This ain’t good

Colder than normal here so far this winterbut didn’t fall below freezing last night and heading toward the 50s end of the week. At least for now, I’m not afraid of any of my trees breaking dormancy, and that includes the trees I have in my cold room as the temperatures there are even now we’re still in the 30s and I can open up open up the windows at night to keep things cool in there
 
How detrimental is it for a temperate deciduous tree to not have a dormant season? I'm sure "it depends" is the best answer, as species, vigor, care, etc. play huge roles. But what about a broad answer?
 
There is considerable debate as to what exactly prompts trees to exit dormancy. The general concensus is that is a multitude of factors. Trees have a genetically pre-programmed expectation for chill hours that need to be reached before a tree can even think about exiting dormancy (a process called vernalization). Once those hours are met, it is a combination of factors including changes in red to far-red light ratios (R:FR) driven by changes in photoperiod as well as consistently high soil temperatures.

All that to say, budding out is primarily a concern for trees with lower chill hours requirements (shorter vernalization period), as once those hours are met, all it takes is enough light exposure combined with warm temperatures to break dormancy (the relative influence of each of these components is debated).

As I mentioned in a previous post, over here the red maples, Taiwan Cherry, and Japanese quince are all opening up. These are trees with an inherently low chill hour requirement (early flowering) that has already been met, so they are waking up. I don't see any sign of the more temperate species doing that yet, but it could happen.
 
How detrimental is it for a temperate deciduous tree to not have a dormant season? I'm sure "it depends" is the best answer, as species, vigor, care, etc. play huge roles. But what about a broad answer?
Cold hardy deciduous trees trees are built to have a cold season dormancy and do best meeting their ideal number of chilling hours. I've seen Japanese maple trees break dormancy as early as December- unlikely to have met their typical chilling requirements- and grew well enough. I would bet that one shortened dormancy wouldn't weaken a tree excessively, but the shorter the dormancy/fewer chilling hours acquired, the weaker the tree will grow the following season, not to mention that the conditions for growth, specifically sun intensity and ambient temps- are at their lowest of the year for the next few months. Missing chilling requirements- year over year will likely weaken trees further. That's how I understand it.
 
Cold hardy deciduous trees trees are built to have a cold season dormancy and do best meeting their ideal number of chilling hours. I've seen Japanese maple trees break dormancy as early as December- unlikely to have met their typical chilling requirements- and grew well enough. I would bet that one shortened dormancy wouldn't weaken a tree excessively, but the shorter the dormancy/fewer chilling hours acquired, the weaker the tree will grow the following season, not to mention that the conditions for growth, specifically sun intensity and ambient temps- are at their lowest of the year for the next few months. Missing chilling requirements- year over year will likely weaken trees further. That's how I understand it.
I experienced that when I first moved here to central Florida. My Japanese maples would only get maybe 200-300 chill hours. They struggle along for a couple of years then die. I still grow them here but I do it be forcing them into dormancy and put them into a fridge for three months. Take them out early March and they grow like crazy. Gotta give them what they need.
 
I experienced that when I first moved here to central Florida. My Japanese maples would only get maybe 200-300 chill hours. They struggle along for a couple of years then die. I still grow them here but I do it be forcing them into dormancy and put them into a fridge for three months. Take them out early March and they grow like crazy. Gotta give them what they need.
That's more dedication than I can muster at this point. I applaud your efforts.
 
That's more dedication than I can muster at this point. I applaud your efforts.
Actually it comes out to less effort than having to worry about them from Dec thru March. Only took me three hours to defoliate everything and load up the fridge. All I have to do is make sure they don’t dry out in the fridge. Having said that though there is the added expense of having a dedicated fridge just for maples and cherry blossom trees. If all the ones I have now keep growing well, a second fridge will be needed. But, When I look at how much I was spending on a 200 gallon saltwater reef tank that was loaded with SPS corals, another fridge just doesn’t seem that much to me.
 
The short answer is none will most likely ignore the warmth. Exiting dormancy is driven by root temperatures. Unseasonable heat warms the earth and roots. All will advance into new growth stages but at different rates. The species that bud out earliest could bud out earlier if not now then at another warm up after this one but before spring arrives.
I just checked the soil temps in my pots in the greenhouse and they are in the low to mid 40s. So they are about what the average air temp has been in there since December (46 F). This is pretty much what I expected based on other folks experiences with cold greenhouses. I have my heater set to come on at 34 and off at 36, but the average is pulled upwards by the daytime highs.
 
And now I find myself appreciating NY weather. It's been warmer here than usual, but we're talking high 40s and the freeze returns next week.
 
Portland Oregon area has had only ONE killing freeze so far. It was the 2nd latest freeze on record. I haven't even used my greenhouse heater yet. Some street cherry trees are blooming already.
 
Going to have to gear up protection mode this week. Pomegranate, mulberry and azaleas are all coming out of dormancy with new leaves and we are getting our first freeze later this week. We may see in the high 20s a couple of nights. They will get to come hang out with my orchids in the dinette area where they can get good light and stay warm.

The bigger pomegranates are still asleep, but this little guy thinks it spring already.

IMG_7052.jpeg
 
Azaleas starting to bloom mid January sounds crazy to me!
When it comes to chill hours and azaleas, they do not require that many. There's studies for florist azaleas. But in my experience, anything I move indoors in December, will start to leave dormancy.
There's definitely some that stay put longer. Those that lose more leaves and get more autumn colour.
But I have some flowers indoors coming here myself. Those azaleas barely had any dormancy, had some tips that seemed to be active even after some frost.

If you still get serious cold, that will take off the new growth of the azaleas, and force them to regrow it.

As rockm points out, early warm periods following by a 'second winter' are way worse than just a way colder than average normal winter.
Dormancy should be maintained for as long as possible.
People use ice to actively cool satsuki azalea to prevent them from flowering too early, and missing a show. But one cannot built a greenhouse that is also a freezer.
Putting defoliated trees in a fridge, I guess that can be done. Advanced techniques for sure.
 
Portland Oregon area has had only ONE killing freeze so far. It was the 2nd latest freeze on record. I haven't even used my greenhouse heater yet. Some street cherry trees are blooming already.
I’m sure my power bill wishes I hadn’t had to use my greenhouse heater
 
Azaleas starting to bloom mid January sounds crazy to me!
When it comes to chill hours and azaleas, they do not require that many. There's studies for florist azaleas. But in my experience, anything I move indoors in December, will start to leave dormancy.
There's definitely some that stay put longer. Those that lose more leaves and get more autumn colour.
But I have some flowers indoors coming here myself. Those azaleas barely had any dormancy, had some tips that seemed to be active even after some frost.

If you still get serious cold, that will take off the new growth of the azaleas, and force them to regrow it.

As rockm points out, early warm periods following by a 'second winter' are way worse than just a way colder than average normal winter.
Dormancy should be maintained for as long as possible.
People use ice to actively cool satsuki azalea to prevent them from flowering too early, and missing a show. But one cannot built a greenhouse that is also a freezer.
Putting defoliated trees in a fridge, I guess that can be done. Advanced techniques for sure.
I wouldn’t call our weather here weird, but to does pose problems for some of the indigenous plants. We stay fairly warm (50F - 80F) through the winter months and just have dips down into the low 30s or maybe high 20s. A lot of things here will get frost bite because they break dormancy too early. It was in the low 80s last week and we might hit 28F come Thursday. I just know it’s going to happen and watch the plants in pots that break early and bring them inside as the cold front moves through. They usually only last a few days and we are back in the 70s or 80s. And yes, all my high chill time trees go in the fridge for three months.

Here is one of my azaleas that started its spring growth early. It also put out flowers in December. Most of my bonsai stuff is in a heavy shaded area to help prevent dormancy break, but this guy is on the edge and gets enough late morning sun to want to go for it.

IMG_7053.jpeg

Japanese maples and Kwanzan Cherry trees
IMG_6934.jpeg
 
We were in the 60F range last week with temps in the 50's since then. Now the forecast is for temps back down to the mid 40's and low 30's
with snow for next weekend. None of my trees are showing signs of waking up .....yet.
 
Here in New England we’ve been having some days in the high 40’s F and it’s freaking me out! All of December we barely made it out of the teens and twenties. But at least nighttime lows are still in the teens. Hopefully the cold comes back for a while longer.
 
Genetics definitely plays a part in this too. I have 7 bald cypress in my greenhouse right next to each other. One is from south Louisiana, one is from the Memphis TN area, and 5 are from a nursery in east Tenn. The tree from Louisiana has a habit of budding out in January whereas all the rest stay dormant until late February/early March. Until a few years ago I also had one from the Tampa FL area but that was before I got the greenhouse and it gave up the ghost one winter. I used to have to keep my trees that would bud out early in the bed of my pickup so i could quickly and easily move them in and out of the garage to avoid freezes after they broke dormancy. The greenhouse has made that shuffle unnecessary. The climate of this area of Western North Carolina has gotten far too variable to expect some of these trees to remain dormant until the chance of a freeze has passed even mulched in on the north side of my house.
 
Azaleas starting to bloom mid January sounds crazy to me!
When it comes to chill hours and azaleas, they do not require that many. There's studies for florist azaleas. But in my experience, anything I move indoors in December, will start to leave dormancy.
There's definitely some that stay put longer. Those that lose more leaves and get more autumn colour.
But I have some flowers indoors coming here myself. Those azaleas barely had any dormancy, had some tips that seemed to be active even after some frost.

If you still get serious cold, that will take off the new growth of the azaleas, and force them to regrow it.

As rockm points out, early warm periods following by a 'second winter' are way worse than just a way colder than average normal winter.
Dormancy should be maintained for as long as possible.
People use ice to actively cool satsuki azalea to prevent them from flowering too early, and missing a show. But one cannot built a greenhouse that is also a freezer.
Putting defoliated trees in a fridge, I guess that can be done. Advanced techniques for sure.
 

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