Hey, I have this new Chinese elm with two thick branches forking out of th me trunk. I wonder if jinning one would be wise? Or I just let them grow at as such? It seems like I never see jin with these elms, unless I’m just too new to have seen much. Not sure how well my current photo shows but there r two thicker branches coming up which r pretty solid but I could wire maybe the top growth down from one
New chinese elm trunk question
- Thread starter Myrki
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Desert O'Piñon
Omono
I myself am very new to bonsai, still trying to learn the basics. I think, typically, deciduous ans/or broadleaf trees are not jinned, as conifers have resin in the wood that preserves it naturally, whereas broadleaves are prone to the wood rotting much easier, thereby rendering the jin a very short lifespan, and even potentially risking the health or life of the entire tree.
If I am wrong, please, someone correct me so that I'm not passing on bad information.
If I am wrong, please, someone correct me so that I'm not passing on bad information.
Topdec
Yamadori
Only been doing the hobby for a couple of years but I would say if you get rid of the bottom 2 branches which are a bit low really in my opinion, you have the makings of a nice broom style tree!
Desert O'Piñon
Omono
I agree with your assessment. Unless they are going to be sacrifice branches to thicken the trunk, those two branches do not add anything to the overall shape and aesthetics of the tree.
Shibui
Imperial Masterpiece
Elms often grow with large, upright branches/trunks? so having that in a bonsai is not unusual. I see the theme continues further up where it looks like one of those splits into another 2 large, rising branches.
I guess it comes down to what you think looks good - 1 main trunk or 2 larger, rising branches.
I have some deciduous trees with jin and shari though it is not common. We can use wood preservatives to make dead wood features last longer so whether the wood lasts naturally is not really an issue for deciduous dead wood.
I'm not even sure that the argument that conifer wood is naturally resistant to rot is accurate. Pine wood down here rots away quicker than many deciduous species but we still see dead wood on pine bonsai. Even juniper wood decays in a few years if I don't treat it a couple of times each year.
Elm wood appears to be softer than many other species so I suspect that maintaining dead wood features would be a challenge. If you decide to remove 1 I would avoid the dead wood option.
I guess it comes down to what you think looks good - 1 main trunk or 2 larger, rising branches.
I have some deciduous trees with jin and shari though it is not common. We can use wood preservatives to make dead wood features last longer so whether the wood lasts naturally is not really an issue for deciduous dead wood.
I'm not even sure that the argument that conifer wood is naturally resistant to rot is accurate. Pine wood down here rots away quicker than many deciduous species but we still see dead wood on pine bonsai. Even juniper wood decays in a few years if I don't treat it a couple of times each year.
Elm wood appears to be softer than many other species so I suspect that maintaining dead wood features would be a challenge. If you decide to remove 1 I would avoid the dead wood option.
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
How long deadwood lasts is due to both the nature of the wood and environment.
Conifers used as models for bonsai generally are in extreme alpine environments. As such, they're exposed to intense UV radiation from the sun. UV light exposure increases 10 percent with every 1,000 feet of elevation. That's because the air is less dense and freer of particles that diffuse light. That UV exposure tends to act as a disinfectant on deadwood. The thinner air also decreases humidity and it gets colder. Trees grow more slowly because of thinner resources (high mountaintops generally don't have rich deep soil--they tend to have sharp porous poor rocky "soil"). Their wood grow slowly and densely. Cold, more Arid environments tend to preserve things pretty well. The deadwood at elevation is also scoured by wind and whatever that wind carries. Their wood is also more resinous and flexible to allow for snow load.
Lower down the mountain, the air gets thicker and moister. The trees grow faster, the wood gets less dense. That allows bacteria to act more quickly and efficiently. Wood rots faster. In lowland swamps, things rot fast.
All this means, deadwood on deciduous trees is fine, but it doesn't last long, in the wild. It means deadwood on a deciduous tree in the wild isn't going to look the same as deadwood on an alpine conifer. It won't be stark white, bleached and blown into fantastic shapes. it will likely be greyish and soggy and full of ear fungus and other stuff. In other words, a "bonsai" jin that works on a conifer can look incongruous on a deciduous species.
Conifers used as models for bonsai generally are in extreme alpine environments. As such, they're exposed to intense UV radiation from the sun. UV light exposure increases 10 percent with every 1,000 feet of elevation. That's because the air is less dense and freer of particles that diffuse light. That UV exposure tends to act as a disinfectant on deadwood. The thinner air also decreases humidity and it gets colder. Trees grow more slowly because of thinner resources (high mountaintops generally don't have rich deep soil--they tend to have sharp porous poor rocky "soil"). Their wood grow slowly and densely. Cold, more Arid environments tend to preserve things pretty well. The deadwood at elevation is also scoured by wind and whatever that wind carries. Their wood is also more resinous and flexible to allow for snow load.
Lower down the mountain, the air gets thicker and moister. The trees grow faster, the wood gets less dense. That allows bacteria to act more quickly and efficiently. Wood rots faster. In lowland swamps, things rot fast.
All this means, deadwood on deciduous trees is fine, but it doesn't last long, in the wild. It means deadwood on a deciduous tree in the wild isn't going to look the same as deadwood on an alpine conifer. It won't be stark white, bleached and blown into fantastic shapes. it will likely be greyish and soggy and full of ear fungus and other stuff. In other words, a "bonsai" jin that works on a conifer can look incongruous on a deciduous species.
This was so informative!!!
AshleyMammal
Shohin
Hi, I like what you've done so far!
I'd clean the interior branches off both trunks. I'd treat this in the same way as a single trunk tree using 'conventional bonsai wisdom' to have the first two branches (in red) at slightly different heights, the thickest being the lowest down/first branch, followed slightly further up the opposing trunk by a second branch and then a back branch probably on the same trunk as the first branch (chinese elms sprout everywhere so if you get a good bud you can selectively prune (i.e. not prune it!) into a back branch. Judging from a 2-D photo the tree does appear to be a little 2-D at the minute, adding back branches will help add depth.
I'd clean the interior branches off both trunks. I'd treat this in the same way as a single trunk tree using 'conventional bonsai wisdom' to have the first two branches (in red) at slightly different heights, the thickest being the lowest down/first branch, followed slightly further up the opposing trunk by a second branch and then a back branch probably on the same trunk as the first branch (chinese elms sprout everywhere so if you get a good bud you can selectively prune (i.e. not prune it!) into a back branch. Judging from a 2-D photo the tree does appear to be a little 2-D at the minute, adding back branches will help add depth.
Great advice! Thanks! I was keeping that front branch to help fill it in, but I see what u r saying, the back branch should be next after those two side branches. I think I like it showing the trunk spread open there how u edited my photo
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