Too late in the season to cut back?

[KennedyMarx]

I have a couple green Japanese maples. One needs chopped down next year. The other is still growing out. I'd like to cut them back now to try to encourage buds down low on the trunk for next year. Is this possible now? Our nights here are starting to dip into the 50s and the days have been 60s/70s. Got any other advice?

 

[0soyoung]

I often do structural pruning just after leaf fall - easy to see the bones. There is some risk of die back. There is also a risk of die back, maybe less, if you do this in the spring.

But, if you want back budding, you ought to be prune during the growing season after leafs have hardened - once, or maybe twice from May to August.

 

[Paradox]

I often cut back branches in March. I wouldnt do a major trunk chop until March or April. To prevent it bleeding like hell when you do that, root prune it at the same time.

 

[MACH5]

This has been discussed many times before. I like to do my cut backs and any other work such as wiring in late winter. There are a lot of differing options on this subject. Kimura and Ryan don't seem to agree either.

Just recently I attended a demo with Owen Reich. He recommends pruning back 4 to 6 weeks prior to bud brake. I also think that some cut backs in fall will not harm the tree but again I prefer to do most of the work in late winter/early spring as they are strongest at that time of the year. I believe it to be the safest time.

 

[sorce]

There's an article on it somewhere.

I beleive Oso is touching on it.

If you want new buds, you want to chop it while it's growing.

If you want the set buds strong, chop it dormant.

It might be a Bonsai Art of Japan episode, I'm making my way through those again!

Sorce

 

[KennedyMarx]

Thanks for the input everyone. I guess what I was hoping is that cutting back now would send out a new flush of growth that would harden off before winter set in, then next spring I could cut back further and not worry about as much die back. I need to dig out my Peter Adam's maples book.

 

[Dav4]

Thanks for the input everyone. I guess what I was hoping is that cutting back now would send out a new flush of growth that would harden off before winter set in, then next spring I could cut back further and not worry about as much die back. I need to dig out my Peter Adam's maples book.

When is the first frost in Indiana?? Even here in N GA, we are probably a month or so away from the inevitable first frost. Any new growth starting now will have no where near enough time (6-8 weeks?) to harden off before then.

 

[MACH5]

Thanks for the input everyone. I guess what I was hoping is that cutting back now would send out a new flush of growth that would harden off before winter set in, then next spring I could cut back further and not worry about as much die back. I need to dig out my Peter Adam's maples book.

No way! They will definitely not be ready for winter.

 

[Txhorticulture]

I don't think the first Indiana frost is even 6 to 8 weeks away. We will have it here in south texas before then

 

[Eric Group]

Yeah, as many have said- it is too late for another flush of new growth to harden off! I did my last Maple prunes- even here in SC- over a month ago!

I want to ask some opinions on this subject regarding the best time for a big trunk chop! I have heard people talk about timing it to avoid the tree "bleeding" too much, but in my experience there was never any negative that occurred from a Maple being cut in the Soring and dripping a bunch of sap! I cut them back in the Spring frequently and they bleed some, but it is basically very thin like water, dissipates quickly and the tree doesn't seem to Mind at all! I have cut them back heavy in the Fall, winter and summer as well- all times they don't "bleed" quite as much, and I have not noticed a dramatic difference in die back, bud setting or tree vitality when comparing the different times. Anybody else have different results?

 

[MACH5]

My Japanese maples bleed, sometimes profusely, when I prune in spring. Never have I had any die back because of it.

 

[Paradox]

I was told to prevent it bleeding profusely by doing a repot and root prune at the same time.

 

[Eric Group]

I was told to prevent it bleeding profusely by doing a repot and root prune at the same time.

Yeah, I know... I have been told or read all sorts of stuff people say about how to keep them from bleeding too much, seeming to imply it is an issue if they do. What I am saying is my experience has told me they don't show any ill-effects if they drip some sap out of a wound! I am not implying you are saying or doing anything wrong, I know this is a widely talked about thing (timing work to avoid the drip..) but I just don't see it as being a legit concern after working on them for years...

Pines are different... If you cut a big chop on one they will drip a thick messy sap all over the place that never seemed to disappear... It is a thick, sticky mess! Maples, not so much..

 

[0soyoung]

That is all balogna (as my father used to say).

The daily freeze-thaw cycles of late winter and early spring trigger amalase to convert starches (stored in living cells) back into sugars. In maples a lot of this sugar gets dumped into the xylem lumens. Pressure builds up in the stem because of ozmosis of water. Cut or bore into the xylem and this sugar water (with some other, sometimes tasty compounds) 'gushes' out. Collected from sugar maples and cooked down, it makes a great syrup for pancakes and waffles. It even lends a nice taste to ham. Other maples, it seems, lack the traces of at least some of the tasty compounds.

Maples an trees are plants, not animals. They don't have a circulatory system - no pumps, no blood, and they don't really bleed in any sense other than figuratively speaking.

 

[sorce]

@Eric Group

I beleive you get less "bleeding" when chopped during a waning moon.
There is a discussion about it at BSG.

I beleive in the moon theories. If you have pictures or notes, you can verify when you have done yours.

Sorce

 

[KennedyMarx]

No way! They will definitely not be ready for winter.

That's pretty much what I was betting on, but hoping the consensus would be different. I was preoccupied with a lot of other things this year and most of my plants didn't get much attention beyond watering and slow release fertilizer. Which I guess isn't that bad. A lot of them just needed to rest and recover after last year.

 

[LanceMac10]

I was told to prevent it bleeding profusely by doing a repot and root prune at the same time.

I think you meant to say top prune when you repot? When else would you root-prune?

 

[Eric Group]

That is all balogna (as my father used to say).

The daily freeze-thaw cycles of late winter and early spring trigger amalase to convert starches (stored in living cells) back into sugars. In maples a lot of this sugar gets dumped into the xylem lumens. Pressure builds up in the stem because of ozmosis of water. Cut or bore into the xylem and this sugar water (with some other, sometimes tasty compounds) 'gushes' out. Collected from sugar maples and cooked down, it makes a great syrup for pancakes and waffles. It even lends a nice taste to ham. Other maples, it seems, lack the traces of at least some of the tasty compounds.

Maples an trees are plants, not animals. They don't have a circulatory system - no pumps, no blood, and they don't really bleed in any sense other than figuratively speaking.

Wow, thanks for clarifying that! I was just CERTAIN that was real human blood dripping out of my trees, and I am sure everyone else thought the same until you clarified this.. I am also sure none of us knew that MAPLE SYRUP came from Maple trees!

The point of the question was to see if people had noticed any ill effects from when this "sugar gushes out" after cutting a branch, not to imply that blood was gushing from the wounds on our trees.

So, thanks for that I guess... I am unable to tell if you were joking or if you thought we were all literally confused about whether trees were plants or animals.. Not sure if I should laugh or be offended.

 

[wireme]

I've had some interesting results with late season pruning before, nothing like trunks chops just pruning some hardened tips. Light pruning about the time the trees know better than to try to extend new growth but with a bit of time before leaf drop I've had lots of buds appear and set without unfurling leaves along old trunk nodes etc setting the tree up nicely for next spring. Anyone else experienced this?

 

[EverydayDiesel]

@Eric Group

I beleive you get less "bleeding" when chopped during a waning moon.
There is a discussion about it at BSG.

I beleive in the moon theories. If you have pictures or notes, you can verify when you have done yours.

Sorce

Can you elaborate please on this moon theory?