Large Japanese maple progression.

MMJNICE

Shohin
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Location
Dayton Ohio
USDA Zone
6
So I had been wanting a large Japanese maples to develop from scratch and I found one at a local nursery that I thought had potential. I could tell from the shape of the lower trunk the root spread was fairly even at least growing from one plane and I've always like the particular bark of this type of Japanese maple so I bought it.
My next order of business was to start the process of cleaning up the trunk and bit. And to remove the burlap string that left a horrible ring around the lower trunk. That line is not a graft mark it was the nylon string that was left on by the nursery. And btw I can't really find a graft mark on the trunk anywhere. I would be very surprised if it wasn't grafted but if I can't tell most people probably won't see it either. I took a grafting knife to all the cuts I made and cleaned the wounds and knife with alcohol after each cut.
Later that night I got curious about the root spread so I started uncovering the soil around the base. I wasn't surprised to see very thick structural roots forming the root base because the tree was planted in field soil with zero potting soil in the pot at all. The tree and pot probably weighs about 70 pounds. The roots will need to be cut back to start forming taper to the root spread. They are not the prettiest roots but at least they are all in one plane and somewhat radial. My goal for the short term is to watch and wait for buds to start swelling to tackle the repotting and possibly build a box. The largest growing branch to the right may get cut off because the angle is weird growing parallel with the trunk.. Their is a bunch a little branches a couple of inches from the top of the chop point that will form my new apex area. I'm planning on getting a lot of areas where new buds will formed hopefully,, and if not ,,a thread graft will be preformed on place's that need a branch. I'm hoping to have something resembling a bonsai in 5 years. Year one is to choose and grow primary branches. Year 2 will be to thickin primary branches and preform the first cut backs to start taper and movement in the premiere branching. Year 3 will start the process of ramifying the primary branches. Year 3 also should be the second repot and at that point the roots will be assessed to determine if a ground layer is appropriate or if I can live with what the cut back structural roots look like. The tree will be repotted into mostly Academa to help slow down the growth leading to the beginnings of a refinement stage. Year 4 should continue the ramification of the canopy with techniques like defoliation and pinching being deployed. Year 5 I should have a fairly presentable tree and will start looking for bonsai pots to further refine the canopy. In a perfect world that how it will work. But i have not observed how vigorously the tree grows or it growth habit so more realistically the process could take much longer and will probably take 8 years. Btw this tree has been at this nursery for as long as i have been coming to this business and the owner estimates that the tree is 30 or 40 year old. The tree may get a new cut back to add more taper but it will most likely grow freely this first season. 20250225_203347.jpg20250226_011341.jpg20250226_011521.jpg20250226_011854.jpg20250226_012034.jpg20250226_013810.jpg20250226_014126.jpg20250226_014306.jpg20250226_015206.jpg20250226_024202.jpg20250226_024700.jpg20250226_175139.jpg
 
Nice grayed out bark, did it not have a tag?
Unfortunately it did not have a tag. It has kinda light green leaves if I remember correctly that are fairly small and I think red seed pods. I did post a picture of the dried up leaves that where in the nursery pot if that helps..its
not a dorf like the internodes aren't super tiny but not super long either. It's definitely not your garden variety mountain maple. Definitely a named variety. But asking the owner on a tree that's been there for 15-20 years he would draw a blank. I know this is pointless but if anyone has any ideas that I could run past the owner of the nursery that may jog his memory. The owner is his 80s ,,,his son that sold it to me didn't know. The nursery has been in business since the 60s,,at the same location... I grew up singing there Commercial jingle when the old commercials from the 70s would play in the 90s hehehehe. I doubt it will last another 20 year tho smh..
 
What is a dorf? I tried to look it up, but I kept getting information on a Tim Conway character. Have any pictures?
 
Nice work good start for the root structure. Leaves look a bit like full moon maple.
 
Sooooo i got impatient and repotted the tree today. And bonus found two wild Japanese maples in a abandoned lot next to a really gross pond in the middle of Dayton Ohio.. I may or may not have seen dirty dippers floating in the water 😳..and when I got home extra bonus in the mail,,, I must have mistakenly ordered 35 bone-dry ass bare root hornbeams because that's how they came. i took a picture burning the dry one sheet of newspaper they rapped the roots with. But back to the maples..there was only roots in the top third of the field soil the tree was potted in so I didn't have much to work with. I had nothing but thick roots circling that top third, I took probably a little more then what was safe but it is what it is. I had to get the tree on it's way too becoming a nicely done bonsai and roots are an important thing for me. I soaked the tree for an hour in shock treatment juice so I hope that helps a bit. I was going to build a box but I didn't feel like it to be honest and the training pot it's in will do for the time being. Wanted something a little deeper to regrow them roots. My fingers are crossed... for te maples and hornbeams smh20250228_181848.jpg20250228_181859.jpg20250228_182807.jpg20250228_182921.jpg20250228_183801.jpg20250228_184634.jpg17408137249081979569665519236904.jpg20250301_002337.jpg20250301_001949.jpg
 
Nice work good start for the root structure. Leaves look a bit like full moon maple.
Omg... part or me would be happy to grow a full moon Japanese maple, but the other part would a little disappointed because that's not what I was really looking for. And you are right they do kinda look like full moon leaves. The last time I remembered seeing the tree i wasn't really into Japanese maples yet so it was just a Japanese maple to me,, and that's all I knew.
 
Omg... part or me would be happy to grow a full moon Japanese maple, but the other part would a little disappointed because that's not what I was really looking for. And you are right they do kinda look like full moon leaves. The last time I remembered seeing the tree i wasn't really into Japanese maples yet so it was just a Japanese maple to me,, and that's all I knew.
If it does turn out to be full moon, keep it out of the wind. They don't like wind. But there are so many maples who knows. Hope your seedlings make it.
 
So the tree was much weaker then expected i could have sworn i saw it growing well last season at the nursery I bought it from but nope apparently not. The little growth that was left on the tree after cutting it back this early spring was not enough to get the tree growing this season strongly. Lesson learned smh.. it has not pushed any new buds like at all this spring so I've placed it in a very shady spot to try to gain strength but it doesn't look promising... the leaves started out red but I don't think that's the real color of the mature leaves. They haven't even fully matured and the tree leafed out weeks ago 😒.. sooooooooooooo I bought an backup large Japanese 20250506_185711.jpg20250506_185613.jpgmaple to make me feel better.. I'll post soon
 
So the plan with is super large shishigashira Japanese maples is to airlayer the crap out of it to make a couple of forests and at least one kabduchi. I haven't seen forests or kabduchi made from the this type of Japanese maple before so i think it will be fairly unique. I should also have enough material to layer one or two larger trees off the top section of the tree as well. I thought i got a pretty good deal on the tree it was under 250 bucks. I couldn't resist getting another larger tree to play with because of the disappointment with the first tree in the post.. After taking all the airlayers this season I should have a fairly presentable tree left at the base. I'm open to opinions on what line i should take with the main tree after the airlayers are completed this summer. Unlike some I'm not to bothered with grafted trees if the graft is will done and not to noticeable so doing an layer to remove the grafted portion isn't a big priority. 20250506_095148.jpg20250506_095113.jpg20250506_095045.jpg
 
Lesson learned
Hopefully the lesson to not do major surgery on a tree and do a massive rootwork session in the same growing cycle.
I was shocked to see the work you put this tree through in one season. Go slow, one step at the time and you will reach the finish line faster.
 
Started 5 small airlayers and one larger airlayer about 2 weeks ago, hopefully be able to Is separate in july174834816520748773634389514234.jpg
 
So the tree was much weaker then expected i could have sworn i saw it growing well last season at the nursery I bought it from but nope apparently not.
You need to critically analyze the work that you did on this tree, and ask yourself the question - how much of the weakness you are seeing is due to your actions, versus a general weakness of the material?

If you bring in a nursery tree that is in bad soil and is showing lots of signs of poor care, you should focus solely on getting the tree as healthy as possible - and worry about pruning and styling later. Slow down, and get yourself some decent shallow nursery pots (5 gallon injection molded squat pots, or Anderson flats). Never root prune a weak tree - not even a single root. Also be very careful when you root prune a Japanese maple, since they are prone to getting fungus with unsealed cuts, particularly if they are in wet soil and the weather is cold. Finally, never use rooting hormone on roots - since the roots don't need it/can't use it, and in the best case you will do nothing, while in the worst case you will burn the roots. Rooting hormone is used where there are NO roots (cuttings, air-layers, etc).

I would not buy any other material from this nursery, with its weird burlap rope in the pots, and the absolutely horrific soil. They better be cheap, but even one dead tree tends to erase any savings from going to a nicer nursery and buying a healthier tree.

where did you get the transparent airlayer capsules?
 
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I couldn’t agree with ‘nut more. Ditto on everything he said.

Underline the parts about working with healthier trees and finding a better source. Also rooting hormones on cut roots can actually SLOW DOWN root development. Rooting hormone basically “tells” NON-ROOT tissue to become root tissue. Root cells are already root cells so adding strong hormone that tellls them to be roots is redundant and adds useless or confusing chemical signals to the mix
 
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