Al Keppler's Tips for Better Bonsai

[Bananaman]

Thanks for this list of tips Al, it really is invaluable. And sorry for any slandering in precious threads.

I’m wondering is this reptile bedding is fir bark under the brand name Repti-Bark ? I was using this product for a couple years before I started using DE.

I would be curious as to the contents of the soil mix. I mean what are the advantages of each component. Let me see if I can put it a different way. I assume DE is akin to pumice. Both ultra porous and both fairly light. So if your mix contains lava, pumice a DE what is the point of adding a third component equal in qualities of the second. Both lava and pumice are poor receptors of moisture longevity. Pumice for me dries out in about 15 minutes here at 105 degrees all day. Bark stays moist two days even at 105 all day


That is if I assume you exchanged the DE for the bark, which has the best water retentive properties (bark) there are and assuming you were using a lava, pumice and bark soil. If I'm wrong it might be a benefit to others to explain your thinking.

 

[Bananaman]

I would love to see some photos of DE and if it is available in different sizes. I was under the assumption it was used in swimming pool filters and cat litter. If thats the size available than that is just too small for me. 1/4 inch gives me the perfect exchange of air and moisture retentiveness. Smaller than that and you are choking air and it stays wet too long causing fungus, which seems to be so prevelent on this site and seeing all the turface, kitty litter and DE its no wonder!!!

 

[Lazylightningny]

Great tips, Al. The one on tree clean-up really hit home.

 

[Bananaman]

Great tips, Al. The one on tree clean-up really hit home.

Its unfortunate, I see so many trees here looking like a poodle and think they are making bonsai. They don't understand what they have done in the big picture.

 

[Bananaman]

So many trees to fix, so little time!!

 

[Anthony]

How much water does bark hold ?
When too dry, does it repel water "

https://projects.ncsu.edu/project/w...ts/research/pine-bark-physical-properties.pdf

Never had to look this up as compost is too easily available.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Saddler]

Your fingers aren’t supporting the branch. Just imagine you’re some kind of wire bending cyborg whose fingers have been replaced with cold metal pliers. I think you can look at it as one pair of pliers is supporting and anchor the branch (not moving) while the other pair is the one doing the bending.

If I don’t support the branch with my fingers when I am using only one pair of pliers, I won’t have any control. If I am using my fingers to support the branch when I am using two pairs I either have a third hand or using the pliers in a way I have never considered haha.

 

[Mike Hennigan]

I would be curious as to the contents of the soil mix. I mean what are the advantages of each component. Let me see if I can put it a different way. I assume DE is akin to pumice. Both ultra porous and both fairly light. So if your mix contains lava, pumice a DE what is the point of adding a third component equal in qualities of the second. Both lava and pumice are poor receptors of moisture longevity. Pumice for me dries out in about 15 minutes here at 105 degrees all day. Bark stays moist two days even at 105 all day


That is if I assume you exchanged the DE for the bark, which has the best water retentive properties (bark) there are and assuming you were using a lava, pumice and bark soil. If I'm wrong it might be a benefit to others to explain your thinking.

I don’t think you’re wrong at all, and I’m not saying it’s better than bark either. I’m only a few years into bonsai and so have been experimenting with my soils a bit. I live in upstate NY and the availability of pumice, akadama and lava is very limited at anywhere near a reasonable price. Most or all of this this stuff ships from or is mined from the west coast. So, along your lines of thinking, why pay this premium if I can sort out an alternative that gives me great results.

I moved away from bark this year in my spring repots mainly because I wanted a smaller particle size and didn’t feel like spending hours cutting up bark chunks into smaller pieces. I wanted the predominant particle size in my soil to be between 1/8 and 1/4 inch. This in conjunction with doing more research into DE as a substrate brought me here.

I view DE not as a pumice replacement, but actually closer to an akadama replacement. Though it probably behaves as something in between the two. DE holds a lot of water, it doubles in weight when wet. And has a somewhat high CEC, so supposedly good for holding and releasing nutrients. It also stays wet longer than pumice does from what I can tell.

This year my soil mix has consisted of either DE and grow stone 3:1, DE and perlite 2:1, or 100% DE. Only deciduous trees were put into 100%. But most of my deciduous repots went into the perlite and DE mix. My thinking here is that the growstone behaves similar to lava, holding lots of air. And perlite is one of the closest substitutes for pumice, holding water but also helping to keep more air in the mix.

The DE I’ve used this season is the Optisorb brand oil absorbent. Though I’ve heard talk of this not being calcined which could lead to it break down fast so I’m a little worried about what it will look like after this coming winter. I chose this over Napa because the particle size is very desirable for me, substantially more coarse than Napa 8822. Here’s a picture of unsifted optisorb and Napa side by side for a comparison.



And here is an elm I collected this spring grown in the DE/growstone mix. First picture was right after collection, second picture was one week ago. Potted into a colander-like container. No fungal issues.



All three mixes are growing trees and growing them well. Can’t complain too much, not yet ?.

Surely our environments demand different things from our soil mixes as well, you live in a hot and dry climate. Our summers get pretty hot here, but it is incredibly humid, my soils would dry out much faster in your climate, surely. I’m still tinkering, always up for trying something new. Adjusting as necessary.

Anyways, is that the repti-bark brand that you’re referencing?

 

[amcoffeegirl]

I usually don't use bark in the mix I get. This time I tried a new mix that includes bark. It's still too early to tell if I will like it or not.
Even on my smaller trees I prefer a chunkier mix too. I haven't tried planting flat on the bottom of the pot -it's pretty close though on some of them. The one I did today I still put 2 teaspoons across the bottom of the pot then in it went. I like a tree that is lightly packed in- I was trying to use too much soil in my pots.
I'm learning by unpotting trees from Dasu that I like his soil and method a lot. Very airy roots.

 

[coh]

The DE I’ve used this season is the Optisorb brand oil absorbent. Though I’ve heard talk of this not being calcined which could lead to it break down fast so I’m a little worried about what it will look like after this coming winter. I chose this over Napa because the particle size is very desirable for me, substantially more coarse than Napa 8822. Here’s a picture of unsifted optisorb and Napa side by side for a comparison.

Mike, I've heard this too but haven't picked up any optisorb yet to compare (it's on my to-do list). Have you tried crushing both with your fingers - if so, is one noticeably harder than the other? What about soaking and freezing, did you test them that way? The freeze test is usually a good way to determine how a particle will hold up in our climate.

Anyways, is that the repti-bark brand that you’re referencing?

I've seen others talk about repti-bark and I have a bag but haven't used it much. Particle size is a bit larger than I'd like. I've used bark as a component in the past (I sifted smaller pieces out of bags of mulch) and it seemed to work fine and held up well in the container. I've since switched over to the "Boon mix" for the most part but would have no issues with going back to bark (replace akadama with bark) if necessary.

 

[my nellie]

... ...So now we have come full circle. The products that were widely available then are not so much easy to come by nor affordable. The internet has built a large bonsai culture into every nook and cranny of America and much of it longs for wire, tools, pots, plants, and soil.
... ...There is nothing that will happen to your tree and you will do just as well as those using 100.00 dollar per pound soil. There will always be those that will pound hard the way it has to be done, but frankly if I cant tell any difference in the way my tree grows using pumice lava and akadama over shredded tires, then I'm not making a fuss... ...

This is not the first time that you are saying this!
It is interesting enough though (at least for me) that people don't seem to pay due attention to that.
"If it's not expensive it is not good"... seems prevailing in people's mindset.

 

[Rid]

As a rule, I hate puns, but ‘wham bam thank you mame’ Is hilarious.

 

[bonhe]

I - miss - Al !!!
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[Mike Hennigan]

Mike, I've heard this too but haven't picked up any optisorb yet to compare (it's on my to-do list). Have you tried crushing both with your fingers - if so, is one noticeably harder than the other? What about soaking and freezing, did you test them that way? The freeze test is usually a good way to determine how a particle will hold up in our climate.



I've seen others talk about repti-bark and I have a bag but haven't used it much. Particle size is a bit larger than I'd like. I've used bark as a component in the past (I sifted smaller pieces out of bags of mulch) and it seemed to work fine and held up well in the container. I've since switched over to the "Boon mix" for the most part but would have no issues with going back to bark (replace akadama with bark) if necessary.

I need to do that freeze test, didn’t occur to me to try that before potting ?

 

[Paulpash]

I would love to see some photos of DE and if it is available in different sizes. I was under the assumption it was used in swimming pool filters and cat litter. If thats the size available than that is just too small for me. 1/4 inch gives me the perfect exchange of air and moisture retentiveness. Smaller than that and you are choking air and it stays wet too long causing fungus, which seems to be so prevelent on this site and seeing all the turface, kitty litter and DE its no wonder!!!

I will take some pics of the two most commonly used DE's in the UK tomorrow if I'm not on ignore LOL.

 

[Johnnyd]

This is very helpful! Thanks for all the tips Al! I plan on adding humic acid to my regimen. What brand of humic acid do you like? Ive seen liquid or granular. How often should you use it?

 

[Bananaman]

This is very helpful! Thanks for all the tips Al! I plan on adding humic acid to my regimen. What brand of humic acid do you like? Ive seen liquid or granular. How often should you use it?

The liquid is so much easier, but I dose with a siphon feeder so easy for me. Granular may be better served on the soil. Don't do "More has to be better" it has the uumpf to kill!

 

[Bananaman]

I don’t think you’re wrong at all, and I’m not saying it’s better than bark either. I’m only a few years into bonsai and so have been experimenting with my soils a bit. I live in upstate NY and the availability of pumice, akadama and lava is very limited at anywhere near a reasonable price. Most or all of this this stuff ships from or is mined from the west coast. So, along your lines of thinking, why pay this premium if I can sort out an alternative that gives me great results.

I moved away from bark this year in my spring repots mainly because I wanted a smaller particle size and didn’t feel like spending hours cutting up bark chunks into smaller pieces. I wanted the predominant particle size in my soil to be between 1/8 and 1/4 inch. This in conjunction with doing more research into DE as a substrate brought me here.

I view DE not as a pumice replacement, but actually closer to an akadama replacement. Though it probably behaves as something in between the two. DE holds a lot of water, it doubles in weight when wet. And has a somewhat high CEC, so supposedly good for holding and releasing nutrients. It also stays wet longer than pumice does from what I can tell.

This year my soil mix has consisted of either DE and grow stone 3:1, DE and perlite 2:1, or 100% DE. Only deciduous trees were put into 100%. But most of my deciduous repots went into the perlite and DE mix. My thinking here is that the growstone behaves similar to lava, holding lots of air. And perlite is one of the closest substitutes for pumice, holding water but also helping to keep more air in the mix.

The DE I’ve used this season is the Optisorb brand oil absorbent. Though I’ve heard talk of this not being calcined which could lead to it break down fast so I’m a little worried about what it will look like after this coming winter. I chose this over Napa because the particle size is very desirable for me, substantially more coarse than Napa 8822. Here’s a picture of unsifted optisorb and Napa side by side for a comparison.

View attachment 205635

And here is an elm I collected this spring grown in the DE/growstone mix. First picture was right after collection, second picture was one week ago. Potted into a colander-like container. No fungal issues.

View attachment 205637
View attachment 205639
All three mixes are growing trees and growing them well. Can’t complain too much, not yet ?.

Surely our environments demand different things from our soil mixes as well, you live in a hot and dry climate. Our summers get pretty hot here, but it is incredibly humid, my soils would dry out much faster in your climate, surely. I’m still tinkering, always up for trying something new. Adjusting as necessary.

Anyways, is that the repti-bark brand that you’re referencing?
View attachment 205635View attachment 205637View attachment 205639

I've used the growstone before and feel it is a good product. If only a little smaller. I feel that the DE you are using and the growstone is far to different in size. I like my soil all sifted to the same size. It washes thru at the same rate and I know exactly what it will do for me. No guessing.

 

[Bananaman]

I - miss - Al !!!
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He's still here.... easy ladies.

 

[bonhe]

He's still here.... easy ladies.
View attachment 205743

Thanks for updating Al's picture. He looks very happy!
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