Feedback on my first video

[Kievnstavick]

For clarity, I haven't watched the video as the others have mentioned nothing stood out. So I didn't feel like it was necessary before making this post.

Anyways disclaimer aside..

I think this maybe just a bad case of falling off the algorithm. If I can remember later tonight, I'll go through and make sure I have liked your videos for the engagement and hopefully to boost you in the algorithm.

Now I know I am only one of your multiple thousands of subscribers, but it could just be an overall lull in youtube watching. I have personally been too busy this last month to watch videos to pay attention to and I have only just started to catch up on my more educational videos.

 

[Orion_metalhead]

Its end of summer... School starting, work is nuts, end of summer... @Kievnstavick is probably on to something.

 

[leatherback]

Its end of summer... School starting, work is nuts, end of summer... @Kievnstavick is probably on to something.

It would be, if all videos were similarly affected. But it was just the one.

 

[Desert O'Piñon]

For what it's worth from someone who only has 12 subs and hasn't yet figured out the right way to record decent content yet, I appreciate this video every bit as much as your other material. The only times I don't learn something from you is when I watch a video I've already seen. I wouldn't be too concerned; your entire channel is top quality.

 

[ShadyStump]

Ok, I've had a chance to watch it, so now I know what I'm talking about.
Sorta. Maybe.

My official opinion now is that you're simply applying a fairly advanced technique, and it was just a little over some people's heads.

Remember that many viewers - arguably most - don't actually practice bonsai. They just like to watch the videos; similar to how I find myself watching allot of engineering content, but rarely actually do anything similar. It's just fascinating to see happen.

I think all accounts so far offered are reasonably plausible. Advanced technique, the tree torture mentality, the end of summer cleaning out of the subscription list; it all adds up to, "no accounting for taste." Don't dwell on it unless it becomes a pattern over time. Maybe rename the video or apply a new thumbnail to it, but I suggest leaving it up. Finding advanced techniques like this is hard, and in the long run will set you apart, likey leading to more subscribers over time.

 

[Contact]

Ok, I've had a chance to watch it, so now I know what I'm talking about.
Sorta. Maybe.

My official opinion now is that you're simply applying a fairly advanced technique, and it was just a little over some people's heads.

Remember that many viewers - arguably most - don't actually practice bonsai. They just like to watch the videos; similar to how I find myself watching allot of engineering content, but rarely actually do anything similar. It's just fascinating to see happen.

I think all accounts so far offered are reasonably plausible. Advanced technique, the tree torture mentality, the end of summer cleaning out of the subscription list; it all adds up to, "no accounting for taste." Don't dwell on it unless it becomes a pattern over time. Maybe rename the video or apply a new thumbnail to it, but I suggest leaving it up. Finding advanced techniques like this is hard, and in the long run will set you apart, likey leading to more subscribers over time.

Totally agree, this kind of video Is not for "everyone". But it's the kind of video that a bonsai practioner search sooner or later during his travel into bonsai. Leave it as It is, the number of views will increase with time.

 

[Dabbler]

Can't see anything wrong with the steam video - Youtube is just a fickle thing as I went from 650 sub to 2.2 in about a week then it just stopped and haven't gained any in a the last few days I say just keep it up and keep chugging on

 

[Glaucus]

You need to talk to other content creators who also try to game the algorithm. I often see videos pop up with certain titles, and then different titles later. Because they keep changing titles to try to make the video do better, potentially go viral. Maybe same is true for thumbnail image.

If you have a video that performs very different/worse than your other videos, then that will be hard to figure out, I guess. So people who watched this video then unsubscribed? Does YT tell you that?

Maybe one way to deal with YT is to just create videos, put them online, and not even care about how well they do. And not let the YT algorithm or rando YT users decide how to improve your videos. Just work with other knowledgeable people whose feedback you trust to see how to improve things like editing. And just try to get ahead of the algorithm, instead of chasing it. Especially if it is still a hobby. One example of how to deal with it in my opinion is Thunderf00t. He got a lot of criticisms on all kinds of different things. He just creates videos he likes. And he is still doing it, alongside his normal job. And tons of other people who did similar things to him 15 years ago, all burned out and are gone and forgotten. Especially things more controversial like the edgy atheism and anti-feminism stuff. He was anti Elon Musk for a long time and got a ton of hate and people unsubscribing over that.

A lot of people on YT get audience captured. Look at Sabine Hossenfelder as a bad example. She is going down the rabbit hole, I believe. She used to be a physics professor. Now she is slowly sliding away to doing clickbait videos about how science cannot be trusted. Tapping into the audience of people like the Weinsteins & Jordan Peterson.

Being a YT content creator is such an odd job, if it is your livelihood, I think it might be automatically a good idea to talk to a therapist about this. Maybe one who does the same thing to other YT content creators. It is just really weird.
If you are very self-critical, a perfectionist, and it is you & your ego vs the algorithm of a multibillion dollar company, then that's a real big thing to try to fight all on your own.

 

[leatherback]

So people who watched this video then unsubscribed? Does YT tell you that?

Yes!
YT actually provides a pretty decent statistics interface:

one way to deal with YT is to just create videos, put them online, and not even care about how well they do. And not let the YT algorithm or rando YT users decide how to improve your videos. Just work with other knowledgeable people whose feedback you trust to see how to improve things like editing.

Most f the time, this is what I do. It is just that at times you can get blindsided. And then for me it is key to understand why a certain video did not do well. I mean, if I go through the trouble of making a video, I prefer that it gets seen over ignored .

But still.. There are these days that I just feel like stopping with it, as in the long run, it hardly adds to my life; Still waiting for these invites to come rolling in from aroun the world to come and do workshops!

 

[Glaucus]

Maybe people just don't like deadwood. Or they think "Wow he killed his bonsai, he is not an expert. Why am I subscribed?"

I thought the physical chemistry of the cellulose and lignin part was quite a good add. But maybe I saw too many presentations on cellulose throughout the years!

 

[ShadyStump]

Look at Sabine Hossenfelder as a bad example. She is going down the rabbit hole, I believe. She used to be a physics professor. Now she is slowly sliding away to doing clickbait videos about how science cannot be trusted.

I almost laughed out loud because there are times I'm about to unsubscribe over some of her antics. LoL

You're absolutely right, though. Online content success is a long game. There's too much going on out there to ever fully predict anything, so you have to watch the numbers over months or even years to really know anything for sure.

There are these days that I just feel like stopping with it, as in the long run, it hardly adds to my life

It adds to ours.

And of course no one is inviting you to do workshops. Your videos are too good!

 

[Desert O'Piñon]

And of course no one is inviting you to do workshops. Your videos are too good!

You make a good point.

 

[Glaucus]

Youtube is just really weird. It might be that making Youtube videos to get invited to do more workshops isn't actually a good reason to do YT videos. Maybe offering to do bonsai clinics for free, is. Until people start to pay you. I don't know too much about the western bonsai world, but it seems to be really respected you must have studied in Japan, or you must have really high quality trees of your own. If you know good horticulture and are a good educator, you don't get that same level of respect. If you need free azaleas for clinics, you can always get some from me.

Anyway, I just wondered what the most watched bonsai video on YT ever was. And maybe it is this one with 20 million views "THE EASY WAY TO MAKE A COCONUT BONSAI"

If you go to that channel you can kinda see this person is trying to recreate that one video that went viral. All their other videos are also in allcaps, but with around 1k views. It is weird.

Also, I noticed the video by the Blackpacking Biologist on bonsai, which has 2.7 million views with a pinned comment (meaning The Backpacking Biologists himself put it on top, that has 3.8k likes that says:
"Why recreate adversity? I'm definitely part of that sub-group against bonsai - it's crippling trees for just aesthetics and there's also some weird control issues to unpack around it. Just get some plants that are good for your local wildlife."

The backpacking Biologist then made a follow-up video named "Is Bonsai Torture? - Biology of Pain" with a thumbnail about foot binding.

It may actually be that most of your potential YT audience that is going to watch a bonsai video are people that kinda want bonsai ASMR. Or just bored people that want to watch a cool video. There's actually some Japanese channels that have something quite similar to that.
Also, with plants and Youtube, there were these weird videos put out about how to magically grow plants in certain ways. Like very unusual or odd ways to root cuttings. Those videos were fake. There was this rose garden nursery channel that did a whole video about fake plant videos. These videos are kinda similar to those videos where people buy a fresh water turtle, glue seawater barnacles to their shell. And then record a Youtube video about how they are 'saving' the turtle by removing the barnacles.

The audience of people that actually do bonsai. And actually want to know how to do bending of a piece of deadwood, and that are going to watch your steam method for bonsai deadwood. So they can actually apply it to their own work, is way smaller than those people that click these weird videos. That's why I say YT is weird. There's some funny genres out there on YT. One is like the American rural homesteaders who make videos with their daily problems trying to learn to farm, trying to take care of animals, trying to transform their property, but also have their kids in their videos. Very parasocial, I suspect. Or there is this guy that cleans pavements & mows lawns for free, but records it and puts it on YT. Or the girl that washes & grooms cats and dogs for free but records the process (I actually like that last one, but the YT algorithm pushes them all). YT is weird. It seems 'feel good' videos get more views that educational instructional stuff.

I remember way a long time ago there was a bonsai channel about a guy who took random plants, planted them in a pot with 100% sphagnum moss, and had clickbait titles about, probably also in allcaps like "UNIQUE BONSAI METHOD - PERFECT BONSAI REPOTTING FOR BEGINNERS" and people here on bonsainut were very mad. The videos all would all kind of follow the same script.

It might be that you need to rethink how YT can fit in with your bonsai ambitions. YT is so weird that you can hire consultants to tell you how to make your YT videos better. How to link your YT work to Twitter, to TikTok, to Instagram, and try to become a professional 'influencer' as we Dutchies like to call it.

There are definitely some very high quality YT channels with in depth info on YT that do very well. Finding someone that does YT and is somewhat bigger to you, regardless of the subject, but who has a similar style in the sense of making serious educational videos, and talking to them about these things, like the algorith, motivation, editing, using the right feedback to improve, can be highly beneficial.

Everything you have put on YT will just stay there and slowly collect views. It can always act as your portfolio. So maybe with everything in bonsai, it is a slow burn.

 

[Dabbler]

Can't see anything wrong with the steam video - Youtube is just a fickle thing as I went from 650 sub to 2.2 in about a week then it just stopped and haven't gained any in a the last few days I say just keep it up and keep chugging on

I almost laughed out loud because there are times I'm about to unsubscribe over some of her antics. LoL

You're absolutely right, though. Online content success is a long game. There's too much going on out there to ever fully predict anything, so you have to watch the numbers over months or even years to really know anything for sure.



It adds to ours.

And of course no one is inviting you to do workshops. Your videos are too good!

I mean have you seen my channel - I do comedic bonsai and I just do it because I love comedy and bonsai so I combined the two and I also like aquariums - may not be clickbait or what people want but I enjoy it and there's has to be a crowd out there that likes funny bonsai content right?! lol

 

[leatherback]

And of course no one is inviting you to do workshops. Your videos are too good!

But my personality just comes across much better in real life

I went from 650 sub to 2.2 in about a week

Have you checked which video caused people to subscribe? Typically it is one video that draws them in to sub.

 

[leatherback]

You need to talk to other content creators who also try to game the algorithm. I often see videos pop up with certain titles, and then different titles later. Because they keep changing titles to try to make the video do better, potentially go viral. Maybe same is true for thumbnail image.

Oh, I do this too. And YT offers the option to upload 3 thumbnails and they test which is best. I personally just switch thumbs out as the video enters in the first 1K views. I know now how many views to expect in the first hours.

e.g.,

Not sure it is gaming the algorythm. That has just one aim. Give watchers videos they will like. Trouble is, title and thumbnail determine for the major part the number of views (Between 4 and 8 percent of the people who are suggested my video, actually click to watch) after which people leave in the first 30 seconds (Up to 40% loss again). So you are left with maybe 3% of the people who see the icon, actually watching more than 30 seconds. Lousy stats for a video that easily has costs a day to produce.

 

[ShadyStump]

Oh, I do this too. And YT offers the option to upload 3 thumbnails and they test which is best. I personally just switch thumbs out as the video enters in the first 1K views. I know now how many views to expect in the first hours.

e.g., View attachment 564968View attachment 564967

Not sure it is gaming the algorythm. That has just one aim. Give watchers videos they will like. Trouble is, title and thumbnail determine for the major part the number of views (Between 4 and 8 percent of the people who are suggested my video, actually click to watch) after which people leave in the first 30 seconds (Up to 40% loss again). So you are left with maybe 3% of the people who see the icon, actually watching more than 30 seconds. Lousy stats for a video that easily has costs a day to produce.

As my father says it, you can have a slow dime or a fast nickel. The steam video is a slow dime I think. It will pay for itself and more, but it will take time.

Many people chase fast nickels; as many views as possible in as short a time as possible. They're videos are always short, under thought, and really no good to anyone except maybe to briefly entertain or minimally inform someone who isn't actually engaged with the topic. Their videos don't usually get repeat views.

Your videos do, and will for a long time.

 

[TrevorLarsen]

Sorry for the random post post, but I would love to see you and Peter Chan do a video together. I think a portion of his audience will eventually graduate to your videos like I have. I still love Peter, but obviously he is more focused on beginners or intermediate people.

 

[leatherback]

I would love to see you and Peter Chan do a video together

That is a great idea.
I have been trying to get Peter do a movie with me in the past, but never got a response when I reached out.

Naturally, there is this little challenge that we are a bit apart so a movie actually together requires me to travel to the UK..

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

That is a great idea.
I have been trying to get Peter do a movie with me in the past, but never got a response when I reached out.

Naturally, there is this little challenge that we are a bit apart so a movie actually together requires me to travel to the UK..

A Peter Chan goes Germany tour would be fun to watch though!