How to protect plants from heavy rain but still get sun

[0soyoung]

You’re missing the point. It’s not the size of the pot he’s talking about, it’s the shape of the pot. Nursery pots are deeper than they are wide which allows the water to drain more efficiently via some kind of science that I can’t totally explain. As opposed to a wide shallow shaped bonsai pot.

Indeed he is. Thanks for pointing that out.

You can demonstrate the principle easily if you simply soak a kitchen sponge in water and lay it flat on a baking rack or oven rack or a BBQ rack, say. Within a minute or so water will have stopped dripping out of the sponge. Now tip the sponge on its side. You'll notice that water is dripping out of the sponge as soon as you begin tipping it up. The same effect happens with tipping a bonsai pot. Even though the circumstances are complicated, we can explain this by capillary action. Capillary action arises because of the attraction of water to particles in the substrate (or the material of which the sponge is made). In essence it means that water will fill spaces to some height that I'm calling the 'saturation zone'.

 

[M. Frary]

But too much rain ruins the flowers.

They never last that long anyway.

 

[JoeH]

with upper 90s every day I welcome the rain. Got two inches yesterday. Worst thing that happened was the wind was so heavy it blew a juniper right out of a pot, luckily is was pretty root bound so I just dropped it right back in its home.

 

[Lorax7]

Indeed he is. Thanks for pointing that out.

You can demonstrate the principle easily if you simply soak a kitchen sponge in water and lay it flat on a baking rack or oven rack or a BBQ rack, say. Within a minute or so water will have stopped dripping out of the sponge. Now tip the sponge on its side. You'll notice that water is dripping out of the sponge as soon as you begin tipping it up. The same effect happens with tipping a bonsai pot. Even though the circumstances are complicated, we can explain this by capillary action. Capillary action arises because of the attraction of water to particles in the substrate (or the material of which the sponge is made). In essence it means that water will fill spaces to some height that I'm calling the 'saturation zone'.

Capillary action explains it, but it’s probably easier for the average person to understand the concept of static pressure, which is what capillary action must oppose in order to retain water in the soil. Static pressure at the bottom of a column of fluid equals the product of the specific gravity of the fluid, the height of the column, and the gravitational acceleration. The specific gravity of water and the gravitational acceleration are both constants. Thus, the pressure at the bottom of the column of water depends only on the height of the column. The ability of capillary action to oppose gravitational forces is limited. Once that limit is exceeded, drainage occurs. So, an increase in height of the pot results makes drainage more effective.

 

[Cable]

Indeed he is. Thanks for pointing that out.

You can demonstrate the principle easily if you simply soak a kitchen sponge in water and lay it flat on a baking rack or oven rack or a BBQ rack, say. Within a minute or so water will have stopped dripping out of the sponge. Now tip the sponge on its side. You'll notice that water is dripping out of the sponge as soon as you begin tipping it up. The same effect happens with tipping a bonsai pot. Even though the circumstances are complicated, we can explain this by capillary action. Capillary action arises because of the attraction of water to particles in the substrate (or the material of which the sponge is made). In essence it means that water will fill spaces to some height that I'm calling the 'saturation zone'.

I'm not missing as much as you think. Keep in mind we're talking about completely different animals here. You specifically said "nurseries". We use organic mixes not inorganic. The properties are not identical. Our watering is hindered by the depth of the pots but is overcome by watering twice. The first watering begins to saturate the soil and then the second watering pushes the moisture deeper into the pot. So een though the dynamics are similar despite the different properties of the growing medium, attempting to claim those properties are an intended reason why we use a particular shape pot are false.

No, @Mike Hennigan not all nursery pots are deeper than they are wide. We also use what we call "squat" pots when we want to change the shape of the rootball. But, most are deeper because we're trying to establish a deeper root system for the landscape.

 

[Mike Hennigan]

I'm not missing as much as you think. Keep in mind we're talking about completely different animals here. You specifically said "nurseries". We use organic mixes not inorganic. The properties are not identical. Our watering is hindered by the depth of the pots but is overcome by watering twice. The first watering begins to saturate the soil and then the second watering pushes the moisture deeper into the pot. So een though the dynamics are similar despite the different properties of the growing medium, attempting to claim those properties are an intended reason why we use a particular shape pot are false.

No, @Mike Hennigan not all nursery pots are deeper than they are wide. We also use what we call "squat" pots when we want to change the shape of the rootball. But, most are deeper because we're trying to establish a deeper root system for the landscape.

Ok, my bad, the *vast majority* of nursery pots are deeper than they are wide. And yes *part* of the reason they are this shape is that it helps with drainage and aeration when using a heavy, highly water retaining, organic peat based soils. Surely this shape produces a desirable root ball shape for planting in the ground as well.

But you’re missing the point again, I wasn’t trying to pigeonhole what the function of nursery containers. Was merely explaining why the practice of tilting for increased drainage applies to bonsai pots and not to deep nursery containers. If anything, a good way to look at this is that tilting a bonsai pot temporarily mimics the way that water behaves in a deeper pot, e.g. a typical nursery pot. Since you’re turning this wide soil mass into a vertical soil mass.

 

[Cable]

You can believe what you want. You're wrong, but you can believe it. Oh, and our soils aren't peat based, either. Pine bark is the primary ingredient. Cracks me up when people outside the industry try to tell it like it is.

 

[Mike Hennigan]

You can believe what you want. You're wrong, but you can believe it. Oh, and our soils aren't peat based, either. Pine bark is the primary ingredient. Cracks me up when people outside the industry try to tell it like it is.

Still not getting it. Wasn’t talking about the nursery industry, talking about draining bonsai pots and how water behaves differently in a bonsai container versus a deep pot. But whatever. Ride your high horse around or cue into the conversation, do what you will.

 

[Cable]

You're the one not getting it. You stuck your nose in and defended the statement "hence a reason nursery and conventional gardening pots are deep" when I said it isn't. Backtracking into another point doesn't change that.

 

[Mike Hennigan]

Ok. Great job.

 

[Carol 83]

They never last that long anyway.

True enough. That's why you need a bunch, then there's always something blooming!

 

[Mike Hennigan]

@Cable Semantics, sorry I didn’t realize you were so hung up on me saying that’s one of the reasons they’re deep. Let me rephrase that. “That’s an added benefit to nursery pots being deep.” Has that satisfied you? Forgive me, I’ve met people who work at nurseries who couldn’t tell me if flowering dogwood was shade tolerant or not. And sorry I didn’t visit your nursery to find out exactly what type of organic matter you’ve been using in your soil. I was trying to talk about the shape of a container and how that influences draining. Something relevant to this thread. It seemed you were thinking about the size of the pot, I was just trying to point out it’s not the size of the pot that matters ?... when it comes to drainage. ?

Wasn’t trying to claim I knew everything about the nursery industry. Whether part of the reason why the typical nursery pot is designed this way is because of this drainage characteristic is irrelevant I suppose, because it still applies regardless. Physics is as physics does. Let’s get on with the show.

 

[Cable]

@Mike Hennigan You're right, water under the fridge.