Pine Identification and advice

[Swill]

I purchased this pine fall 2015 and the candles really took off while I was looking the other way. Embarrassingly... I'm not even sure what type of pine it is so it's probably not a surprise that I'm not sure what to do. It is really thick so I think it needs some thinning. I haven't done anything to it yet. Onto the pictures (images are links):

 

[Potawatomi13]

Looks very much like quite vigorous Japanese Black Pine. Stone Lantern has a good book on JBP and Japanese White Pines. Very helpful.

 

[markyscott]

Have you worked with Japanese Black Pine before?

 

[Adair M]

It looks like JBP. DO you have any pictures taken before the candles shot up? JBP buds are white. So, if the buds were white before they extended into candles, it's likely a JBP.

 

[sdavis]

I purchased this pine fall 2015 and the candles really took off while I was looking the other way. Embarrassingly... I'm not even sure what type of pine it is so it's probably not a surprise that I'm not sure what to do. It is really thick so I think it needs some thinning. I haven't done anything to it yet. Onto the pictures (images are links):


This nice tree is almost certainly a Pinus thunbergii/Japanese Black Pine.
And someone has been training it as a landscape tree...a niwaki.
Nice find!
It will look great in your yard with pruning to accentuate its movement and shape.
Consider picking up a copy of Niwaki Pruning by Hobson.

 

[Adair M]

Why landscape? Sure, it could make a nice landscape tree. But I see no reason it wouldn't make a pleasing bonsai.

 

[dirk hoorelbeke]

extra vote for JBP

 

[YukiShiro]

wouldn't newaki be a fair bit larger than this tree?

also vote JBP

 

[sdavis]

Perfect size for yard niwaki but too large for a bonsai for me and my back.

 

[Adair M]

Perfect size for yard niwaki but too large for a bonsai for me and my back.

Really? It looks to be about 2 feet tall above the pot.

When potted in a bonsai pot, the rootball would be shallower. Granted, a ceramic pot would add weight. But I think overall it would weigh less as s bonsai than it does now.

I think it's a little too small, as is, for a garden tree. But planted in the ground, it will grow! From the looks of those candles, it wants to!

 

[Swill]

Have you worked with Japanese Black Pine before?

I killed one once. It was a baby.

It looks like JBP. DO you have any pictures taken before the candles shot up? JBP buds are white. So, if the buds were white before they extended into candles, it's likely a JBP.

Here is one from last month:

 

[markyscott]

Have you worked with Japanese Black Pine before?

I killed one once. It was a baby.

Well, you can inquire with the person from whom you bought it to be absoluetly sure, but it's definitely a JBP in my book. I'm glad to see you winter it in the greenhouse - they're not very cold-hardy.

And there's no time like the present to start learning. First thing to learn is that there's a season for everything. It's too early to decandle, but you can "pinch" candles. When you pinch them, you just break them off above where the needles are beginning to emerge. Remember that with black pines, everything we do is with an intention to balance the growth. By "balance", I mean that all of the candles are growing at the same time and are the same length. All of the needles are the same length and density everywhere on the tree. So everything we do is with the deliberate intention to weaken the strong and strengthen the weak. So with candle pinching, you break the big candle only. Leave the little ones alone.

To learn the mechanics - go to Jonas' page and read carefully this post:

http://bonsaitonight.com/2015/03/31/pinching-spring-candles-on-black-pine/

I think you can carry it out on your tree.

Only candle pinching for now. Nothing else. It's not the season for it. You can use the quiet time to learn more. Read the other entry's in Jonas' blog to learn the rest of the seasonal techniques for black pine care. You'll love them - they are really fun to grow.

 

[dirk hoorelbeke]

Before pinching shouldn't the branches be in place? Yes it will redirect the growth and balance but will it be the most effective way to get the end goal? Timing is key. Make a plan. Then make the tree.

 

[Adair M]

Dirk,

Some of those candles are ridiculously long. Pinching them back (I prefer the term "candle breaking") will slow those outliers down.

It's super strong, and I'm sure it can be decandled this summer. Right after decandling is a good time to wire and style.

So, I'm with Markyscott on this. Break those candles!

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Dirk,

Some of those candles are ridiculously long. Pinching them back (I prefer the term "candle breaking") will slow those outliers down.

It's super strong, and I'm sure it can be decandled this summer. Right after decandling is a good time to wire and style.

So, I'm with Markyscott on this. Break those candles!

Some of them have long necks, so be sure you don't break them below where needles are forming, or it will likely cause it to stall out, and then form buds at the base of those long necks.

It's also getting a little late to perform the technique you're actually describing; which should be done to candles before the needles emerge; as a balancing act of strength throughout an unbalanced tree.

 

[Adair M]

BVF is spot on. As usual!

 

[M. Frary]

Pinching

You said it!
Oh,wait..... not a juniper.