Getting Nice Roots on Chinese Elms

[one_bonsai]

I dug a few up from grow beds and they all had the most terrible, tangled root system. I ended up cutting all the roots back to almost nothing and replanting them on a tile.

 

[SeanS]

Did the same on a small elm

Shohin Chinese Elm

I bought this little Chinese elm from a local bonsai nursery about a month ago. It had the best trunk out of about 50 similar sized elms. I knew I’d be regrowing the top so wasn’t too concerned with the branches but it had some decent primaries. When I bought it there were already 2 buds that...

www.bonsainut.com

 

[one_bonsai]

Thanks for the link. My elm's root system looked just as tangled as yours. Funny thing was I did exactly the same as you did, cut it back really hard and planted on a board.

 

[one_bonsai]

How often should you root prune Chinese Elms when thickening the trunk in the ground?

I feel as though you'd need to do it every year to keep those roots from becoming a mess again.

 

[leatherback]

I feel as though you'd need to do it every year to keep those roots from becoming a mess again.

If you do a proper root sorting before planting in the ground, they might not become so messy. I find that roots in-ground are much less messy than in pots

 

[Shibui]

Chinese elm are prone to growing just a few very long, thick roots. Root pruning hard in the early stages usually makes them produce more, smaller roots. After a couple of good root prunes to establish a well spread, radial root system they generally behave much better. The ones I dug from the grow bed last week had quite good roots.

 

[sorce]

I reckon 8 times out of ten you're better, safer, to layer new roots, especially after ground growing.

Digging stuff up is a waste.

Sorce

 

[Paulpash]

I dug a few up from grow beds and they all had the most terrible, tangled root system. I ended up cutting all the roots back to almost nothing and replanting them on a tile.

Ground layer instead - easier, faster, more effective.

 

[PA_Penjing]

I like ground growing but really fast growers (elms,DR,zelkova,native maples) need to be dug up often and dealt with. The roots blast off and get ugly, especially if you have poor clay soil. To echo leatherback, if you prune them correctly and get it back on a tile, they will get nicer with time

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Thanks for the link. My elm's root system looked just as tangled as yours. Funny thing was I did exactly the same as you did, cut it back really hard and planted on a board.

Make sure you don't hedge cut the roots (cut them all back to the same length). Rather trim the roots so that you have ten (or whatever) primary roots, while removing the rest. Then plant on a board, and drive nails on either sides of the roots to hold the roots in place so they radiate out from the nebari 6" or so. Then when you dig up later, you will still find a ton of secondary roots, but the primary roots should be dominant and should have dramatically increased in caliper.

 

[one_bonsai]

So with ground layering option would you leave the tree in the ground until the trunk is ready, then ground layer it, detach and then into a pot?

 

[Bonsai Nut]

So with ground layering option would you leave the tree in the ground until the trunk is ready, then ground layer it, detach and then into a pot?

It depends on your goal, where you are today, and what they tree looks like. Photos are worth a million words

Sounds to me like you want to grow a great stump as quickly as possible. If that is the case, the sooner you fix structural root problems the better. Get a nice ground layer, arrange your roots, and then field grow it on a board. If you have a nice spread of roots, you should get a good flare at the nebari and nice taper.

 

[Shibui]

Today I prepared some Corky bark Chinese elms to go in the grow beds.
These have been in the pots for a year or 2 so roots are pretty tangled.


Almost impossible to separate those roots and I don't want to plant with long roots anyway. I know that they all have good roots close to the surface so chopping is the best way to deal with the roots.




I don't normally wash the roots but it is easier to show you want's going on without the soil.




Now cut off any down growing roots, shorten all laterals and remove or relocate any roots that don't grow relatively straight out from the trunk.






Finally shorten the trunk to a spot where new growth could be useful.



This one and others are now in the grow beds waiting for tomorrow's promised rain.

 

[Davidlpf]

Nice work @Shibui

Haven't you considered to screw a piece of wood to the bottom of the trees? It's said that do miracles in the nebari development, click,click, if it works with maples, may work in elms too

Cheers!

 

[Davidlpf]

It depends on your goal, where you are today, and what they tree looks like. Photos are worth a million words

Sounds to me like you want to grow a great stump as quickly as possible. If that is the case, the sooner you fix structural root problems the better. Get a nice ground layer, arrange your roots, and then field grow it on a board. If you have a nice spread of roots, you should get a good flare at the nebari and nice taper.

I agree.

I think is much better to work in the saplings, get first a good radial root system BEFORE thinking in thicken the trunk. The better material you start with, the sooner you'll have a good bonsai.

Nebary and taper development is much better if you start the house by the foundations instead the roof!



If you already have a big fat trunk, you may improve airlayering, but if you can choose, why don't choose the better option and to start by the beginning?



Greetings.

 

[Shibui]

There is no need to screw to a board. When they are root pruned well like this the tree relies on the lateral roots and vertical ones rarely grow much, even in the ground. Same applies to maples.

 

[Davidlpf]

There is no need to screw to a board. When they are root pruned well like this the tree relies on the lateral roots and vertical ones rarely grow much, even in the ground. Same applies to maples.

Good to know, thanks for the information

 

[one_bonsai]

Shibui, you're not concerned that the roots in the last photo are still a bit messy?

 

[Shibui]

A couple of years in the ground and all those roots will be fused into a solid single slab so it probably won't matter where individual roots go now. The trunk will also have thickened. Probably to that diameter so most of that will be covered up inside the trunk.