New Trident Maple Pre-Bonsai

[Texasbonsai98]

I’m pretty new to bonsai and just got this trident maple pre-bonsai and was wondering if anyone had suggestions for early development. I have a few ideas but I’m definitely open to suggestions. Thanks!

 

[MrWunderful]

Get it in good soil asap.
If the nebari is decent, cut the roots. If not, then leave them and air layer later.
let grow for a year then chop nice and low.

 

[Texasbonsai98]

Thanks for the reply wunderful, what do you mean good soil? Im just trying to get growth from it right now so Im not trying to put it in a bonsai mix yet. I was gonna let it grow and cut it back a little bit above the curve it has, because its decent movement imo.

 

[MrWunderful]

In my opinion, It should still be in something free draining, it looks like its a nursery mix.

Unless it’s in the ground all of my pre-Bonsai material is still in some sort of (mostly) in-organic soil (mine development mix is pumice, lava, pine bark with left over akadama)

 

[Shibui]

This sapling is still a long way from being bonsai. I agree that a trunk chop is best way forward but the first chop won't produce a bonsai.
If you want to develop a thicker, tapered trunk bonsai: The first chop is to get a lot of new shoots that can then be allowed to grow freely this summer. All those leaders will add bulk, possibly double the thickness of the lower trunk. Next spring prune the trunk back to a single leader which gives an interesting angle to the lower trunk. Chop the remaining leader and repeat for another year or 2 until the trunk looks reasonable. this process gives trunk thickening WITH taper AND interesting shape. Then you can start selecting branches and wiring them into preliminary positions.
If you are happy with a skinny smaller bonsai; The first chop should give plenty of new shoots to choose some branches and a new leader. Allow them to grow long then cut back hard to get even more shoots to ramify branching and canopy.

Root prune: i know beginners are frightened of this but a good root prune now will set your root system up for the future. At some stage the roots will need to be reduced to fit into a shallow pot and you will want to show a well developed surface root system (nebari). The best time to do the necessary work is NOW. After the tree has developed lots of branches harder root pruning will be much more stressful. Far better to do it now when the tree has few branches to support and doing it now will mean the roots have much longer time to develop into the sort of roots we value on bonsai.

Ordinary nursery soil is fine for a deep grow pot like this one. You can also use bonsai mix and the tree will grow just as well but not essential for deeper containers. You may need to tailor watering to suit the pot and soil so it does not stay too wet all the time but as you probably have few trees in pots that probably won't be a big deal.

 

[Orion_metalhead]

I would chop this at the red line and develop that right branch as new leader.



I agree on the root work sooner than later. Tridents grow roots readily. You shouldnt have much issue and its best to get the roots in order before doing a lot of upper styling.

Not sure what your climate is like, but I heavily root pruned my trident just as buds were about to break last year and it reaponded well.

I would do the root prune this year and the chop next.

 

[Texasbonsai98]

Thanks guys! I followed the root pruning advice and pruned it pretty hard, got rid of all the thick main roots so hopefully it will survive it. Didn’t get any pics of it post root prune because my phone died, but here it is pre root prune and these are all the roots I cut off. I also put a cd under the roots have heard it or a tile works well for getting the roots to spread out horizontally. Put it in a bigger pot as well planning to keep it in here for a few years w some light pruning to try to build favorable branch structure.

 

[Paulpash]

This sapling is still a long way from being bonsai. I agree that a trunk chop is best way forward but the first chop won't produce a bonsai.
If you want to develop a thicker, tapered trunk bonsai: The first chop is to get a lot of new shoots that can then be allowed to grow freely this summer. All those leaders will add bulk, possibly double the thickness of the lower trunk. Next spring prune the trunk back to a single leader which gives an interesting angle to the lower trunk. Chop the remaining leader and repeat for another year or 2 until the trunk looks reasonable. this process gives trunk thickening WITH taper AND interesting shape. Then you can start selecting branches and wiring them into preliminary positions.
If you are happy with a skinny smaller bonsai; The first chop should give plenty of new shoots to choose some branches and a new leader. Allow them to grow long then cut back hard to get even more shoots to ramify branching and canopy.

Root prune: i know beginners are frightened of this but a good root prune now will set your root system up for the future. At some stage the roots will need to be reduced to fit into a shallow pot and you will want to show a well developed surface root system (nebari). The best time to do the necessary work is NOW. After the tree has developed lots of branches harder root pruning will be much more stressful. Far better to do it now when the tree has few branches to support and doing it now will mean the roots have much longer time to develop into the sort of roots we value on bonsai.

Ordinary nursery soil is fine for a deep grow pot like this one. You can also use bonsai mix and the tree will grow just as well but not essential for deeper containers. You may need to tailor watering to suit the pot and soil so it does not stay too wet all the time but as you probably have few trees in pots that probably won't be a big deal.

When do you chop your Tridents - as you're down under I'll add on 6 months

 

[Shibui]

Short answer is when they need to be done and I have the time.
I try to avoid cutting maples later in winter through to leaves maturing because they tend to bleed badly here and a couple died many years ago. If the roots have been cut there is no problem so they can be cut any time.
After leaf fall is a good time because you can see exactly what the structure looks like and where to cut but summer chops are also good because the tree starts to heal up quicker.

Adding 6 months is probably not a good strategy for determining timing because it does not take into account length of the growing season or depth of winter. I far prefer to try to match something going on in the actual tree - leaf drop, buds opening, etc as a guide to timing for the tree. The things I do in mid winter here are probably not appropriate for those where the ground freezes in winter. Things some of us can do in mid summer may not work for those who have really hot, dry summers.
Use techniques and timing from other places but always allow for regional differences if possible.

 

[sorce]

Welcome to Crazy!

Sorce

 

[Schmikah]

When do you chop your Tridents - as you're down under I'll add on 6 months

I defer to @Shibui but we just had a maple workshop with one of our local deciduous-only bonsai experts. He mostly said the same thing (definitely not in mid winter when deep freezes may occur, and not too late in the growing season), but he was perfectly happy to hack up some tridents this time of year. His rule of thumb is chop just as the buds are starting to swell, up to the point of opening, but not after that. He also said summer chops are good when the trees are about to come out of summer dormancy (again, just like shibui said). The main difference is he made it very clear that all cuts made in the late winter/early spring window have to be covered to prevent bleeding which would sap the tree's stored energy that is just starting to move again.

This is probably specific to our area, but I assume anywhere that has high humidity and fungal issue would be the same, but chopping in the fall after leaf drop is discouraged. His reasoning and experience is it leaves the wounds exposed for too long with no ability for the tree to heal.

Like I said, take it with a grain of salt, our area is going to be significantly different, especially if you have a longer growing season/warmer winter.

 

[Schmikah]

Thanks guys! I followed the root pruning advice and pruned it pretty hard, got rid of all the thick main roots so hopefully it will survive it. Didn’t get any pics of it post root prune because my phone died, but here it is pre root prune and these are all the roots I cut off. I also put a cd under the roots have heard it or a tile works well for getting the roots to spread out horizontally. Put it in a bigger pot as well planning to keep it in here for a few years w some light pruning to try to build favorable branch structure.

Here's a decent article explaining how/why to plant on a flat surface.

Using a wooden board to improve roots

With a simple wooden board, you can improve the roots, trunk flare and taper of your bonsai trees. Very simple to do, but with great results.

www.bonsaitree.co.za

You can also thread saplings without any branching through a hole in the board. Its basically air-layering. There are probably some articles scattered around this site that explains that as well.

 

[Texasbonsai98]

It’s been about two weeks looks like it’s doing great putting on leaves and growing steady. Seems like a few leaves are getting burned a little, gonna set up a shade cloth soon so hopefully that will help.

 

[Texasbonsai98]

Just did a trunk chop on it, I’ve read some mixed things about the best time to do it. I figured it’d be best to do it now before the buds start to swell so it doesn’t waste energy on buds that will just be cut off. I’m planning on doing an aggressive root prune and repot so I wanted to do the trunk chop before that.

Didn’t take a pic before I chopped it, but that’s what I cut off, was about 5’. The plastic is from an airlayer that failed and I just left it on cause I knew I’d cut it off.


I noticed that the trunk split vertically down from where I chopped it, probably happened because the concave cutters I used were a little too small. Not sure if this will cause extra die back, but don’t think there’s much I can do about it now so hopefully the tree can handle it.

 

[Tums]

Might be a good time to grab some loppers or a pruning saw for cutting thicker branches or trunks in the future.

 

[19Mateo83]

Might be a good time to grab some loppers or a pruning saw for cutting thicker branches or trunks in the future.

+1

 

[Nybonsai12]

You may want to chop closer back to the new trunk line and try to make it concave To heal well And hide the stump.

 

[Texasbonsai98]

Might be a good time to grab some loppers or a pruning saw for cutting thicker branches or trunks in the future.

I have a big nice pair of loppers, but they’re out at my property and didn’t feel like waiting till I go out there again and grab them

 

[Texasbonsai98]

You may want to chop closer back to the new trunk line and try to make it concave To heal well And hide the stump.

Yea definitely I plan to do this later on, just didn’t know how much die back I’d get so I cut it higher. I also may get new shoots that I favor more for the new leader so I’ll see what happens this growing season, just wanna make sure the tree survives.

 

[Shibui]

It is not so much about die back of the stump but occasionally chopping close to a small shoot it can also fail. I also cut a little longer when doing major chops then wait for the new leader to start growing and draw sap. When it is growing well is the time to finish the chop close to the fork.

There should not be any problem with a small split in the trunk as long as it has closed up after. Should just heal up as it grows.