Thoughts on Peter Chan? (Herons Bonsai)

[TN_Jim]

Bonsai is like building a house, you can only have 2 of the following 3: cheap, fast, good.

fast is cheap, and is never good


…unless
vines
or crapes…?..rare nonetheless, and never really good briefly despite rigor..

yea your probably right.

can’t escape this old memory of Jason Adams here being fast and good. Peter Chan is fucking crazy, garden is, he’s always Peter Chan

Happy Valentines to him and all!

here’s an expensive hobby

 

[dbonsaiw]

Peter Chan's were some of the first bonsai videos I saw. He was interesting and informative enough to pique my interest. Whoever said he is kind of the Bob Ross of bonsai hit it on the head. Personally, I appreciated his accessible intros into the art and enjoyed watching him work. He provides quick and easy videos that provide the newbie with a 30,000 foot view of bonsai and a little confidence to get started. Those who are inclined can then take the plunge into the craziness that is bonsai.

 

[Eckhoffw]

fast is cheap, and is never good


…unless
vines
or crapes…?..rare nonetheless, and never really good briefly despite rigor..

yea your probably right.

can’t escape this old memory of Jason Adams here being fast and good. Peter Chan is fucking crazy, garden is, he’s always Peter Chan

Happy Valentines to him and all!

here’s an expensive hobby

For sure! I’d add Kris Markovich as well! Oh and Denny Busenitz!

 

[Orion_metalhead]

Peter Chan's were some of the first bonsai videos I saw. He was interesting and informative enough to pique my interest. Whoever said he is kind of the Bob Ross of bonsai hit it on the head.

I would say Nigel Saunders is the Bob Ross of bonsai.

 

[rockm]

I have made this comment in the past. Bonsai is a very expensive hobby. Almost as bad as fishing, hunting or racecar driving. (Smile)

Bonsai CAN be an expensive hobby. It can also be mostly free. Of course, you mostly get what you pay for...

It is certainly less expensive than MANY other pass times, such as car/gun collecting/fixing/rebuilding, the list goes on and on.

All hobbies are black holes for disposable income, particularly when you're getting started. Up front, newbies have no idea what costs are, or what they're buying. That up front investment is mostly paying for experience. Once they know what they're looking at, things get less expensive (even though prices for better material are higher). That's because they're not buying 15 mallsai that will all mostly die. INstead they learn to focus on buying quality ONCE. It's also possible to be a bit self-sustaining over time, as you sell off healthy, but lower quality trees to invest in better things.

 

[Mike Toy]

I used to frequent Peter when i got started
people say hes nearly a bonsai god
but others say he's an old newbie!
Thoughts?
-Blimp

The thing to remember about Peter Chan is that he runs a "semi-trained" bonsai nursery. So his methods for his business are a little haphazard and chaotic looking, but that's because he has thousands of trees to deal with. He has an amazing personal collection which are very refined.

I like to mix it up between Peter Chan and Nigel Saunders because of their contrasting styles. Contrast is where learning and understanding come from.

 

[Eckhoffw]

The thing to remember about Peter Chan is that he runs a "semi-trained" bonsai nursery. So his methods for his business are a little haphazard and chaotic looking, but that's because he has thousands of trees to deal with. He has an amazing personal collection which are very refined.

I like to mix it up between Peter Chan and Nigel Saunders because of their contrasting styles. Contrast is where learning and understanding come from.

I like that he is constantly providing free content. Yeah, you’ll hear and see a lot of the same stuff over and over again, but he’s reliable.

 

[colley614]

At the risk of digging up a thread that might be better left buried I wanted to add my thoughts as essentially a beginner, one that has just attended a group workshop run by Peter.

I have no doubts he has the skill to make high quality trees, as evidenced by the collection at Wisley. He getting on in life and as with all who have hobbies that can be time and energy consuming you become lax.

He is extremely friendly, open and honest, as a person I really like him and get on with him well. However I do feel almost everything is overpriced but he has his market and it obviously works well for him.

I picked up a deshojo maple "semi trained" in a regular nursery pot for £40, the deshojos sitting next to it that were far younger, far less refined BUT in a bonsai pot (and awful substrate) had price tags between £140-£300

I understand he's running a business but the sheer volume of trees he has and Chinese elms, ficus etc that he still imports and sells at ridiculous prices for what they are have seriously put me off.

He is a great YouTube educator but does not educate well in a group setting, I also believe paying £120 for two people for a two hour workshop (consisting of another 8 people on top of myself and my partner) AND being expected to pay for your cheap nursery stock and plastic pots is a bit greedy in my opinion.

But I have a lot of respect for the man, if it wasn't for him I wouldn't have discovered the love I have for bonsai. And as stated at the beginning, he certainly knows what he is doing.

I think his prices are horrendous. I've been looking at doing some workshops and I compare the price with the fact that I could have a 1-2-1 with Peter Warren in my garden for a whole day for about £400. A lot of the workshops when you divide the time between the number of people doesn't come close to this.

In my opinion, if I put £100 a month in the bank and paid for Peter Warren to visit my garden 3 times in a year. That would give me far more than paying £40 to attend a 2 weekly workshop with 9 other people (only about 10 minutes of 1-2-1 time).

 

[leatherback]

hat would give me far more than paying £40 to attend a 2 weekly workshop with 9 other people (only about 10 minutes of 1-2-1 time).

Yes and no. WHen I g to group workshops,I like to contemplate steps on materia not my own, and listen in on what is being discussed. That way, in a group of 8, I get 8 times the input on different species

 

[colley614]

Yes and no. WHen I g to group workshops,I like to contemplate steps on materia not my own, and listen in on what is being discussed. That way, in a group of 8, I get 8 times the input on different species

That is a good point. I'm just using as my point of reference. I had a chat with a guy in my club ask me the other day if I had to been to one of Bjorn's workshops. He said he learnt loads and while he only worked briefly with Bjorn he said that it really made his trees look great.

I suppose you're going to get different things from different workshops. I just find it hard to imagine getting that value for money from Peter Chan. However, I would argue that Peter Chan's work could develop a piece of nursery stock or raw material into something that be could be developed further with someone else. Alongside someone's learning.

 

[chicago1980]

I have a tremendous amount of respect for Peter Chan and his efforts to create, develop and sustain a successful Bonsai business. He has done well for himself and the bonsai community with his nursery, books, and videos. He has lived a bonsai life most dream to be part of, and has helped place bonsai on the world stage and grow awareness and bonsai.

 

[SouthernMaple]

At the risk of digging up a thread that might be better left buried I wanted to add my thoughts as essentially a beginner, one that has just attended a group workshop run by Peter.

I have no doubts he has the skill to make high quality trees, as evidenced by the collection at Wisley. He getting on in life and as with all who have hobbies that can be time and energy consuming you become lax.

He is extremely friendly, open and honest, as a person I really like him and get on with him well. However I do feel almost everything is overpriced but he has his market and it obviously works well for him.

I picked up a deshojo maple "semi trained" in a regular nursery pot for £40, the deshojos sitting next to it that were far younger, far less refined BUT in a bonsai pot (and awful substrate) had price tags between £140-£300

I understand he's running a business but the sheer volume of trees he has and Chinese elms, ficus etc that he still imports and sells at ridiculous prices for what they are have seriously put me off.

He is a great YouTube educator but does not educate well in a group setting, I also believe paying £120 for two people for a two hour workshop (consisting of another 8 people on top of myself and my partner) AND being expected to pay for your cheap nursery stock and plastic pots is a bit greedy in my opinion.

But I have a lot of respect for the man, if it wasn't for him I wouldn't have discovered the love I have for bonsai. And as stated at the beginning, he certainly knows what he is doing.

you can't even get deshojo in the states less than 900 bucks if at all, whats the shipping cost to ship a $40 deshojo to america from the uk?

 

[leatherback]

you can't even get deshojo in the states less than 900 bucks if at all

I would suspect if you look around in the hobbiest circles, cuttings can be found?

 

[Zerobear]

you can't even get deshojo in the states less than 900 bucks if at all, whats the shipping cost to ship a $40 deshojo to america from the uk?

I am certain you know this, but plant materials from the UK must go through a complicated USDA quarantine process at a certified/approved importer (like Brussel's Bonsai in Horn Lake, MS, and other USDA importers). This USDA control policy makes importing any materials from outside the USA rather expensive. I see folks from Germany, etc. buying Peter's bonsai and get all jealous of how much easier it is to move plants across the borders of those countries.

 

[Mapleminx]

I am certain you know this, but plant materials from the UK must go through a complicated USDA quarantine process at a certified/approved importer (like Brussel's Bonsai in Horn Lake, MS, and other USDA importers). This USDA control policy makes importing any materials from outside the USA rather expensive. I see folks from Germany, etc. buying Peter's bonsai and get all jealous of how much easier it is to move plants across the borders of those countries.

Considering the UK is no longer a member of the EU I don’t imagine it would be that easy.

 

[Zerobear]

At the risk of digging up a thread that might be better left buried I wanted to add my thoughts as essentially a beginner, one that has just attended a group workshop run by Peter.

I have no doubts he has the skill to make high quality trees, as evidenced by the collection at Wisley. He getting on in life and as with all who have hobbies that can be time and energy consuming you become lax.

He is extremely friendly, open and honest, as a person I really like him and get on with him well. However I do feel almost everything is overpriced but he has his market and it obviously works well for him.

I picked up a deshojo maple "semi trained" in a regular nursery pot for £40, the deshojos sitting next to it that were far younger, far less refined BUT in a bonsai pot (and awful substrate) had price tags between £140-£300

I understand he's running a business but the sheer volume of trees he has and Chinese elms, ficus etc that he still imports and sells at ridiculous prices for what they are have seriously put me off.

He is a great YouTube educator but does not educate well in a group setting, I also believe paying £120 for two people for a two hour workshop (consisting of another 8 people on top of myself and my partner) AND being expected to pay for your cheap nursery stock and plastic pots is a bit greedy in my opinion.

But I have a lot of respect for the man, if it wasn't for him I wouldn't have discovered the love I have for bonsai. And as stated at the beginning, he certainly knows what he is doing.

Yes, I am a fan of Peter and Heron's. I live two hours south of the largest Bonsai nursery in the USA (Brussel's in Horn Lake, MS). Brussel's is a wonderful source for tiny pre-bonsai stock, and a few (Expensive) older plants. When I see a YouTube of Peter's nursery with over a hundred several (4 -5-10) year old plants, I drool at how wonderful it must be to be able to shop for a bonsai plant like radishes at Kroger Grocery. I do know the facts are simple, Nice bonsai are expensive. The nicer they are, the mor expensive they will be. One last thing. finding a decent pre-bonsai at a garden center (at least here) is a once in a decade discovery.

 

[leatherback]

has anybody mentioned the need for certificates to move plants aross borders yet ?

 

[Njyamadori]

The thing is that he's definitely very knowledgeable on bonsai but just mass produces his trees at his nursery.

 

[dbonsaiw]

If anyone has any questions about Peter Chan's impact on bonsai, consider that this thread is already 20 pages long discussing him.

 

[Clicio]

The thing is that he's definitely very knowledgeable on bonsai but just mass produces his trees at his nursery.

IF I had a nursery, I would surely mass produce cheap bonsai to put bread on the table. But he goes beyond that, showing some quite nice old bonsai also.