Systemic pesticides

[Brian Van Fleet]

Does malathion kill spider mites when applied to the foliage?

Yes. And the foliage as well in the incorrect concentration.
Though, some of the buggers seem to develop a tolerance or immunity after a while.

 

[nover18]

I use the Bayer tree and shrub protect & feed. It works great.

Judy,
What sort of application rate do you apply since this is in granular form? It's mainly for shrubs and trees so this makes the application a bit tricky in my experience. It's also been suggested to me that spider mites can build resistance.

Thanks.

 

[GrimLore]

I went with some granular products prior to last year and for all of 2015.

Bayer 3 in 1 Rose and flower as instructed for Roses on all the Roses and Landscape Shrubs(I used the same as on the Roses). I also use this on any potted Fruit trees. -



In the potted Trees and Shrubs I used Bayer Tree and Shrub, I use 1/2 teaspoon on 3 -4 inch pots, up to 3 tablespoons on larger pots. I sprinkle it on the surface like salting the driveway every Spring and Fall. -



The Bayer Complete I place a thin border of around the outer walls of the house and in any seams in the concrete Spring, Summer, and Fall. -



Roses and Landscape did great, all new and took very good.
Potted items I had were all new cheap stuff, and a lot of whips to test growing conditions after having a bacterial problem in Spring. They all did good and continue to.
No Ants or anything trying to get in the house either.

I noticed you are also in SE Pennsylvania. I never have had mites on outdoor plants even when I was not using all of the above... I have had them show up on indoor plants in the past and will switch from Malathion to Bayer Natria when I run out of concentrate. I apply the Malathion outdoors and bring the plant back in but it has an odor I am not fond of. will work on mites just as good indoors and outdoors. -



Also I find it important to note we have Eastern Honey Bees by the hundreds nesting under our attached shed foundation, Praying Mantis breeding by the dozens, and Assassin Bugs all unaffected so far... That I cannot explain but this is what works for me so far after trying and using a LOT of different other chemicals.

Is it cheap - NO, does it work - YES.

I must add I had to use a Bactericide this past Spring to treat the property. I did notice that my Fruit trees that were left did not require Copper Fungicide in 2015.

Grimmy

 

[JudyB]

I would say that on a large pot I use about 1/8 cup. About enough to create a thin layer of the beads on the entire surface, then I use my small rake to lightly dig it into the top of the soil.

 

[carp]

Keep in mind that each pesticide's active ingredient has an intended use. Identify the pest, and then determine which pesticide you should apply. Applying pesticides unwarrentedly kills beneficiary preying insects as well as pollinators. You should also be cycling the pesticides you use, as already noted in this thread, because insects build a tolerance from repeated usage. The best "preventative" measure to take against pests is the keep your plants healthy and only treat them when its warranted. Use organic treatments first.

 

[GrimLore]

Applying pesticides unwarrentedly kills beneficiary preying insects as well as pollinators.

Also I find it important to note we have Eastern Honey Bees by the hundreds nesting under our attached shed foundation, Praying Mantis breeding by the dozens, and Assassin Bugs all unaffected so far... That I cannot explain but this is what works for me so far after trying and using a LOT of different other chemicals.

Pretty certain it depends on your use related to the size and scope or your condensed world - Anytime you are up here in the Summer PM me and come by to see the results we have, doors unlocked, grill usually ready, and beers/liquor in a peaceful setting.

Grimmy

 

[carp]

Pretty certain it depends on your use related to the size and scope or your condensed world - Anytime you are up here in the Summer PM me and come by to see the results we have, doors unlocked, grill usually ready, and beers/liquor in a peaceful setting.

Grimmy

I work in a plant nursery full time, as well as my curatorship....I have seen the results.

 

[carp]

Your yard is full of insects, both good and bad. Kill all of the good ones and the bad ones have no predators.

 

[markyscott]

I'm curious to know if any of you have a dormant spray regimen. Dormant sprays are a lot less toxic and can really reduce your dependence on harsh chemicals during the growing season. My climate is ideal for a number of pests (spider mites, scale, thrips, and white fly to name a few) and fungi. Spider mites on shimpaku, black spot on elms, and wilt on maple are seriously the bain of my existence. So I use a dormant oil and a lime sulfur spray during what is loosely referred to as winter here in Houston. I really believe it helps set any overwintering bugs and fungus back significantly before spring and cuts your reliance on heavy duty chemicals during the growing season.

I follow these instructions:

The challenge in Houston is giving the time between dormant oil and lime sulfur spraying 4 weeks - our dormant season is barely that long. It 's 80 degrees already and the trees are starting to move - they didn't lose their leaves until mid January.

But it's ok - I'm sure that a warm winter means a cool summer. After all, there would be no justice if we had a warm winter AND a warm summer - no justice at all.

Scott

 

[Potawatomi13]

While we are discussing pesticides, I was reading about vine weevil larvae and treating the soil with predatory nematodes. Has anyone unfortunately had to deal with these nasty larvae and successfully treated them with the nematodes or something else? Do the nematodes cause any potential problems themselves?

Aren't there parasites/nematodes in Florida and the tropics that cause their own problems? Maybe, Bonsai Jack here or Sawgrass can chime in.

I used nematodes a couple of years to kill crane fly larva that eat roots and still saw hatching out. Decided was worthless at least for them.

 

[nover18]

I went with some granular products prior to last year and for all of 2015.

Bayer 3 in 1 Rose and flower as instructed for Roses on all the Roses and Landscape Shrubs(I used the same as on the Roses). I also use this on any potted Fruit trees. -

View attachment 94778

In the potted Trees and Shrubs I used Bayer Tree and Shrub, I use 1/2 teaspoon on 3 -4 inch pots, up to 3 tablespoons on larger pots. I sprinkle it on the surface like salting the driveway every Spring and Fall. -

View attachment 94779

The Bayer Complete I place a thin border of around the outer walls of the house and in any seams in the concrete Spring, Summer, and Fall. -

View attachment 94781

Roses and Landscape did great, all new and took very good.
Potted items I had were all new cheap stuff, and a lot of whips to test growing conditions after having a bacterial problem in Spring. They all did good and continue to.
No Ants or anything trying to get in the house either.

I noticed you are also in SE Pennsylvania. I never have had mites on outdoor plants even when I was not using all of the above... I have had them show up on indoor plants in the past and will switch from Malathion to Bayer Natria when I run out of concentrate. I apply the Malathion outdoors and bring the plant back in but it has an odor I am not fond of. will work on mites just as good indoors and outdoors. -

View attachment 94788

Also I find it important to note we have Eastern Honey Bees by the hundreds nesting under our attached shed foundation, Praying Mantis breeding by the dozens, and Assassin Bugs all unaffected so far... That I cannot explain but this is what works for me so far after trying and using a LOT of different other chemicals.

Is it cheap - NO, does it work - YES.

I must add I had to use a Bactericide this past Spring to treat the property. I did notice that my Fruit trees that were left did not require Copper Fungicide in 2015.

Grimmy

Yes, I'm from SE Pennsylvania (Montgomery County to be exact) and the past 2 years have been having issues with a red mite on my pines and other outdoor plants. I've treated to some success with insecticidal soap at 3-5 day intervals for 3 treatments but have my pines are an unsightly speckled yellow because of it. I was hoping to avoid that this year. I have tried to avoid using the malathion if I can but might have to go back to this. I also am going to be more proactive with my use of dormant sprays this winter. Has anyone used predatory mites with success?

 

[GrimLore]

Yes, I'm from SE Pennsylvania (Montgomery County to be exact) and the past 2 years have been having issues with a red mite on my pines and other outdoor plants.

I am in Southeast Bucks, well within an hour. Honest if you have reddish color mites that Natria should wipe them out but would require a lot of treaments outdoors. It is not suitable for use on outdoor surfaces as it breaks down very quickly. They are most likely Clover Mites if they are damaging plants and not biting you. Now if you have a lot of them I promise Malathion will indeed help you out. The trick with the Malathion is to apply it to all surrounding surfaces as well in 10 - 14 day cycles(yes even the surrounding lawn). At our old place it is the only thing that worked in the damp area near the creek. In one season or less you will break their hatch cycle if you are diligent.

Grimmy

 

[nover18]

I am in Southeast Bucks, well within an hour. Honest if you have reddish color mites that Natria should wipe them out but would require a lot of treaments outdoors. It is not suitable for use on outdoor surfaces as it breaks down very quickly. They are most likely Clover Mites if they are damaging plants and not biting you. Now if you have a lot of them I promise Malathion will indeed help you out. The trick with the Malathion is to apply it to all surrounding surfaces as well in 10 - 14 day cycles(yes even the surrounding lawn). At our old place it is the only thing that worked in the damp area near the creek. In one season or less you will break their hatch cycle if you are diligent.

Grimmy

Clover mites!? First time I'm hearing about these. It would make sense after doing some research. I've seen these mites now on a lot of plants. It says to treat the entire yard including the house up to the first window. Am I to understand that these systemics would not work on these mites?

 

[GrimLore]

Am I to understand that these systemics would not work on these mites?

As I said the Malathion will do a good job. In my post I stated all surfaces, shelves, fence, ground, walls, etc... The Natria works on what you spray directly with it. The Malathion is oily and stays on surfaces for awhile unless there is torrential rains. I am pretty certain what you describe is the clover mite and can be quite the pest but you can indeed whoop their asses. I use the concentrate as it is far less expensive. Ortho stopped distributing it in concentrate but Spectracide still sells concentrate -



Grimmy

 

[nover18]

As I said the Malathion will do a good job. In my post I stated all surfaces, shelves, fence, ground, walls, etc... The Natria works on what you spray directly with it. The Malathion is oily and stays on surfaces for awhile unless there is torrential rains. I am pretty certain what you describe is the clover mite and can be quite the pest but you can indeed whoop their asses. I use the concentrate as it is far less expensive. Ortho stopped distributing it in concentrate but Spectracide still sells concentrate -

View attachment 94889

Grimmy

Thanks Grimmy,

I actually have this in my arsenal...just didn't use it this year. Very good in the past at keeping my elms japanese beetle free.

 

[GrimLore]

Very good in the past at keeping my elms japanese beetle free.

That was the only time I used it last season. Stood on the roof and sprayed the hell out of the landscape Cherry and Maple and thinned it a bit for two potted Elms - those beetles can be intense but last season was the worst. I am happy they drop in two weeks. I don't think the ground treatment(moldy spore) will help much at this place as my end unit is surrounded be untreated common ground.

Grimmy

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

minor point - Malathion is not a systemic, it does not spread inside the plant tissues the way a systemic would. Systemics are products like imidiproclid, which is the neonicotinoid found in Bayer Tree & Shrub. Another systemic is Cleary's 3336, which is a fungicide.

Malathion is an organophosphate. Excellent "old line" pesticide with a different mode of action than the Neonicotinoids like imidiproclid. Malathion is a good pesticide to use as a drench, in addition to use as a spray. If you use Malathion as your only pest control, insects like mealy bug can develop resistance. Resistance is the reason Malathion "dropped out of favor" to other pesticides. Enough time has passed, that if you use Malathion in alternation with different mode of action pesticides, it is very effective.

Always in your "regular" pest control plan, try to alternate pesticides with products from different mode of action groups. For example alternating between a synthetic pyrethroid, a synthetic neonicotinoid, and perhaps a organophosphate. Point is change up mode of action, use pesticides from at least 2 different mode groups. You want to avoid developing a resident population of critters that are resistant to your spray of choice. This is particularly important with fungicides, as they can develop resistance quicker than insects.

Check your local Ag Extension websites for IPM, integrated pest management. You won't have to dig far to find charts listing modes of action and the trade names of pesticides in each.

 

[GrimLore]

Check your local Ag Extension websites for IPM, integrated pest management. You won't have to dig far to find charts listing modes of action and the trade names of pesticides in each.

Oh I understand all of what you said and have slowly experimented and adjusted to different uses and applications. There are two AG Extensions within a couple of hours from me and they are a great help indeed. They diagnosed my pseudomonas syringae and were very helpful with that as well. I must tell you though I found talking to the Field rep at Nufarm where I got the bactericide from and a Southern Grower I know were even more helpful when it came to property treatment.

I was sharing with @nover18 what I do in this area in pretty good detail as he lives very close to my place rather then see him play hit/miss games like I had done in the past. Sharing that information will save him a lot of time, headaches and ill spent money Not the same for all I must agree but we are local to each other.

Grimmy

 

[Dav4]

I'm curious to know if any of you have a dormant spray regimen. Dormant sprays are a lot less toxic and can really reduce your dependence on harsh chemicals during the growing season. My climate is ideal for a number of pests (spider mites, scale, thrips, and white fly to name a few) and fungi. Spider mites on shimpaku, black spot on elms, and wilt on maple are seriously the bain of my existence. So I use a dormant oil and a lime sulfur spray during what is loosely referred to as winter here in Houston. I really believe it helps set any overwintering bugs and fungus back significantly before spring and cuts your reliance on heavy duty chemicals during the growing season.

I follow these instructions:

The challenge in Houston is giving the time between dormant oil and lime sulfur spraying 4 weeks - our dormant season is barely that long. It 's 80 degrees already and the trees are starting to move - they didn't lose their leaves until mid January.

But it's ok - I'm sure that a warm winter means a cool summer. After all, there would be no justice if we had a warm winter AND a warm summer - no justice at all.

Scott

I apply a dormant oil once in November and again around now. Unfortunately, I still have issues with spider mites despite the routine...I suspect the landscape junipers contribute significantly to the local mite population.

 

[GrimLore]

I do a dormant oils pray once in November and again around now. Unfortunately, I still have issues with spider mites despite the routine...I suspect the landscape junipers contribute significantly to the local mite population.

Curious and honest question. Do you find that your new climate reflects the spider mite population? For instance we rarely see them up here unless they are packed along as a bonus from a more Southern location. Never really see them other then in our quarantine area on occasion when bringing in new plants.

Grimmy