Las Vegas...

[Vance Wood]

Another day, another ....

You are one of two things: Someone who is here because they love bonsai or you are a troll looking to piss off as many people as he can. If you are into bonsai lets see some of your bonsai, if not why don't you go and bother someone else? We have our own problems and issues to bear and we don't need your vapid arguments to help.

 

[M. Frary]

Another day, another ....

Mass shooting by someone with an assault rifle.
In a church.
The president says it's a mental health issue not a gun issue.
I agree. Anyone who wants to buy an assault rifle needs their head examined.

 

[Cadillactaste]

We also had that guy recently that took the truck down the bike path. Honestly...if one wishes to kill they will with however means they can. How to combat this. CCP...we have a few in our congregation who carries. Brings me peace of mind. There are whack jobs...they can use any means possible to kill and will.

 

[Vance Wood]

Mass shooting by someone with an assault rifle.
In a church.
The president says it's a mental health issue not a gun issue.
I agree. Anyone who wants to buy an assault rifle needs their head examined.

Too show you how screwed up the point of view you have has become let's look at this from another angle: Another mass shooting by a deranged leftist Atheist who hates Christians and those on the right. By law he should have never had a weapon because he was dishonorably discharged from the Air Force. Let's really look at this. How about the guy that assaulted Rand Paul the other day?? Another leftist that hates Republicans. TheVegas shooter? His motives seem to be hidden but do you seriously think he was having a bad day and just decided to shoot a bunch of people going to a CW concert...usually the sanctuary of the right.? Let us not forget that the recent shooter was thwarted by an armed citizen. Come on Mike you seem to be just parroting lefty talking points and it is becoming annoying. I don't mind disagreement I do mind being disagreeable.

 

[AlainK]

There are whack jobs...they can use any means possible to kill and will.

So, what's the use of carrying weapons?

Frankly, do you think that if everyone in the twin towers, or in Las vgas had carried a gun, the outcome would have been different?

By law he should have never had a weapon because he was dishonorably discharged from the Air Force.

Which shows that stricter regulations, real background checking might help, don't you think so?

Another mass shooting by a deranged leftist Atheist who hates Christians and those on the right.

Yes, this man was mental, like all mass shooters are, whatever their religious, philosophical or political inclinations are.

we have a few in our congregation who carries. Brings me peace of mind.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think this will curb down mass shootings: 1,516 mass shootings in 1,735 days That's not an opinion, but mere statistics that you can (unfortunately) check one by one. The latest statistics I read about 2017: in 309 days, 307 mass shootings (here, a "mass shooting" is 4+ people killed, not including the shooter).

What's more, an even greater number of people are killed accidentally in the US I think.

But that's your culture, OK, it won't change soon.

So pray, pray, pray. And keep on praying, and dodge your responsability next time, as usual.

It's saddening. You deserve better.

 

[wrcmad]

You are one of two things: Someone who is here because they love bonsai or you are a troll looking to piss off as many people as he can.

I am the former - I love bonsai.
This thread had nothing to do with bonsai, and I was not the OP. Just because you disagree with my opinion does not make me a troll.

If you are into bonsai lets see some of your bonsai, if not why don't you go and bother someone else?

I have already entered your photo pissing-contest... and you haven't posted one since.

We have our own problems and issues to bear and we don't need your vapid arguments to help.

Again, just because you don't agree with my opinion does not make my arguments vapid - that is a very lefty way of thinking.
My arguments are sound, and I'm guessing that's what pisses you off so much.

 

[AlainK]

Vance,

I think it's a pity we can't debate without insulting each other.

I mean, this is another example of a tragedy that each one of us can feel, and sympathize with the victims and their families and friends, very sincerly because we all have had some experience of such disasters.

Vance, you apparently claim to be a "Christian". I don't know what your religious classes taught you, but I'm afraid you're the kind of person that made me turn my back on religion(s): what you write is full of hatred against anyone who contradicts your opinion, you seem to be unable to consider any sound argument, despising whoever challenges your vision of the world. Just like the islamists or any fundamentalist, too blind and deaf to hear anything else.

I don't even think that you ever "pray", except for asking your "god" to kill all the miscreants. If there's a god, be sure it's not mine, it's not a god of hatred.

I find you pitiful.

Can't you ever, ever, put forward arguments, not just hateful labels to those who disagrees with you?

And I didn't want to post about that, saw the comments on KSAT-12, mostly racist comments (black people, middle-eastern paople, jews...) and thought "Oh my!..."

But yes, my message is insulting, because gross stupidity can't be excused: when you've tried to discuss with people and you realise they only can spill out their bile, whatever their skills in bonsai can be, they're just plain stupid and hateful.

Fortunately, I live in a secular country where mentally ill people (who often have a "religious" excuse) can't buy weapons to eliminate their fellow citizens.

I won't 'pray' for you for at least two reasons:

1/ I don't believe in god
2/ I've never physically assaulted anyone in my 62 years: a matter of Education (do you understand this word?)
3/ I live in the real world (Acting vs "praying")

And on top of that I believe in critical spirit, not in any "holly spirit". Something which is apparently not listed in your "good book". By the way, I read it, and if you want to argue, it's all right with me, show us you're not only a beotian.

 

[Vance Wood]

Vance,

I think it's a pity we can't debate without insulting each other.

Where did I insult any one other than point out inconsistencies?

I mean, this is another example of a tragedy that each one of us can feel, and sympathize with the victims and their families and friends, very sincerly because we all have had some experience of such disasters.

Vance, you apparently claim to be a "Christian". I don't know what your religious classes taught you, but I'm afraid you're the kind of person that made me turn my back on religion(s): what you write is full of hatred against anyone who contradicts your opinion, you seem to be unable to consider any sound argument, despising whoever challenges your vision of the world. Just like the islamists or any fundamentalist, too blind and deaf to hear anything else.

Where have I spewed hate?

I don't even think that you ever "pray", except for asking your "god" to kill all the miscreants. If there's a god, be sure it's not mine, it's not a god of hatred.

You then turn and judge me without even knowing me

I find you pitiful.

Who is calling names and offering hate?

Can't you ever, ever, put forward arguments, not just hateful labels to those who disagrees with you?

I thought I put forward arguments. I itemized a number of arguments and points of view.

And I didn't want to post about that, saw the comments on KSAT-12, mostly racist comments (black people, middle-eastern paople, jews...) and thought "Oh my!..."

But yes, my message is insulting, because gross stupidity can't be excused: when you've tried to discuss with people and you realise they only can spill out their bile, whatever their skills in bonsai can be, they're just plain stupid and hateful.

Fortunately, I live in a secular country where mentally ill people (who often have a "religious" excuse) can't buy weapons to eliminate their fellow citizens.

I won't 'pray' for you for at least two reasons:

1/ I don't believe in god
2/ I've never physically assaulted anyone in my 62 years: a matter of Education (do you understand this word?)
3/ I live in the real world (Acting vs "praying")

And on top of that I believe in critical spirit, not in any "holly spirit". Something which is apparently not listed in your "good book". By the way, I read it, and if you want to argue, it's all right with me, show us you're not only a beotian.

Wow I got to a point that responding further was deemed to be a waste of time. Good By. By the way: I responded to Mike because he means something to me-----You don't.

 

[AlainK]

I responded to Mike because he means something to me-----You don't.

Typical of religious freaks: those who don't follow the same hocus-pocus are not human. Thus they can be eliminated like you would eliminate rats or pests, they don't count.

Plenty of people like you in mankind's history.

And not even the slightest beginning of an argument, just hiding away - with a gun in your hand. Unable to argue in a civilized way, stuck to a 17th century explanation of the world in the 21st century.

 

[justBonsai]

At this point I think we can just accept everyone is partial to their own opinion. No one really has a good answer, myself included. I'm sure there are political forums for people who really want to have at it.

We all agree that it's a horrible tragedy. Lets leave it at that and go back to talking bonsai.

 

[Vance Wood]

I guess what bothers me is there seems to be so many that will cower in fear while someone is getting trashed.

 

[Vance Wood]

Typical of religious freaks: those who don't follow the same hocus-pocus are not human. Thus they can be eliminated like you would eliminate rats or pests, they don't count.

Plenty of people like you in mankind's history.

And not even the slightest beginning of an argument, just hiding away - with a gun in your hand. Unable to argue in a civilized way, stuck to a 17th century explanation of the world in the 21st century.

I've given you plaenty of arguments but you don't like them and you attack me for post them. You sir are a fraud.

 

[theone420]

Sure there are bad people, and yes there are guns that shouldn't be available to civilians and clips that hold excessive amounts of ammo. But a gun will not go out and shoot someone because it doesn't like them or it has mental issues, However a person will do just that and will use a gun, a knife, a car, a plane, or anything else that they can get there hands on to get the job done. So you want to take guns away so they do not kill people, well they don't. And if the killers don't have guns they will find other ways to kill.

People like to use other countries like Australia to say if we ban guns there will be no mass shootings. Okay i get that. But you do understand Australia has never had any issue with mass shootings to begin with. with 13 mass shootings over 18 years before guns were outlawed. well we have 13 mass shootings in a week here in the US. With that kind of problem your not gonna solve the issue by removing the ability to get a gun legally.

Wait I know maybe we should ban the internet? Because there are still ways to search the internet to learn how to make guns or modify them to full automatic or even build explosives. You can find guns to purchase online and watch videos of people killing others, the problem is the people not the guns IMHO.
That being said I don't think automatic weapons or those designed for the military use with the intent to kill humans are necessary for civilian use either.
There is no simple solution and trying to put a band-aid on a broken leg isn't going to fix it

 

[theone420]

Fortunately, I live in a secular country where mentally ill people (who often have a "religious" excuse) can't buy weapons to eliminate their fellow citizens.

but they still manage to make bombs. so not having a gun wont stop them.

 

[wrcmad]

But you do understand Australia has never had any issue with mass shootings to begin with. with 13 mass shootings over 18 years before guns were outlawed. well we have 13 mass shootings in a week here in the US. With that kind of problem your not gonna solve the issue by removing the ability to get a gun legally.

Impossible to have a serious debate with the irrational.

 

[theone420]

Impossible to have a serious debate with the irrational.

Sorry.

 

[berobinson82]

There's always been an "us" and "them". I fear our nation is starting to draw that line on 'heritage'. We are coerced into distraction so effectively that we see our team winning as our country winning. No matter your jersey, we are playing in the same league.

Cheers,
B

 

[ianb]

People like to use other countries like Australia to say if we ban guns there will be no mass shootings. Okay i get that. But you do understand Australia has never had any issue with mass shootings to begin with. with 13 mass shootings over 18 years before guns were outlawed. well we have 13 mass shootings in a week here in the US. With that kind of problem your not gonna solve the issue by removing the ability to get a gun legally.

Wait...what? Things weren't as bad back in the late 90's either in the US.

And there does seem to be at least a correlation from number of guns to mass shootings.

 

[ianb]

but they still manage to make bombs. so not having a gun wont stop them.

No but it makes it harder for them, and that in itself makes it more likely they will either abandon the plan or slip up and get on law enforcements radar.

By your logic we should have no laws as criminals will break them......

 

[M. Frary]

What I was getting at was this.
They use extreme vetting on people who want to come into this country right? So they can be screened for terrorist thoughts.Right? To keep them from killing U.S. citizens.
So. In that light shouldn't anyone who wants to buy a gun capable of shooting 50 or 500 people in minutes be extreme vetted also? The gun isnt for hunting or self defense. It's for assaulting large numbers of humans. It's what it's designed for and its in its classification. Assault rifle.
This last shooter was slowed down by someone using another. Great. It didn't stop him though. A self inflicted gunshot did..
Sure mental health is the issue. If there had been checks in place to purchase an assault rifle this may never have happened.
A waiting period and mental health background checks and criminal checks.
Also the president revoking the law that people who get social security for mental illness shouldn't have guns doesn't help.
As for taking a weapon to church probably doesn't help. How many in that congregation were strapped? It is Texas after all. Nobody got their gun out. And if it happens in your church don't you think someone who stands up to pull their gun won't be shot first. The shooter already has his out. He doesn't need to discern who the bad guys are. The average person in a church congregation hasn't the training to deal with a combat situation. Even if someone manages to hit him,He was wearing body armor. That pistol load won't stop him. Not even the load of the AR he was hit with didn't bring him down. It takes a big bore hunting gun to work in this situation. So unless you're packing a .30/06 You're screwed.