My Best Collected Tree- Story of a Steady Decline

[drew33998]

Well, I hate to say it but I do believe that this parsons juniper I collected(1 of 2) out of a lady's planter is on a steady decline. I have done everything right by it. Placed it in the shade. Misted foliage. Etc. Outside of creating some deadwood I have done nothing with it. I figured I would post some pictures while it still had green on it, in the case that it doesn't make it. I have sprayed with malathion a few times this year. The older needles seem to fall off. There are some back buds on the old wood but they too turn yellow and brown in time. All that's left is the growing tips on the plant. The die back seems to move further up the branching each day. Regardless here are the pics.

 

[drew33998]

One more photo of the foliage.

 

[Eric Group]

I don't know if it is a goner yet- looks like you still have green tips on most of your branches...

What is it planted in?

When did you collect it?

When you created the dead wood, did you cover the soil before applying the lime sulfer?

Just for future.. Probably don't want to carve out deadwood and stuff on a recently collected tree. That is terribly stressful- especially for a Yamadori. Even A healthy, vigorous tree grown in a nursery it's whole life will still sometimes get stressed out by the jerking and pulling stress put on the roots from creating deadwood, not to mention the foliage loss and chemicals we apply... When collecting any tree you usually want to just let it grow pretty free for a year or two, until it is growing vigorously before doing anything like this to it.

 

[Vance Wood]

I don't know if it is a goner yet- looks like you still have green tips on most of your branches...

What is it planted in?

When did you collect it?

When you created the dead wood, did you cover the soil before applying the lime sulfer?

Just for future.. Probably don't want to carve out deadwood and stuff on a recently collected tree. That is terribly stressful- especially for a Yamadori. Even A healthy, vigorous tree grown in a nursery it's whole life will still sometimes get stressed out by the jerking and pulling stress put on the roots from creating deadwood, not to mention the foliage loss and chemicals we apply... When collecting any tree you usually want to just let it grow pretty free for a year or two, until it is growing vigorously before doing anything like this to it.

Nothing has been said about the soil it is in, it is possible that the roots are in trouble.

 

[drew33998]

Dead wood was long long dead. I just stripped the bark and applied lime sulfur. I didn't mess with anything live. It was collected around February. I kept the native soil with the roots when I potted it. I don't usually do this but I was trying to be extra careful. It is in 100 percent DE. My estimate is the roots are the culprit.

 

[fore]

I recently repotted a collected PP in DE for a couple yrs. When we took it out of the growing box, very little roots and just soggy conditions. Not a good media esp. for collected material imo I hope this pulls thru, very nice tree!

 

[wireme]

Nice tree, keep up the misting, while there's green there's hope.

I never clean the bark on newly collected junipers, I leave all the flaky bark, moss, lichen etc. I think it helps the live veins stay moist and active. I have even considered wrapping the trunks with extra moss and burlap until established. I haven't done it yet but I noticed Sam from Hawaii posted a tree a while back that he had done that to.

Good luck

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

Nice tree, keep up the misting, while there's green there's hope.

I never clean the bark on newly collected junipers, I leave all the flaky bark, moss, lichen etc. I think it helps the live veins stay moist and active. I have even considered wrapping the trunks with extra moss and burlap until established. I haven't done it yet but I noticed Sam from Hawaii posted a tree a while back that he had done that to.

Good luck

Was thinking the same thing...

 

[sam]

Nice tree, keep up the misting, while there's green there's hope.

I never clean the bark on newly collected junipers, I leave all the flaky bark, moss, lichen etc. I think it helps the live veins stay moist and active. I have even considered wrapping the trunks with extra moss and burlap until established. I haven't done it yet but I noticed Sam from Hawaii posted a tree a while back that he had done that to.

Good luck

I'd try wrapping the trunk - what've you got to lose? I use damp sphagnum wrapped in saran. not a guarantee, but it helps. good luck with your tree. personally, I've never, ever, succeeded with digging a landscape juniper - and I've tried everything, many times. now I just leave them where they are and walk away. better for tree the, better for me.

best wishes, sam

 

[drew33998]

Nice tree, keep up the misting, while there's green there's hope.

I never clean the bark on newly collected junipers, I leave all the flaky bark, moss, lichen etc. I think it helps the live veins stay moist and active. I have even considered wrapping the trunks with extra moss and burlap until established. I haven't done it yet but I noticed Sam from Hawaii posted a tree a while back that he had done that to.

Good luck

As you noticed I did remove most of the flaky bark. I had ants that I couldn't get rid of. Come to find out they were herding something underneath the old flaky bark. I decided to remove the bark in order to rid the tree of the pests. I guess me being still a noob I should have read more about aftercare of collecting junipers. I have never heard of wrapping the trunk and bark in sphagnum. I did collect one two years ago that was ripped out of the ground by an excavator, that was essentially bare-rooted in july by the excavator and put it in the shade for a year. It is doing great this growing season/

 

[Dav4]

Every time you touch or move a newly collected tree such as this juniper, you may be damaging newly formed feeder roots. It really needs to be placed in a corner of the garden and forgotten, other then feed and water, for a few years....

 

[october]

When you sprayed the tree with malathion, were you protecting the soil? Also, when you lime sulfured the deadwood, did you protect the soil? Lastly, why did you use something as toxic as malathion, several times?

Rob

 

[drew33998]

" had ants that I couldn't get rid of. Come to find out they were herding something underneath the old flaky bark"

This. I suspected that the ants were part of a larger problem. I have had some problems with mites on my other junipers this year and this one was showing some signs. The tree wasn't watered from the top for a few days after line sulfur. No I did not protect the soil when I sprayed Malathion, and the tree was given several days before it was watered from the top after applying the oil. Also I didn't apply it in a jet sprayer. A fine mist spray over the foliage. But I can see where you are going with this. I will need to execute more caution in the future when doing these things. I have always had to learn the hard way. But we shall see what the future holds for this tree.

 

[october]

" had ants that I couldn't get rid of. Come to find out they were herding something underneath the old flaky bark"

This. I suspected that the ants were part of a larger problem. I have had some problems with mites on my other junipers this year and this one was showing some signs. The tree wasn't watered from the top for a few days after line sulfur. No I did not protect the soil when I sprayed Malathion, and the tree was given several days before it was watered from the top after applying the oil. Also I didn't apply it in a jet sprayer. A fine mist spray over the foliage. But I can see where you are going with this. I will need to execute more caution in the future when doing these things. I have always had to learn the hard way. But we shall see what the future holds for this tree.

If it makes you feel any better, I believe there was a good chance that the tree might not have made it anyway and not necessarily from the sprays. However, it is a good idea to protect the soil when you spray or use lime sulfur.

Sometimes when we first acquire trees, problems are not present. Sometimes, they are. No matter how great the material might be, in my opinion, sometimes you have to pass. For example, if a tree is ridden with pests or clearly has fungal issues. It is just not worth putting the effort into already problematic material. Not only will you need to address all the pest and disease issues and the tree might not make it, but you are bringing in new pests and disease into your own collection.

Rob

 

[drew33998]

If it makes you feel any better, I believe there was a good chance that the tree might not have made it anyway and not necessarily from the sprays. However, it is a good idea to protect the soil when you spray or use lime sulfur.

Sometimes when we first acquire trees, problems are not present. Sometimes, they are. No matter how great the material might be, in my opinion, sometimes you have to pass. For example, if a tree is ridden with pests or clearly has fungal issues. It is just not worth putting the effort into already problematic material. Not only will you need to address all the pest and disease issues and the tree might not make it, but you are bringing in new pests and disease into your own collection.

Rob

Yes, that sounds very insightful. In the future I will have to evaluate the piece of material to be taken not only on quality of the material, but also on the current health of the tree. It was a lot of work to get this tree(and one other), get the ton of soil this huge guy needed and plant it, and move it(this joker is heavy! prob over 100lbs). It definitely makes sense to me in hindsight now. Given all the work that I have done in the few months I have had it, to ensure that it will be worth the effort. I guess it is probably part of my journey in becoming a better artist and horticulturalist, in going through the growing pains. I do have another tree that is just as big as this one(with more challenging design issues), collected in the adjacent planter that has seemed to do better from the start. I will post a pic of it when I get home. It has three trunks that branch off the main trunk, low at the soil line that spread laterally in different directions, and one turns 180 degree and comes right back across another trunk.

 

[drew33998]

Here is the tree before collection. Back in the first week of March. Almost 3 months since collection.

 

[drew33998]

Here is the other tree that I collected.

 

[drew33998]

So here are the pics of the trees(on a super cold day might I add) after I got them home. Maybe you guys can take a look at the roots and foliage to see if there are any culprits. The planter had a concrete bottom with a single hole. I had to cut one or two roots that had found their way out. I am guessing that those singular roots escaping the planter probably supported most of the roots for the trees.

 

[johng]

So here are the pics of the trees(on a super cold day might I add) after I got them home. Maybe you guys can take a look at the roots and foliage to see if there are any culprits. The planter had a concrete bottom with a single hole. I had to cut one or two roots that had found their way out. I am guessing that those singular roots escaping the planter probably supported most of the roots for the trees.

Comparing your just collected pics with your 3 months later pics, you did a lot of work to clean up this tree....even though you say you didn't. As has been mentioned, it is best to collect and then do not touch for an entire season...especially with conifers. Just chalk it up to learning and move on.

 

[yenling83]

Hey Drew, thanks for posting this. If this were my tree I would have placed it in a smaller box. newly collected junipers generally don't like their roots too wet. How's the drainage on the current pot its in? I'd also recommend using a larger soil size and pumice if possible or perlite if you don't have pumice. Make sure to sift out all the fines and rinse the soil if it's dusty, make sure its dry before using to avoid air pockets. Also, for a tree with enough roots, full sun is a good idea IMO. With this tree I think the ideal situation would be close to full sun, maybe a little shade. I would not do anything else to this tree this year except water and feed. I usually wait one month after potting before feeding. Good luck with it!