Planting seeds in winter

[Gollum169]

Hello! I just bought some larch and mugo pine seeds. I know some people plant these outside in the fall and wait for them to germinate in the spring. I live in zone 4 and we still have several weeks of winter here. Weather right now is highs in the 30s and lows in 20s but next weekend highs only in the teens.
Is it ok if I plant them outside now or should I wait until it is spring? I thought about starting half indoors and half outside to see what works. I'm very new to this so just trying to learn!

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Yeah, go ahead and plant them.
Do protect them from birds and rodents though. They'll love to dig around in your soil.

 

[Gollum169]

Do you still need to soak them for 24 hrs if you plant them outside for cold stratification?
Thanks for the reply!

 

[Eckhoffw]

I wouldn’t think it necessary. Soaking the seeds, usually just speeds up the germination process. If you’re going to plant them outside, and still have maybe a month of winter left, I don’t see why you need to.

If you Plan on sowing them inside, you may want to.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I do the soak with all seeds regardless.
Mainly because it acts as a viability check; after 48 hours, sinkers are alive, floaters are not.
That way I can more or less estimate what the germination rate is going to be.

Sometimes there's so much dead in there that sowing would be a waste of time.

 

[Shibui]

Larch and mugho are both cold climate species so it is possible the seeds will require stratification (cold treatment) before they germinate well. Sowing outside now will give them some cold treatment. Soaking overnight may not be necessary as they are likely to get soaked whenever temps get above freezing but it will make sure they start out wet and may help the process along, especially as you only have a few weeks of winter left. Freezing will not hurt seeds and they should not start to germinate until they sense a run of warm days and nights.
Agree with protect from birds and rodents. Mice are very good at finding buried seed and will take the lot if they discover a pot full.

 

[Gollum169]

I bought the seed from Sheffield's and they say the larch need only 30 days and the mugo none; which I find interesting.

 

[TrevorLarsen]

I also buy from Sheffield's and the time varies wildly by species, some 90 days cold then 90 warm. It can get complicated. They have lots of good information on their site.

Starting Seed in the Winter

Seed Starting in Winter☃️ Although natural germination is the best way to start most tree seeds, horticulturalists have consistent results by assisting winter growing with various techniques to mimic nature. Many tree seeds require stratification, a perio

blog.sheffields.com

 

[Kievnstavick]

I started some Larix occidentalis seeds myself probably about a month ago. I started mine indoors to give them a little extra growth time before spring arrived

Soaking them in a kelp solution should help reduce the stratification somewhat. Without bottom heat in my garage receiving weak artificial light, my started sprouting around the 30 day mark (with two sprouted on day one and two.)

I'd suggest almost always soaking seeds unless the seeds are small enough that it becomes troublesome to handle. This helps ensure you plant viable seeds (which in turn reduces mold growth) and ensures the seed gets adequate water penetrating before placing it in your seed mix.

 

[Gollum169]

I soaked the Larix occidentalis last night and overnight all of them had sunk to the bottom. I think I'll do some outside and some inside as an experiment. I might also do some in a seed starting mix and some in some bonsoil soil fines I have from sifting yesterday. Never stop learning!

 

[Kievnstavick]

Indeed, never stop learning!

I am trying my hand at 50/50 mix of pumice and vermiculite sifted to "ultra-fine". Basically 1/32in to 1/16in.

I wasn't fond of the handful of seed starter mix that I tried. Mostly to due with the hydrophobic nature of the dry mix and having difficulty maintaining the right moisture level. The "fines" from sifting my substrate ended up having the issue of my inability to water enough to keep the seedlings hydrated.

 

[Gollum169]

I do have some vermiculite as well. Although I think it is smaller than the fines I have. Maybe I'll mix some in.

 

[Shibui]

they say the larch need only 30 days and the mugo none;

no stratification for mugho does not surprise me. I find that JBP and other pine species germinate without any cold treatment here even though most references specify stratification.
I also find that sowing in Autumn or Winter does not stop or reduce germination either (provided the mice don't find them). The seeds seem to know when to come up to avoid the worst weather.

 

[Gollum169]

If seeds are stratifying outside do I still need to keep the seed bed moist or just let nature do it's thing?

 

[Kievnstavick]

Moist and let nature do its thing. Letting the seed bed dry out could dry out the seeds and put them back into dormancy or could kill them if the radicles have already emerged.

 

[Frozentreehugger]

This is my latest seed starting idea . I also live In hone 4 . The jugs are opaque semi see thru . Often used for milk or windshield whaler fluid . Juice the large ones here are from Deisel exhaust fluid . Clean the jugs . Add drainage holes cut the jugs 3/4 around near top . Peel back top part add seed mix . Moisture . Seeds planted at end of Feb . After stratification . - the last 30 days of stratification. As in in need of 30 days more After planting the jugs had there tops put back in place . And sealed with clear packing tape . As you can see some have lids . And some have nozzles . That vent the jugs . All will be vented . Eventually. There are several goals at play . 1 the jugs will create a mini greenhouse effect helping germination . 2 temp variations should be more natural as in night cold day warm . Compared to indoors . 3 the opaque jug should allow heavier sun for early season heat . Without burning tender plants . 4 the semi sealed container should be less wet dry sensitive . And 5 the seeds and very young seedlings should be protected from rodents. This is a big variable for me . As early spring they will eat and or destroy anything that is green . This process is a first attempt . So I have no results . But the idea is sound and came from a gardening forum . Where it has been tested successfully