Princess Persimmon: Best time to move from grow bed to training pot?

[Iamtheuniballer]

Hey everyone,

I have about 10 princess persimmons (male and female) that are all from root cuttings and have been in a grow bed for the last 2 years. I'm located in Raleigh, NC (7b), and trying to determine whether I should be collecting them now and moving to training pots. I have read that fall is the best time to collect if you can protect them but I'm not sure why fall is the best time to collect them.

When collecting them, how much root work and pruning would you do it I was collecting them in the fall?

 

[A. Gorilla]

3:15

 

[Tidal Bonsai]

How thick are the trunks? Princess persimmon grow slow in the one season I had mine. If you are aiming for shohin, I would leave them until they have at least 1.5 inch trunks.

 

[Iamtheuniballer]

How thick are the trunks? Princess persimmon grow slow in the one season I had mine. If you are aiming for shohin, I would leave them until they have at least 1.5 inch trunks.

Some are that size, some are smaller. My issue is that I am tearing out the grow bed in spring and moving it to a different area in my yard.

 

[Tidal Bonsai]

Some are that size, some are smaller. My issue is that I am tearing out the grow bed in spring and moving it to a different area in my yard.

Then I guess you don't have a choice, lol!

 

[Shogun610]

For your area , I’d really suggest calling Julian Adams he would be best to consult. Up here he advised to touch roots in late winter ,early spring before buds even moved and to protect from any frost. But near you I’d imagine it’s closer to his zone. I’ll be better to say once I repot the bunch I have during that time regarding how they respond to root pruning .

 

[garywood]

Hey everyone,

I have about 10 princess persimmons (male and female) that are all from root cuttings and have been in a grow bed for the last 2 years. I'm located in Raleigh, NC (7b), and trying to determine whether I should be collecting them now and moving to training pots. I have read that fall is the best time to collect if you can protect them but I'm not sure why fall is the best time to collect them.

When collecting them, how much root work and pruning would you do it I was collecting them in the fall?

If you took the root cuttings and had reasonable success, then that should give you an idea of when. They can be root pruned fairly aggressive but must stabilized when they are transplanted.

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Japanese books and magazines recommend repotting in Autumn. I have repotted Diospyros virginiana in spring, summer and autumn. I found the best survival rate for virginiana is to not repot them at all, the second best was autumn.

Repotting Diospyros is always fraught with danger. If or when you repot, do as little root pruning as practical, or possible. Aggressive root pruning will frequently result in "sudden death". Or sometimes a long lingering death from a fungi or bacterial issue.

Do remove dead and decaying roots when you repot, they will come away easily in your hand with just a light tug. Cut roots only if you can't fold the remaining roots to fit in the new pot. The less you cut the better.

After repotting, winter storage should be protected from freezing hard and long enough to freeze the roots solid.

At least that is my experience so far.

Repotting in spring is not impossible, but I lost about 50% of my seedlings repotting at this time. Perhaps there was a factor other than timing responsible? But so far the only element I have identified is timing.

Repotting seedlings in summer seemed to work better than spring. Not quite as good as early autumn.

Those are my experiences, with American persimmon, rather than D. rhombifolia, the Princess persimmon.

 

[Ohmy222]

Japanese books and magazines recommend repotting in Autumn. I have repotted Diospyros virginiana in spring, summer and autumn. I found the best survival rate for virginiana is to not repot them at all, the second best was autumn.

Repotting Diospyros is always fraught with danger. If or when you repot, do as little root pruning as practical, or possible. Aggressive root pruning will frequently result in "sudden death". Or sometimes a long lingering death from a fungi or bacterial issue.

Do remove dead and decaying roots when you repot, they will come away easily in your hand with just a light tug. Cut roots only if you can't fold the remaining roots to fit in the new pot. The less you cut the better.

After repotting, winter storage should be protected from freezing hard and long enough to freeze the roots solid.

At least that is my experience so far.

Repotting in spring is not impossible, but I lost about 50% of my seedlings repotting at this time. Perhaps there was a factor other than timing responsible? But so far the only element I have identified is timing.

Repotting seedlings in summer seemed to work better than spring. Not quite as good as early autumn.

Those are my experiences, with American persimmon, rather than D. rhombifolia, the Princess persimmon.

Julian Adams actually told me they do not like repotting at all and to do minimal work on them. He also said early spring is when he does them.

 

[Canada Bonsai]

There's a nuance to spring-time repotting that Julian Adams emphasizes in International Bonsai 2016.4:

"Once buds start to swell, the probability of successfully repotting diminishes greatly. Princess persimmon should be among the earliest plants repotted in spring, always before its buds swell".

This article (link below) says autumn is best, and that spring is also possible with the added caution that repotting "when new shoots are moving is strictly prohibited. The fact that the buds are moving means that the root activity is already active. If you cut the roots at this time, the tree vigor will drop and it will adversely affect the fruit, so be sure to avoid it.":

老鴉柿（ロウヤガキ）の育て方

老鴉柿は根の成長が旺盛ですが、根を切られると樹勢が落ちて回復に時間がかかることがあります。しかし植え替えに躊躇して何年もそのままにしていると、直根ばかり走って小根が充実せず、結果的に根を強く切らなければいけない事態になります。

bonsai.shinto-kimiko.com

 

[Iamtheuniballer]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone.