I tend to get to this point and then mangle the chop, so I thought I'd throw it out to the BNutters for some guidance before chopping (next spring). I cut this trident back in the late winter and just let it grow this season. I cut it straight across this time and not on an angle. I want to use the big branch on the right as my new leader. Do I angle the cut next spring? How low should I cut down on the left? Should I graft an opposing branch first?
Please Help me Chop This Trident
- Thread starter dbonsaiw
- Start date
Gabler
Masterpiece
You certainly can't graft that branch after.
Gabler
Masterpiece
Hold on a sec. Now I see you have two branches wired for thread grafts. Still, I don't retract my statement with regard to the left-emerging branch you've wired down and to the right. Why wire it down if you plan to chop it off?
I wasn't sure how best to proceed and after a few beers things just happen. If I go the grafting way, I would graft the new opposing branch from the branch growing off the leader and do another graft low down from the left branch for a sacrifice branch. So I wired them now as they seem to be thickening up and I'll have a harder time wiring them later. If I do that, I would not be chopping next year and would wait for the year after when the grafts fully take. Alternatively, the question is can I skip the graft and cut on an angle next year without an opposing branch graft (or am I risking die back)?
Gabler
Masterpiece
I don't know. Do tridents usually die back if you don't have a pair of branches to cut back to? With other species, I find that one vigorous branch is generally more than sufficient to prevent dieback.
Eckhoffw
Masterpiece
Are you planing on a broom style with this?
If so, your new shoots will work. Otherwise maybe consider something like this, and forget about the graft.
I know, a big scar to heal. But tridents -from my little experience- are very vigorous, and wounds heal pretty quickly.Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
Agree. Forget the graft. You already have a branch at that point although it appears to be growing straight up. Cutting that smaller branch just above the base should get a few new shoots growing. Then you can choose 1 or 2 and wire them into branch positions.
Even if no branch present chopping the angle will usually cause some buds to pop around the base of the new leader. Just choose the best placed to become a branch.
These are all little refinements we gradually learn with experience.
Even if no branch present chopping the angle will usually cause some buds to pop around the base of the new leader. Just choose the best placed to become a branch.
Chopping to leave opposite buds almost always results in 2 or more strong shoots that will overthicken the trunk at that point. I've learned to chop at an angle to remove the opposite side buds or at least refine the chop after the new shoots get started so that there's only one strong new leader.
These are all little refinements we gradually learn with experience.
Maiden69
Masterpiece
I'm not as experienced as Shibui, so take this with a grain of salt... if you are happy with the thickness of the tree and plan on using the large branch as your new leader I don't see the need of chopping the tree again. I would cut the heavy branch on the left and the small one growing straight at you in the front. graft the branch you suggested in the yellow area, and once it takes chop at least 2 nodes out. Also, forget about the branch you wired on the right as a possible graft and chop that one too. carve the joint between the new leader and the left branch in a slight V and keep the branch wired as you have it. That will start the taper between the trunk and the branch.
Very bad at renderings... but this could be a start. In addition to the back budding you will get from the pruning.
Very bad at renderings... but this could be a start. In addition to the back budding you will get from the pruning.
Sorry for the newb question, but when cutting on an angle am I cutting past the node from which the leader is growing? I assume so, because otherwise it is just a straight chop.
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
No need to apologise for asking questions. Some of us have been doing bonsai for so long we forget that others do not have some basic understanding. We need to be pulled up and brough back down occasionally.
Here's your tree with some marks to help illustrate (I hope).
The previous chop has created inverse taper which will continue to grow if left as is or even if just the branch heading left is retained.
Red line indicates an angle cut that removes the knob and the opposite branch.
Blue line marks the existing branch that can be a source of new side branch. Chop it short. You'll almost certainly get some buds from the base where it grows from the main trunk. Select one of those that's growing roughly in the desired direction and wire it, while still pliable, to become the branch you need at that bend - indicated by green line.
This process won't give you a lower branch but if the chop is done in conjunction with reducing the main leader you may just get some dormant buds sprouting on the trunk.
If still unclear just ask and I'll try to find some better examples.
Great explanation, thank you.
