Anyone successfully growing or have healthy Japanese Maples & Chaenomeles in SoCal, 10b?

[namnhi]

Am in Houston which is pretty hot for these. I never get to see much of Fall colors from these. Our water is also very hard as well. This year I put this guy in full shade from very early Spring until a couple weeks ago. Am very happy with the colors this year. This is not in bonsai pot as you can see. You definitely need bigger pot if you want to bonsai them.

 

[エドガー]

Am in Houston which is pretty hot for these. I never get to see much of Fall colors from these. Our water is also very hard as well. This year I put this guy in full shade from very early Spring until a couple weeks ago. Am very happy with the colors this year. This is not in bonsai pot as you can see. You definitely need bigger pot if you want to bonsai them.

That def looks very nice! No crispy edges at all!

Mine have crispy edges/margins and starting to go into dormancy soon.

 

[エドガー]

Thanks to the replies, I finally stopped procrastinating and researched more on humus and humic acids.
I’ve been wanting to switch up to organic ferts and Gro Power, and stop using Best and other synthetic ferts (due to its’ salt buildup, short term effects and zero improvement with soil conditioning).

Humus and humic acid really sounds like it has all the right stuff to help the JMs in SoCal (as well as other plants and areas of course):
Reduces excessive alkalinity
Neutralizes and regulates pH
Aerates and loosens soil, improved tilth and porosity
Improves CEC and water retention via ionic molecular changes
Flushes salt and other toxic buildup
The most concentrated organic substance
Stable, long lasting, long term organic biomolecules, can last thousands of years in your soil
Countless benefits to plants

There’s several other articles upon Google search; but here’s one of them w/ a good summary:

Humic Acid and It's Amazing Benefits

Earth Smart Solutions is an Authorized Distributor for Humic Growth Solutions, a world leading manufacturer and supplier of bio-stimulant products. Established in 2013, the company produces certified organic humate products for agricultural, horticultural, turf, ornamental, and hydroponic...

www.earth-smart-solutions.com

I will def try Gro Power next Spring and will make the switch! Excited to try it out!
I called a few local landscape supply shops and asked about it, and they said it’s def much better than the Best fert I was using and actually got from them too (Gro Power is also twice as expensive though).


Humus, Humic Acids and Gro Power sounds waaay better than the Dyna-Gro's Grow 7-9-5... which is a liquid concentrate (very time consuming to use), synthetic and honestly doesn't sound any different than the typical generic Miracle-Gro ferts from Home Depot.

As far as Dyna-Gro's Pro-Tekt and Silica/Silicon... I tried researching on it, and there's some articles that raved about it, but also some that stated that it doesn't do anything compared to the Control. There was also an article or two that said plants cannot absorb nor flow silica through it and inside the plant (so it's useless). Seems super gimmicky. It's also synthetic.

 

[エドガー]

 

[エドガー]

I agree. I was able to put Japanese quince in my landscape with no sun protection. In fact, at one point I had a JQ in a nursery pot, and it rooted out through the drain holes, and when I moved the pot to plant the quince in my landscape, the roots sprouted!

This truly intrigues me... so, you're telling me that I can plant a chaenomeles in afternoon sun, and it'll do better than say an azalea/satsuki(which usually needs shade).

I planted 6 chaenomeles (diff cultivars) by a north facing wall this fall; but I'd love to plant some in much sunnier locations that are empty atm... never thought of it, since I've always read they need shade.
Was planning to just plant dwarf/firepower nandinas at those sunny, atm empty locations; since I know for sure nandinas can take full sun.

 

[エドガー]

Bump...

Still wanna hear of others successfully growing JMs in hot, dry conditions, zone 10 or in SoCal.
Pics would be even better

 

[thomas22]

Bump...

Still wanna hear of others successfully growing JMs in hot, dry conditions, zone 10 or in SoCal.
Pics would be even better

I'm in Orange County also. I have two JM in the yard, one Red Leaf and one Deshojo, that I have had for a while now. I live only a few miles from the ocean so temps stay pretty low and I don't get much leaf burn. I'm going to air layer a branch off the Deshojo in about a month. The problems I have with all my deciduous are the fall and winter heat waves. It starts to get cold in fall then gets hot again and then cold again etc. The trees are confused what season it is and you don't get a good dormant season and strong spring growth. For some reason the trees in the ground can handle it a little better. I think placing your deciduous trees in the shade in the winter helps a little but the weather is still not Ideal.

 

[エドガー]

I'm in Orange County also. I have two JM in the yard, one Red Leaf and one Deshojo, that I have had for a while now. I live only a few miles from the ocean so temps stay pretty low and I don't get much leaf burn. I'm going to air layer a branch off the Deshojo in about a month. The problems I have with all my deciduous are the fall and winter heat waves. It starts to get cold in fall then gets hot again and then cold again etc. The trees are confused what season it is and you don't get a good dormant season and strong spring growth. For some reason the trees in the ground can handle it a little better. I think placing your deciduous trees in the shade in the winter helps a little but the weather is still not Ideal.

That's good to hear!
I have a deshojo too (shindeshojo).
What kind is the other red JM you have?
How old are they and how long have you had them?
I'd love to see pics.

Yeah... the random heat-waves are def not good. It turned 90º last week for 1 day, now it's 50s in the day and mid-30s-40s at night (quite a shift).

For shade, I planted all 8 of my JMs next to a north facing wall or in the side-yards b/n houses.... 2 Red Dragons, Katsura, Shishigashira, Kiyohime, Akaji Nishiki, Shojo no Mai, Shindeshojo.

 

[thomas22]

That's good to hear!
I have a deshojo too (shindeshojo).
What kind is the other red JM you have?
How old are they and how long have you had them?
I'd love to see pics.

Yeah... the random heat-waves are def not good. It turned 90º last week for 1 day, now it's 50s in the day and mid-30s-40s at night (quite a shift).

For shade, I planted all 8 of my JMs next to a north facing wall or in the side-yards b/n houses.... 2 Red Dragons, Katsura, Shishigashira, Kiyohime, Akaji Nishiki, Shojo no Mai, Shindeshojo.

Blood Good red maple I've had for 10 years and it was was about 4' tall when I got it. That's the first pic. The Deshojo is about 3 years old. I have chicken wire around it because my new puppy was chewing on it. I'm going to air layer off the lowest right branch. Both are east facing which gets sun until about noon.

 

[エドガー]

Thanks for sharing! Nice to see they're doing well here.

I've always read Bloodgoods get pretty big, so I never bought one. Your Deshojo looks very nice too... much bigger than my tiny sapling.

I also protected all my plantings the same way with chicken wire... but for rabbits.

 

[Maiden69]

There’s several other articles upon Google search; but here’s one of them w/ a good summary:

Humic Acid and It's Amazing Benefits

Earth Smart Solutions is an Authorized Distributor for Humic Growth Solutions, a world leading manufacturer and supplier of bio-stimulant products. Established in 2013, the company produces certified organic humate products for agricultural, horticultural, turf, ornamental, and hydroponic...

www.earth-smart-solutions.com

I was using Humic-DG from The Andersons in the bermuda grass on the house I sold for about a year... it really helped. Less watering needs, grass looked healthier and started spreading quicker than before. I just moved into a new house and the soil here is a red clay/loam crap that the builders call top soil. I will be using their new HumiChar, which is Humic acid with BioChar, and I may try some into my trees and see if they help. I know Boon adds a little bit of horticultural charcoal (basically biochar), but the benefit of the Andersons is that they are using their dispersing granules, which break down when in contact with water, dispersing the charcoal throughout the soil.

I'll be following the thread. I have a small Katsura JM that I bought from Brent and I am in central Texas, which even though it's an 8b zone, get's pretty darn hot as well.

 

[エドガー]

I was using Humic-DG from The Andersons... I will be using their new HumiChar, which is Humic acid with BioChar, and I may try some into my trees and see if they help.

Thanks for the tips!

I wonder if The Andersons product is better than Gro-Power.
Gro-Power is 70% humus and 15% humic acids.

I see my local irrigation supply store also carries The Andersons too... both the 'Humic DG' (70% humic "content") and also the 'Humic DG Char X' (perhaps it's an older/different version of 'HumiChar'?)

AND 40LB*HUMIC*DG CHARX

store.ewingirrigation.com

I read on Amazon that 'HumiChar' is 50% Humic and 50% Biochar (by description... the label picture was too blurred).
...and that 'Humic DG Char X' is 30% Humic and 42.96% Biochar.
...probably good enough? and I should just get that, just for convenient local pick-up, and avoiding mail-order.

 

[Maiden69]

As far as I know The Andersons are the only ones using the dispersing granules. The rest of the companies are using biochar, which are just chunks of charcoal. Here is a video of a YouTuber that is working directly with The Andersons to market their HumiChar-DG for lawns and an explanation of the difference between both. There are several videos dedicated to the topic. I have a 40lb bag that I bought from Amazon ready to broadcast into my yard this weekend, as we are forecasted to have rain on Saturday and that saves me the money of running the sprinkler system.

Best Biochar for Lawns

Best Lawn Biochar It's critical to understand that biochar must be located around a plants roots to actually work. The problem with most biochars made for

www.howtowithdoc.com

 

[エドガー]

As far as I know The Andersons are the only ones using the dispersing granules. The rest of the companies are using biochar, which are just chunks of charcoal. Here is a video of a YouTuber that is working directly with The Andersons to market their HumiChar-DG for lawns and an explanation of the difference between both. There are several videos dedicated to the topic. I have a 40lb bag that I bought from Amazon ready to broadcast into my yard this weekend, as we are forecasted to have rain on Saturday and that saves me the money of running the sprinkler system.

Best Biochar for Lawns

Best Lawn Biochar It's critical to understand that biochar must be located around a plants roots to actually work. The problem with most biochars made for

www.howtowithdoc.com

Sounds like a great product and I was already sold when reading it. But, the YT video made me less-sold, lol. He sounds so much like a commercial/infomercial and kept repeating "the ONLY", etc., etc. And, kept shilling how granules disintegrating was the newest invention on earth. Granules disintegrating is nothing new in granular ferts, obviously; but I guess it's new for biochar.

As far as BioChar itself, I haven't even read much about it yet. So idk how it compares to humus/humic-acids... which is better and/or more beneficial for soil improvement, etc.

My small, limited knowledge of it so far, is that it helps soil because it is super porous and has a lot of surface area, that welcomes beneficial microbes/bacteria for soil and lasts in soil for many years.

I've read on more on humus and humic-acids (because I didn't know biochar yet), and it sounds similar to biochar and perhaps even better and more beneficial to soil (also lasting for many years). So idk which is really better and more important? From my readings so far, I would think humus/humics are better for soils.

It all can just be marketing and companies trying to make a buck (both humus/humics and biochar)... irdk. (sure sounds like it tho)

I might just stick with my plan on getting Gro-Power in the spring... mainly because it has some ferts already in it (along with humus/humic-acid).

 

[Maiden69]

Completely agreed!!! LOL, he has gotten too "infomercial" centric as the time has gone by. But... I have tried 3 products that he "endorses", the PGF Complete (they have a new one with lower nitrogen for fall), the Duocide for an infestation of grubs that I had in my old house, I tried everything from Ortho, Bayer, and other big store chemical that did nothing. Once application of duocide, ran the sprinklers and the next morning hundreds if not thousands of white grubs were on the top of the lawn dead. And the HimicDG. Between the HumicGD and the PGF Complete made my grass green again, needing less water during the summer.

I am doing the same treatment now in my new home, already did the duocide as I found a few ant nests, but I am doing the HumiChar this time instead of the regular HumicDG. The main selling point for me was the fact that he actually got The Andersons, which was a company that sold mainly "professional level" products to produce products for the regular people.

 

[Firstflush]

One in my neighborhood. Triple trunk, about 10” or better each. About 20x20 or more. Older than 25 years. Just starting to leaf out. I got permission for an air layer. I can guarantee you these neighbors do nothing to it except water. It faces S or W so there may be a bigger tree that gives it shade.

I think it’s just a standard green AP, but the good natural ramification and small leaves suggest it may be another variety....or it may be starving . Also, every single branch end is curving upward perfectly. Very healthy for Southern California, so it will be a great tree via layer acclimated perfectly to where I live.

 

[エドガー]

Wow... that's huge!
The bright yellow spring leaves look kinda like Katsura cv.

I planted 2 JMs in the same side-yard (5-6' apart), and 3 in a front-yard side-area (8' apart)... hope it won't get over-crowded in the future if they become bigger, lol. All diff cv's tho.

 

[Firstflush]

So what’s everyone’s take on why the short internodes. Very good for a yard tree, not as short as a 30 year old JM bonsai. Likely never been fed. We are in a flood plain in Orange County, so the native soil is mostly fine grained sand and silt.

The yard tree is truly a specimen. It’s hard for me to believe how nice it actually is.

 

[エドガー]

My guess is (for the short internodes), is that it has fully matured and is now fully grown, and ceases to grow (much) bigger.

Also, and/or, it has tons/thousands of existing twigs/ramification/branches, tons of foliar mass, spread throughout... so, less energy concentration going into twigs (as opposed to all the energy going into only a few twigs/branches, for example). This is a JBP theory as well - the more foliar-mass/twigs/branches throughout = shorter internodes.

 

[エドガー]

How tall and how wide is it? (in feet)