Bonsai soil mixes

RickMartin

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With winter approaching and nothing to do as far as trees goes i thought i would hone what knowledge i have of bonsai soil mixes( and i admit that knowledge is not that great yet). So my first mix was a mixture of very small gravel and sand really close to 30% -40% mixture. I would assume this will give great drainage, but little nutrient value. A question i have is will crushed up pine bark chips (very small crushed up) mixed with the soil add any value to the nutrient level of the soil.

Thanks for your input in advance.

Rick
 
Plus it turns to black slime over time. Nasty.
 
bonsai nurseryman Brent Walston's thoughts on nitrogen lock up (taken from a 2006 post)

Some people argue that the temporary effect of nitrogen lockup dictates that all organic materials must be composted to be used in container mixes. Wrong. First, the effect is only temporary. Once the amendments compost in the mix, the nitrogen is freely available again. But the major flaw in the argument is that the effect, although present, is minimal, and easily overcome if you fertilize to any degree at all. Furthermore, fresh bark is superior because it degrades (read composts) slowly in slow mixes making nitrogen lockup negligible for all intents and purposes. On the other hand, composted material continues to breakdown and will still exhibit small nitrogen lockup effects.

As far as the sand goes, I've been using something like that for 10 years. Specifically, I've
used river sand and chicken grit (crushed granite). I'm starting to have misgivings about
non porous aggregate. According to Graham Potter, these materials don't
actually improve drainage all that much. I realize that it seems counter intuitive, but my experience is in line with Potter's observation. I'm slowly replacing my granite and river sand with turface, but if I could afford it, I might buy a pallet of 1/8" to 1/4" pumice or lava rock.
 
The bark doesn't really slime either.
Look For article by Colin Lewis, and search the threads here, there are enough pages to keep you reading for a while.

A common soil now is straight pumice and lava, no organics, and it works well.
Find Collins article.
 
A question i have is will crushed up pine bark chips mixed with the soil add any value to the nutrient level of the soil
Very little. Sifted bark is an acceptable soil ingredient, but not part of a good feeding program.
 

I have researched this, actually before i made the post, but like with everything on the internet every author of every article i have read has a different opinion, and thats ok, its just hard for a new person to determine what is right and what is wrong. Either way i dont think i will be using pine bark in my mix.

Rick
 
As long as you fertilize regularly, the whole debate on nitrogen "lock up" is a non issue, imo. In the few organic containing mixes I've used, both with composted and fresh bark, I haven't noticed any difference in health or growth.

woops- just read mrcasey's post...what he said:o.
 
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There are numerous ingredients acceptable for bonsai soil:

Small nuggets of bark are a fine organic ingredient as well as sphagnum moss, ground up and composted Pnut shells (seriously) and most any well sifted compost is fine ins small quantities.

Acceptable Inorganic ingredients include turface, Akadama, pumice, decomposed granit lave rocks... And again many others...

How you mix and use will vary depending on the types of trees, your environment, what stage of development the tree is in and what they are planted in.

Good luck figuring it all out! Takes a while to find the mix that is best for you based off what is available, where you live and what you are growing.
 
BN forums had a sale "I'm right" buttons and soap boxes a while back, we all got ours. Have you got yours?

Nope didnt get mine. i will just buy akadama and be done with it. That way i can control the nutrient level in the soil.

Rick
 
I have researched this, actually before i made the post, but like with everything on the internet every author of every article i have read has a different opinion, and thats ok, its just hard for a new person to determine what is right and what is wrong. Either way i dont think i will be using pine bark in my mix.

Rick
I've used pine bark in my mix for over 25 years without problems. You can buy the bags of pine bark mulch from Home Depot and sift it between 1/16" and 1/4" screens and keep what stays in between for your potted trees. Coarser mix for growing stock isn't sifted, just pine bark and Turface or other suitable inorganic. The big landscape nurseries use bark and sand, mostly bark.

Zach
 
You don't use pine bark for its nutrient value, it's used because it retains water. The professional nurserymen like to use it because it makes watering their stock easier, and they're less likely to have stock die due to lack of watering.

In Japan, the bonsai professionals have apprentices to monitor the trees daily, if not continuously and water the trees as needed. This allows them to use a pure inorganic mix, no pine bark, no peat moss. Nutrition can be carefully controlled with fertilizer. In general, they use an inorganic soil mix, and use organic fertilizer.

The inorganic mix they use is generally based on akadama, rivers sand, and lava. Their "river sand" is different than ours. Japan is a volcanic island, and their river sand is volcanic in origin. It's rounded pellets. Akadama is rounded. Their lava rock is rounded pellets.

Anyone notice I used the word "rounded" to describe all three components?

The particle shape is important. Rounded shapes of a similar size won't compact. There will be air space in between the particles. Think of a jar of marbles. Even full of marbles, there's lots of empty space.

This shape provides for lots of exposure to oxygen, which roots need. Also provides for great drainage. But, it also means that roots and the rootball can dry out quickly. Thus the need for apprentices to be on constant alert for watering. In fact, the apprentices call themselves "watering drones"!

Akadama does retain more water than the other components, so for trees that need more water, the mix is adjusted to have a greater percentage of akadama.

Here in the USA, we substitute pumice to replace the Japanese river sand.

Now that you know about the "ideal" mix, to have to determine if it is right for you. Can you water every day? Sometimes two or three times a day? Can you set up an auto watering system? If you cannot, then maybe you have to compromise on your mix. Maybe adding more akadama is all that's needed. Some trees will do just fine in a pure akadama soil.

Or maybe you do need to include some pine bark for water retention.

The proper soil mix for you is dependent upon your ability to water your trees. Not nutrition. Nutrition is provided by fertilizer.
 
Some barks slime some don't. Some do with certain other parts that keep air flow low, (soil,fine sand) that wont with larger particles, (pumice,lava.)

Either way. You can not control the nutrients it provides, or the rate at which it composts and keep your tree watered correctly.

I would stay with inorganics, and feed under your control.

Read Smokes post on CEC? Values.

Sorce
 
After much reading i have decided to go with inorganic mix. as far as when i can water, i can water whenever the trees need it..last summer sometimes i had to water 3 times a day, but i do know the mix i have now in one of my new trees i got holds way to much water. i haven't watered that tree in a little over a week.

Rick
 
The one inorganic component I would recommend without hesitation is pumice. It is light and does not break down. I believe it is considered a "dry" component because it does not retain a lot of water but does retain some. Particle size will effect water retention.

I have used it straight with about 10-15% pine bark for my pines with good results. I might add something a little more water retentive for deciduous trees.

I use Dry Stall. For me it is readily available and fairly cheap at ~$20 / 40# bag. My only complaint is that I wish the particle size was a little bit bigger. You should be able to find a distributer through the website.
 
I have researched this, actually before i made the post, but like with everything on the internet every author of every article i have read has a different opinion,

That should lead you to the idea that it doesn't really matter what kind/brand/mixture you use so long as it drains well. So why ask?
 
That should lead you to the idea that it doesn't really matter what kind/brand/mixture you use so long as it drains well. So why ask?

Im just trying to learn. What is it with you, are you trying to discourage newbies from the hobby.

Rick
 
I went through about 2 months straight of reading articles and posts on fertilizer and soil mixes and still felt confused. So, I don't think it so condemning to ask.
 
There is a ton of good info on here, I found the stuff by Smoke and by Adair M to be particularly helpful.
 
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