American Painted Pot Motifs

Bonsai Nut said:
I have read it and am paying attention, but I didn't respond because I think my response would fork this thread and take it in a very different direction than what the OP intended. I was thinking on a somewhat superficial level of my favorite Japanese painted pots, and what images would take them from uniquely Japanese to "American".

The best bonsai has two levels of appreciation: literal and emotional. I was thinking of "literal" examples of paintings that have an emotional impact on me... The problem is that a literal interpretation of an image should be the same for everyone... but the emotional impact can be very, very different for each person. You were sharing a specific example of this... an emotional impact that people would never understand if they were looking at the pot literally.

Hope I am making sense :)
Click to expand...

This is fully a complete separate "but not" direction that this thread is going....yes I am with you!

@ColinFraser shared with me this photo of my first, lets see if this blue will come out from underwhite and what the hell do I draw with my child hand...blah blah blah....scribble scribble, hope it turns into something afterwards .....received_10214311518917738.jpeg
That left one is Exactly how I envisioned with the moss btw! Sexy!

I love the Blue and white....thats why I was so Stoked to find that Buffalo Pottery in my Riverbank! Beautiful!

Speaking of Buffalo Pottery and keeping it real....current!
20180203_224653.jpg

For some reason I can't shake the idea that we would have A SHITLOAD OF MORE AWESOME YAMADORI IF WE DIDN'T KILL ALL THE BUFFALO!

But anyway....

That's one of those things I will always enjoy by other artists too much too make it a "thing". Like I'll never @M. Frary make a round as perfect, or as clean and to my own taste, as Lynn August, I've been thinking about how that keeps me from pursuing realms....

Ahhhh...
I cant find any good pics....bit flowering trees in antique Chinese blue and whites are aleays pleasing....classic...
There are pictures of trees in blue and white pots in pictures on blue and white pots yes? Or old paintings....

Classic....untouchable....

Sorce
 
... just to get your juices flowing, a Delft plate by Hans van Meer (featured in a recent post on his blog)

art-014-hans-van-meer-org.jpg
 
Bonsai Nut said:
I have read it and am paying attention, but I didn't respond because I think my response would fork this thread and take it in a very different direction than what the OP intended. I was thinking on a somewhat superficial level of my favorite Japanese painted pots, and what images would take them from uniquely Japanese to "American".

The best bonsai has two levels of appreciation: literal and emotional. I was thinking of "literal" examples of paintings that have an emotional impact on me... The problem is that a literal interpretation of an image should be the same for everyone... but the emotional impact can be very, very different for each person. You were sharing a specific example of this... an emotional impact that people would never understand if they were looking at the pot literally.

Hope I am making sense :)
Click to expand...

That does make a lot of sense - thank you for putting it into words where I failed. For a long time, I could not see the draw to Japanese painted pots. I could clearly see the immense talent it took to produce them and many are beautiful to look at. But I couldn't connect with them because the motifs were too foreign for me to put myself into. It wasn't until I was raking through MRB's website the other night that I saw this particular painted pot that resonated with me (pot by Ogurayama):

img_5727.jpg

The idea of looking out from the canopy of the tree connected with me on an emotional level. It reminded me of being a kid again while sitting up in a tree with nothing to do but enjoy the view. As I combed through more painted pots on the site, I began to connect more and more to different examples. It got me thinking about how little painted bonsai pottery we have that reflect distinctly American themes. As mentioned, Nick Lenz produced some and Stacy Allen Muse make a few painted pots with Native American motifs, but that's about all I could think of. Steve Ziebarth made a few painted pots that are really really nice, but are more reflections of Eastern work. I may reach out to him to see whether he would ever consider an American-themed pot (mostly because I would be first in line to purchase it). I'm always hesitant to suggest ideas to artists though, because it can come off like I'm trying to hijack their creative process.

@sorce I DO hear you. It's a really complex conversation that couldn't possibly be fully had in a forum setting. For me, there's a reason (well, many reasons) why we're leaving DC after calling it home for nearly 10 years. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the current administration, but more to do with the general tension that perpetually hangs over this city. I will miss aspects of being here, but it's time to get out. The longer I've been here, the more I've come to realize that, in many ways, all these decisions made by seemingly important people in high positions do not reflect reality. I'm not saying that the decisions don't have consequences, but that the basis for these decisions are not grounded in what "normal" people consider real life. I mean no disrespect to people that call this city home, but it's just not for me anymore.
 
Hee Hee Sorce,

my taste is mostly European, Trinidad needs at least a hundred year of actively
being cultural. We are mostly a mish-mash.

Unless you count T and T carnival -
For dah Sorce --------- king and queen of the bands,

http://ncctt.org/new/images/stories/2015_news/king1.jpg

http://www.guardian.co.tt/sites/default/files/field/image/gold_4.png

Thams,

I would use those on Mame' and Pea size, smaller than 6 inches.
Shohin, is a weird term, more recent.

Like jewels in a ring. Imagine the effect of a ruby at say 1 foot in size - ha ha.

https://78.media.tumblr.com/c9daf42d5bcd3d43013d378ff7ed8f12/tumblr_nww3dw8O6q1uxht1oo1_500.jpg

https://www.bonsaiempire.com/images/top10/shohin/01-smallest-bonsai.jpg

Bnut,

love Parrish, and Wyeth. Classical.
But do you know Waugh?

https://d3ngf76mkj9kfv.cloudfront.n...-Coast-Frederick-Judd-Waugh-oil-painting.jpeg

Now that is power.
Good Day
Anthony
 
Paintings are good for inspiration, but don't forget etchings and engraving as well.
20102239.jpg whistler.billingsgate.jpg 3512aa48008cb6107281965307bfd95e--frederic-remington-art-auction.jpg
 

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Do I think that painted pots are good or bad? I don't think either but I will say this; anything that competes with the artistic dominance of the tree it represents makes the tree less--in my opinion. When we do this we go down the road of which is important, dominant or significant and which is only in a supporting role?
 
Come on, Vance, when have you ever seen the bonsai community go overboard on a trend or style? ?

Americana can also be represented with three point displays, ie:
Cali juniper, small Remington sculpture and some sort of desert flower.
White pine in a pot with coastal scene, maybe with lighthouse, beach grass, whale tooth with scrimshaw.
 
Vance Wood said:
Do I think that painted pots are good or bad? I don't think either but I will say this; anything that competes with the artistic dominance of the tree it represents makes the tree less--in my opinion. When we do this we go down the road of which is important, dominant or significant and which is only in a supporting role?
Click to expand...
Which is why I like plain pots. The tree is the art,the pot is the frame.
 
Small figurine ---------- use the imagination --------- slow the heart.
Even axe could be a viewing stone that suggests an axe.
The Idea is not to be too obvious.
Suggestion.
Good Day
Anthonyn
 
Talk about American Freedoms, and half of 2 likes are Canadian.

I keep googling to make sure this is the First of It's kind, and if it isn't....
Fittin' to stomp competition like a vole.
Smash em like deedlin' Japanese Beatles.

I got another one of these coming out the Kiln today....
Lil more sneaky peaky of this one....20180209_055646.jpg20180209_055747_Burst01.jpg

Lakefront....complete with rusty riprap wall.

GSH!

Sorce
 
thams said:
Such a juxtaposition to your typical outlook. There is plenty worth celebrating as much as there is worth loathing.

Why not celebrate the bounty of nature we have here in the US? We DO have a rich tradition of working the land and have diverse landscapes worth capturing. Surely you can see the peacefulness of translating this into a pottery motif. Don't conflate politics and the awfulness of individuals caught up in it with reality.
Click to expand...
Why center only on painting images? Why not incorporate other things into the pot's structure?--animal patterns, rattlesnakes have well rattles that can be design elements--including the simple repeating pattern not necessarily individual rattles. Snakeskin in general would seem to me to be a texture that would work subtly on a pot's surface. Stronger scales, like alligator, might also work on larger work. Bison horns have unique shapes that might be used.

Additionally, the very landscapes of the U.S. could be inspiration for overall design...You familiar with Ron Lang's "Utah Ledge" pot?
http://www.langbonsai.com/experimentalB.htm
 
rockm said:
Why center only on painting images? Why not incorporate other things into the pot's structure?--animal patterns, rattlesnakes have well rattles that can be design elements--including the simple repeating pattern not necessarily individual rattles. Snakeskin in general would seem to me to be a texture that would work subtly on a pot's surface. Stronger scales, like alligator, might also work on larger work. Bison horns have unique shapes that might be used.

Additionally, the very landscapes of the U.S. could be inspiration for overall design...You familiar with Ron Lang's "Utah Ledge" pot?
http://www.langbonsai.com/experimentalB.htm
Click to expand...

I'm certainly not opposed to incorporating structural elements into a pot's design. I've thought about that some, but would seem more difficult (for me, but maybe not others) to accomplish. Painting - at least simple designs - seems more attainable for me accomplish. I would like to incorporate some sculptural elements into pottery, but I haven't even began to master simple slab-building yet. Imprinting designs or patterns into a slab would be relatively simple to do though, so maybe I could experiment with that some.

No, I had not see Lang's "Utah Ledge" pot, but it's really interesting. It's even more interesting to view after listening to the Mirai podcast featuring Lang. I'm more and more interested in his vision of American bonsai and what that could look like in the future. Thanks for sharing the image.
 
thams said:
I'm certainly not opposed to incorporating structural elements into a pot's design. I've thought about that some, but would seem more difficult (for me, but maybe not others) to accomplish. Painting - at least simple designs - seems more attainable for me accomplish. I would like to incorporate some sculptural elements into pottery, but I haven't even began to master simple slab-building yet. Imprinting designs or patterns into a slab would be relatively simple to do though, so maybe I could experiment with that some.

No, I had not see Lang's "Utah Ledge" pot, but it's really interesting. It's even more interesting to view after listening to the Mirai podcast featuring Lang. I'm more and more interested in his vision of American bonsai and what that could look like in the future. Thanks for sharing the image.
Click to expand...

Ron made that pot back in the late 1990's, if I remember. It was visionary at the time and remains so. It evokes the American west effectively and quietly without screaming. That's actually the way junipers sometimes grow in the desert--hard up against a canyon wall's shelter. I think that kind of clever subtlety is necessary when approaching the "'Mericun" angle of bonsai. People want pots to scream "I'M AMERICAN DAMMIT" when the land speaks in much more subdued voices. Spare me the Indian headdresses and overt westernized kitsch--although exploring how subtle use of native American pictographs might be used on pots (faded into a side or two) would be another avenue to look into.

Ron is becoming a signature U.S. bonsai pot maker as well he should be. He brings not only expert pottery skills, but an understanding of bonsai and how it works. His structural landscape pots are interesting too and I think the Utah Ledge pot was one of his first in that group.

Nick Lenz has also been very effective at subtle, yet sharp, U.S. references in his pot paintings-There's one out there with a Texas tornado on it--sounds gaudy, but it wasn't. One of his very large landscape pots belongs to the National Arboretum. That container is painted on one long side with a conifer forest and on the other long side is an image of a field of stumps from clear cut logging ...
 
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