Most difficult tree to bonsai?

Wow! ...I’m very pleased that I DID, in fact, “Google dafuq” out of it. Haha :D

Haha, yeah, it's an amazing tree out here. Between that, Gary oak, and cherry blossom trees, I'd say we're pretty spoiled for tree eye candy.
 
Poison ivy.
I haven’t read all the comments; but Nick Lenz
Hey guys,
New to bonsai and excited to get started. Just wanted to ask a stupid question out of curiosity really.

What is the absolute hardest tree to bonsai?
Is it readily available or are there many trees that just don't respond to bonsai at all?
Thanks!
palm tree. I love the question.
 
To me, a more interesting question is: What is the most difficult tree that, in the end, has the potential to produce a result that was worth the effort?
Now this is a great question! I'm going to go with: anything that just takes forever to look halfway decent, like 50+ years.
I've taken on some projects, like dwarf pines, that just won't look like much for another couple decades.
 
Manzanita (Arctostaphylos). Roots do not much care for Bonsai training restrictions:confused:.
I have heard the same about manzanita. Living here in the cauldron of manzanita and seeing what it enjoys living in should be enough.
Wildass contorted diamond hard vegetation. With snakes.
 
Hey guys,
New to bonsai and excited to get started. Just wanted to ask a stupid question out of curiosity really.

What is the absolute hardest tree to bonsai?
Is it readily available or are there many trees that just don't respond to bonsai at all?
Thanks!
Some trees are just impossible. Palm trees only grow in one direction and die if you cut off the crown. Some cedars don't backbud either.

I'm gonna say possible but challenging is Sycamore. Huge leaves, fast grower, but can possibly make for a giant, rewarding bonsai.
 
I'm very new to bonsai as well (have always loved the artform and got my first tree last year and have been researching a ton since).

I live in the PNW of Canada on Vancouver Island, and the tree I want the most is apparently one of the hardest trees to bonsai: Arbutus menziesii.

Apparently next to impossible to yamadori and propagate, so growing from seed is the best way, but they're also very slow growing. Fitting for being such a gorgeous tree. If you've never seen one before, Google dafuq out of it. Incredible tree.

I think I may have had one, this seems closer to what I had then anything else I’ve seen. It died, probably because I didn’t know what it was and mistreated it. Here is the my ID thread with a couple pics. I have been wanting to get another.

 
Glad you stuck through! Hehe

Where are you located on this rock? ...if you want to update your profile to show location (specific OR vague).. it would really help these great people help you out with this, and future inquiries. :)
Will do! For now I just have a Chinese elm that I will nurture. I want to take it slowly so I can hopefully get it right
 
I'd like to nominate the Norfolk Island Pine. We did cover most of it's deficiencies in another thread. And, despite those of you who are fans of the species as a Christmas tree, it should rank up there as one of the worst candidates for bonsai material of all time. 🤪 o_O
Haha! Yeah. My wife says she loves them. I had no idea. Might have to try as they are usually very available for cheap.
I saw some really nice ones in Mexico a month or so ago. Dang! No pics -but I did see some nice ( very good bonsai species) bougainvillea hedges there!
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Oh yeah, and the Crotons! They air layer these babies like mad! Tin foil around some moss or compost. 7118CE26-A8C4-4399-BC69-24AE32727618.jpeg
 
Not per say the most difficult to bonsai, but difficult to keep thriving in a pot, let alone do bonsai with them:
Erythroxylum coca var coca and var novo
Sassafras albidum
 
Not per say the most difficult to bonsai, but difficult to keep thriving in a pot, let alone do bonsai with them:
Erythroxylum coca var coca and var novo
Sassafras albidum


In the USA sourcing living Erythroxylum coca is most difficult. Not that I would admit to ever having looked into it. But to this day I have not seen any being sold anywhere in the USA.

Yes, I find Sassafras albidum horticulturally difficult. I suspect among other things, it requires a fairly acidic soils. It is used by Ag Extension agents when scouting properties acceptable for blueberry farming. If there is Sassafras in the field, chances are good that the soil is acidic enough for blueberries. At least in southwest Michigan it works out that way. In horticulture, I would definitely engineer a more acidic than what I use for azalea soil.
 
I would definitely engineer a more acidic than what I use for azalea soil.
Slightly Off topic but, what are you using for Azalea soil Leo? Pure kanuma? Or do u make your own blend? Just thinking I may want to test and amend mine. Thanks so much.
 
In the USA sourcing living Erythroxylum coca is most difficult. Not that I would admit to ever having looked into it. But to this day I have not seen any being sold anywhere in the USA.

Yes, I find Sassafras albidum horticulturally difficult. I suspect among other things, it requires a fairly acidic soils. It is used by Ag Extension agents when scouting properties acceptable for blueberry farming. If there is Sassafras in the field, chances are good that the soil is acidic enough for blueberries. At least in southwest Michigan it works out that way. In horticulture, I would definitely engineer a more acidic than what I use for azalea soil.
Getting E coca was tricky for me too. Plants go for 80 euros and up and seeds are a rare and expensive commodity.
But I managed to get some seeds from both Indonesia (where the Dutch had their cocaine imperium) as well as Bolivia.
They're hard to keep to say the least. They respond both like ficus as well as junipers, sometimes super fast and with clear signs of what they want, sometimes they just stop doing everything for a year and slumber.
Germination chances drop with a whopping 90% just a few days after the berries are picked.
I have a couple over 8 years old and a few offsprings. They need to be hand pollinated and have serious inbreeding depressions.
I've been one of the few to hybridize coca with novo, but most seeds abort themselves. The hybrid vigor only lasts for a couple of months.
Coca doesn't root from air/ground layer or cuttings and laboratory techniques (I've tried over 200 medium compositions and hormone concentrations) don't work either.
Truly a difficult species, all the way. There are two or three plant families that I really can't figure out, not even with literature and practical help from technicians and professors. Coca is at the top of that list. It just doesn't follow a plantlike logic and I don't know why. Every few years I synchronize their flowering and paint myself a bunch of berries. I could put you on the waiting list if you'd like.


As far as I know, sassafras likes both dry soils as well as acidic soils, which is kind of unique in the sense that most real acidic soils are rarely free draining. I own two of them, roughly 7-9 years old. But they never have gotten any bigger than a pencil, and as thick as the lead in a pencil.
If they leaf out this spring, I'll get some more peat soil and see if I can mix something up. Maybe add some sulfuric acid soaked bark to get the pH down.
Any advice about sassafras is most welcome. My blueberries do great year after year!
 
For the Sassafras, I would top dress your potting medium with elemental sulfur. A "starter dose rate" would be 15ml by volume per 4 liters of potting media. I know volume measurements for dry goods is not the most accurate, as the grind of the sulfur will make a large difference in weight dosed per 15 ml volume. But that is how I have been using it. There are 2 grades of sulfur available here in USA for garden use, a very fine powder intended to be sprayed or dusted as a fungicide, and a more coarse but still fairly fine sand like grind that is intended for soil acidification. I prefer the soil acidifier grade, but the fungicide grade will perform pretty much the same way, except it will dissolve more quickly.

Elemental sulfur is better than soaking bark in sulfuric acid. The reason is as sulfur dissolves in rain water and municipal water, it forms less highly oxidized acids, like sulfonic and sulfurous acids, rather than the highly aggressive sulfuric acid. There are a number of configurations, but the basis is SO2 anion instead of the more aggressive SO3 anion. So using horticultural grade elemental sulfur is preferable to using sulfuric acid, safety wise. I believe there are organic approved grades of elemental sulfur, so the "anti-technology" inclined won't be picketing your garden just for purchasing this product.
 
Pinus strobus. Let’s see it.
And not google images.
 
I think I may have had one, this seems closer to what I had then anything else I’ve seen. It died, probably because I didn’t know what it was and mistreated it. Here is the my ID thread with a couple pics. I have been wanting to get another.


Hmm, I could be wrong, but it doesn't quite look like an arbutus to me. Arbutus trunks have a much darker and rich rust colour to them and are very, very hard and smooth underneath the peeling bark.
 
Hmm, I could be wrong, but it doesn't quite look like an arbutus to me. Arbutus trunks have a much darker and rich rust colour to them and are very, very hard and smooth underneath the peeling bark.

Agreed, these grow around my area and have big, dark green leaves with finely serrated edges. There are a few threads on bnut with folks trying to bonsai this species, which’ll be a challenge with the leaf size.
 
For example - walnut, Juglans - has large, long compound leaves, and very coarse branching. Trunk barks up nice, but autumn color is not very good, yellow at best, usually leaves are blotched with black & brown spots as they turn yellow in autumn. So at no point will a dwarfed walnut look particularly attractive.

Leo, it’s funny because @RKatzin and I had a conversation last fall about the locally native black walnut, J hindsii. I’ve gotten mine to reduce its leaf/leaflet size and Rick found one growing with naturally small leaves.

The bark, as you mention, is marvelous. This pic is from a three year old tree, destined for gnarliness. Also even trees with large deciduous leaves can make for a fine winter silhouette, no?

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