 Forsythia *
6 Chinese quince [Pseudocydonia sinensis]
▪︎ shohin size one as well
7 crepe myrtle neagari *
▪︎ crepe myrtle connecting base quirky
▪︎ 7 inch base sumo
8 Winged elm * ROR
▪︎ Caitlin Elm neagari cascade*
▪︎Drake elm on dragon
▪︎ elm mini forest
▪︎ Neagari elm for cosmic design
▪︎ Mother/daughter planting
9 Trident clump
▪︎ mini Grove
▪︎ cascade trident
10 Pyracantha *
11 Ginkgo
12 Nippon daisy
13 Large neagari Asian jasmine *
▪︎ neagari trial run set to repot into
Bonsai pot 2025
14 Paul's Scarlett Hawthorn
▪︎ Yamadori Hawthorn
15 Crabapple
16 Tamarix
17 Toyo Nishiki quince neagari *
▪︎ ROR Toyo Nishiki quince
▪︎ novelty neagari red

18 Thuja planting
19JBP pine *
20 flying dragon [Poncirus trifoliata "contorta"]

21Ryusen Japanese maple
▪︎ Tim Burton Acer Japanese maple *
▪︎ Semi cascade Japanese maple
▪︎ Grass Torched trunk Japanese maple
▪︎ Hollow and scarred trunk JM

22 Bog Monster olive *
▪︎ Pig /an olive
▪︎ cascade style

***smalls*** (Do they really count)
23 Barberry
▪︎ Asian jasmine *
▪︎ Red chojubai *
▪︎Wee Japanese Maple

Wintering indoors
24 bougainvillea *
25 Turks Cap Mallow (Upside-down)*
26 Too little ficus
27 willow leaf ficus
▪︎ Banyan willow leaf *
28 Ficus natalensis *
29 Tigerbark

* Some sort of exposed root.
▪︎ duplicate cultivar

 

[Cadillactaste]

I would like to add. If you've really young material. Then organic is the way to go. Just like when we begin babies on baby food. It serves it's purpose. I don't believe in young plants in bonsai medium. I grew up younger days on a cattle farm and we also grew crops. There are benefits to organic. But once we go into the bonsai realm of reaching a point with our material. There are also benefits for not using it. Bonsai Heresy is a good book that touches on it as well.

 

[BBNJ88]

The majority of collection is deciduous. All with non organic mix.

Now... my tropical...have an organic in the mix. Other than the ones that come from Jason. I've not repotted those. And I'm on the fence what I'll do there. Under grow lights in winter. I see the benefits of that organic.



Fertilizer I use empty tea bags.
Peter's 20-20-20 every other week. The week I'm off. I do once a month fish emulsion.

Many don't use BioGold. I just happen to use it. I follow a regiment of one I respect. There are I'm sure other fertilizer just as good.

LIST OF SPECIES I OWN:

1 Wisteria
2 Sweet plum [sagaretia theezans]
3 Bald cypress
4 Neagari satsuki azalea * [Shuho-no-Hikari]
5 Forsythia *
6 Chinese quince [Pseudocydonia sinensis]
▪︎ shohin size one as well
7 crepe myrtle neagari *
▪︎ crepe myrtle connecting base quirky
▪︎ 7 inch base sumo
8 Winged elm * ROR
▪︎ Caitlin Elm neagari cascade*
▪︎Drake elm on dragon
▪︎ elm mini forest
▪︎ Neagari elm for cosmic design
▪︎ Mother/daughter planting
9 Trident clump
▪︎ mini Grove
▪︎ cascade trident
10 Pyracantha *
11 Ginkgo
12 Nippon daisy
13 Large neagari Asian jasmine *
▪︎ neagari trial run set to repot into
Bonsai pot 2025
14 Paul's Scarlett Hawthorn
▪︎ Yamadori Hawthorn
15 Crabapple
16 Tamarix
17 Toyo Nishiki quince neagari *
▪︎ ROR Toyo Nishiki quince
▪︎ novelty neagari red

18 Thuja planting
19JBP pine *
20 flying dragon [Poncirus trifoliata "contorta"]

21Ryusen Japanese maple
▪︎ Tim Burton Acer Japanese maple *
▪︎ Semi cascade Japanese maple
▪︎ Grass Torched trunk Japanese maple
▪︎ Hollow and scarred trunk JM

22 Bog Monster olive *
▪︎ Pig /an olive
▪︎ cascade style

***smalls*** (Do they really count)
23 Barberry
▪︎ Asian jasmine *
▪︎ Red chojubai *
▪︎Wee Japanese Maple

Wintering indoors
24 bougainvillea *
25 Turks Cap Mallow (Upside-down)*
26 Too little ficus
27 willow leaf ficus
▪︎ Banyan willow leaf *
28 Ficus natalensis *
29 Tigerbark

* Some sort of exposed root.
▪︎ duplicate cultivar

Your trees look great so I think I'll take your advice lol. For bio gold is it best to just attach the bags to the soil and follow the dosing instructions on the bag ?

The regular 20-20-20 is just full strength as well?

If I repot the material should I go light on the bio gold at first ?

For the winter I suppose keeping them up against the house in bins or something and mulched heavily should be ok? Is there a cadence you water on in the winter ? I think you mentioned a green house I assume you would water less often than I'll have to ? I also have an unheated garage I could over winter them in too.

I was checking out all the trees on your IG really nice stuff I really enjoy that tree the Acer In the pot with the little monster man.


In reference to young materials ,I assume pre bonsai I would buy from schley or all shapes would be suitable to grow out in bonsai mix age wise as opposed to organics ? I could probably add a little pine fines in either case and be fine I'm sure anyway

 

[Cadillactaste]

Your trees look great so I think I'll take your advice lol. For bio gold is it best to just attach the bags to the soil and follow the dosing instructions on the bag ?

You can. I tend to just knot the tea bags and lay them on the surface. If critters bother it. You could fasten them by making a U with wire and securing them to the pot.

The regular 20-20-20 is just full strength as well?

For me... yes. Except satsuki azalea need half strength.

If I repot the material should I go light on the bio gold at first ?

Yes, I don't fertilize newly repotted trees.

For the winter I suppose keeping them up against the house in bins or something and mulched heavily should be ok? Is there a cadence you water on in the winter ? I think you mentioned a green house I assume you would water less often than I'll have to ? I also have an unheated garage I could over winter them in too.

Dependant on your medium... in my controlled cold greenhouse. I check them weekly. If they need watered...they get watered. If I'm running my secondary heater because of excessive cold temps. Then most need watered. if not, not always do they all need watered. You will be able to eventually see the medium and know if it's drying out.

I don't winter outside...I can not advise on something I am unfamiliar with.

I was checking out all the trees on your IG really nice stuff I really enjoy that tree the Acer In the pot with the little monster man.

Thank ya kindly. It makes me smile. That is so out of even Victor Harris 's usual norm... that he mentioned getting cold feet when it came time for the reveal. Understand it was kept secret from even myself. Lol I love controversy so it makes me grin. He went with a ghoul because skulls are so over done.

In reference to young materials ,I assume pre bonsai I would buy from schley or all shapes would be suitable to grow out in bonsai mix age wise as opposed to organics ? I could probably add a little pine fines in either case and be fine I'm sure anyway

Pre-bonsai is such a broad spectrum term. Which is why I said that. From Jason...if pre-bonsai I would suspect inorganic mix is just fine. As I believe in trusting my source... he's reputable. He and I tend to see eye to eye on things...classifications.

 

[BBNJ88]

You can. I tend to just knot the tea bags and lay them on the surface. If critters bother it. You could fasten them by making a U with wire and securing them to the pot.

For me... yes. Except satsuki azalea need half strength.

Yes, I don't fertilize newly repotted trees.

Dependant on your medium... in my controlled cold greenhouse. I check them weekly. If they need watered...they get watered. If I'm running my secondary heater because of excessive cold temps. Then most need watered. if not, not always do they all need watered. You will be able to eventually see the medium and know if it's drying out.

I don't winter outside...I can not advise on something I am unfamiliar with.

Thank ya kindly. It makes me smile. That is so out of even Victor Harris 's usual norm... that he mentioned getting cold feet when it came time for the reveal. Understand it was kept secret from even myself. Lol I love controversy so it makes me grin. He went with a ghoul because skulls are so over done.

Pre-bonsai is such a broad spectrum term. Which is why I said that. From Jason...if pre-bonsai I would suspect inorganic mix is just fine. As I believe in trusting my source... he's reputable. He and I tend to see eye to eye on things...classifications.

So for the first season after a repot I shouldn't fertilize at all then you'd say?

I'll reach out to schley and all shapes around here and I'm sure they could give me specific advice on potting materials and fertilizer for the tree in purchase and some ideas on overwintering

 

[Cadillactaste]

Oh no. I fertilize. I just wait a few weeks. Allow it to settle in and recover.

 

[Cadillactaste]

So for the first season after a repot I shouldn't fertilize at all then you'd say?

I'll reach out to schley and all shapes around here and I'm sure they could give me specific advice on potting materials and fertilizer for the tree in purchase and some ideas on overwintering

No... I wait a few weeks before I fertilize. To allow it to recover.

 

[August44]

I picked up one of these last week. Arrived well packed and healthy. It would be a great starter tree if you want a trident. I would be careful leaving the tree on a porch. Not enough sun will leave you with very long internodes and a crappy looking tree.

Amazon.com

You can buy those Trident seedlings way cheaper on Face Book auctions than that my friend

 

[yashu]

You can buy those Trident seedlings way cheaper on Face Book auctions than that my friend

The one I got was a step better than a seedling (I think at 5 y.o. They qualify as saplings ) and honestly what I’ve seen on FB for tridents was rubbish or MUCH more expensive.




It was a late night purchase and the $35 I spent on it helped me get free shipping on the other stuff in my cart (I don’t have Prime).

 

[August44]

The one I got was a step better than a seedling (I think at 5 y.o. They qualify as saplings ) and honestly what I’ve seen on FB for tridents was rubbish or MUCH more expensive.

View attachment 585817
View attachment 585818

It was a late night purchase and the $35 I spent on it helped me get free shipping on the other stuff in my cart (I don’t have Prime).

Yes, way different than a seedling. I would have spilled for that one too.