Frequency of fertilizing

[Zenshi]

I've been using the Fujiyama Combo from Dallas Bonsai. This is a 5:10:5 liquid fertilizer and root stimulant (used every 2 weeks) and so far it has been working well.

 

[FrankP999]

This can be an issue with some cakes and pellet type ferts ... the answer to this problem is how the cake is made. With the right ingredients, manufacturing process...this problem can be resolved.

Below is a cake that still has retained it shape after 8 weeks of being applied, it left no crumbly bits while providing nutrients

What's your secret for the cakes ?

Thanks

Frank

 

[FrankP999]

I have some liquid humic acid concentrate. I wonder about using a diluted solution of it in place of water when making cakes. What do you think? (Smoke you reading this?)

Frank

 

[Tachigi]

Frank and Fanghorn, Without getting into a lot of detail ( I sell these to pay the bills) I will pass this along to you. What makes these cake preform so well is the application of heat, pressure, fermentation, and its ingredients. The right amount of each is what you need to figure out...took me 3 years of tinkering and research to figure what was needed for what I wanted to achieve.

Painter, No these don't attract wasps per say. Their organic and because of that fact they are fair game for most critters. However, I have yet to see them attract anyone critter in mass, nor has any of my customers that have purchased them reported that they have experienced a problem with them being an attractant. The fermentation process among other things does eliminate smell...which I would attribute to it not attracting creatures large and small.

Sorry to slightly evasive and hope this helps with your questions

 

[rockm]

Zenshi,

You'd get better results for less money using Miracle Grow or some other prepared fert. Prepackaged "bonsai" fertilizers and root stimulants are never worth the extra money.

 

[HotAction]

This is only my second spring as a bonsaiist, and most my stuff is in a mostly inorganic mix. This year, I've dumped everything but the kitchen sink on my trees, and they are growing great. I also water everything very thouroughly very often.

Dave

 

[Tachigi]

Zenshi,

You'd get better results for less money using Miracle Grow or some other prepared fert. Prepackaged "bonsai" fertilizers and root stimulants are never worth the extra money.

Mark, I don't agree that you would get better results....it is true that you would spend less money. It is also true miracle grow will feed your trees, however they won't make them grow to there true potential. Most (not all) "prepackaged" bonsai fertilizers have had some thought placed into them how they will preform in pot culture and inorganic soils. That to me has value if I can get from point A to point B faster and achieve the results I desire.

The image below shows one years growth with a "prepackage" fertilizer. Something a liquid or chemical fertilizer was unable to produce in the past.

 

[rockm]

Tom,

I have no doubt this is a sliding scale, but for the most part, products in bonsai retail catalogues labeled "bonsai food" and "bonsai root stimulator" are the "kyoto moss spores" of fertilizers. Little 6 oz vials of liquid bonsai feed are no more effective than regular fertilizers.

This is one of those "no win" arguments, though. The most effective fertilization plan is one that you're comfortable providing and one that works for your plants. I've used any number of fertilizers over the years, from the expensive Japanese stuff, to what's on sale at Wal-Mart. I can't say the special stuff has worked any better by itself than the regular stuff. What has produced exceptional results for me has been a combination--Bio-gold and Miracle Grow. Sad to say, bio-Gold is no longer manufactured however.

 

[Zenshi]

The most effective fertilization plan is one that you're comfortable providing and one that works for your plants.

Thanks for your previous comment as well. I'm still a bonsai newb and general gardening idiot. Thus far, my limited knowledge has been gathered from reading and not experience. This particular fertilizer was recommended by a couple online sources, so I gave it a whirl.

Mostly, and this is just personal preference, I wanted to stick with a liquid fertilizer...and one that was organic. I also didn't think that $5.50 for 4 gallons seemed unreasonable.

 

[rockm]

The dilution rate for Miracle Grow is one tablespoon per gallon. You can get about ten gallons out of this $2.79 package:

http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1335057&CAWELAID=109347667

I'm not a shill for Miracle Grow. ANY water soluable fert is vastly more cost effective than the bottled "Bonsai fertilizer" sold in catalogues...

 

[Concorde]

I use Peter's 20-20-20, fish emulsion 4-1-1 and Superthrive alternating every 10 days with amazing results. I am

 

[greerhw]

I use this stuff because Mike Page says it's good.......................

keep it green,
Harry

http://www.dyna-gro.com/

 

[Zenshi]

...Miracle Grow...

Formulation: 24-8-16

Isn't this bad? Pretty much everything I've ever read says that a balanced fertilizer should be used.

 

[John Ruger]

Remember, nitrogen is used pretty fast by trees and you want it to promote growth and healthy foliage. Phosphorous is important for the good tree root growth and metabolism. Potassium acts as a check on nitrogen so this way the growth isn't too "soft" and also aids photosynthesis. The formulation you have (24-8-16) will put out a strong growth. Eventually, you want to convert over to a a solution that provides phosphorous and potassium to harden this season's growth so it makes it through the winter.

There's more to it, but this is a general rule of thumb to follow...

 

[Smoke]

Tom,

What has produced exceptional results for me has been a combination--Bio-gold and Miracle Grow. Sad to say, bio-Gold is no longer manufactured however.

Mark if you wish an American Bio Gold alternative which should be easy to get and can be bought in 20 pound bags for about 25.00 is Gro Power. You will see the same results and the same brown residue on your pots which is a small price to pay for how well it works. An added benifit is it already contains 15 percent humic acid derived from organic compost. I still like my gro power tabs as they are easy to use and a little less hot. I use this by the pounds over the year on plants in training when coarse growth is not so much of a factor. This may be a little hot for plants in a more finished state. Maybe just use less and not so often.

By far this is the best fertilizer I have found for bonsai. I use to be a biogold freak as one of the first posts I did at bonsaiTALK was "wow, my backyard stinks" which was from the bio gold as well as the fish emulsion. That was back in 2001. This has been a good alternative and no smell. Total organic also.

 

[greerhw]

Good news for you Rock, you can buy all the Biogold you want here, even the new high powered, super duper stuff.

keep it green,
Harry

http://www.dallasbonsai.com/store/fertilizers.html

 

[Tachigi]

This doesn't look to bad for rough stock Al. The only turn off for me is the nitrogen source. Urea is not a good source for nitrogen. Nitrogen from urea can be lost to the atmosphere if urea type fertilizers remains on the soil surface for over a period of time. Urea breakdown begins as soon as it hits the soil. If the soil is totally dry, no reaction happens, which is not really good for pot culture. Any small amount of soil moisture, urea normally hydrolizes and converts to ammonium and carbon dioxide. This can occur in 2 to 4 days and happens quicker on high pH soils.

This urea loss (ammonium) is the stink that most people recognize with an organic when it gets wet. Barring it doesn't have a fish product in it.

However if this works for you, thats great. Here where its really wet and humid I'm not sure

 

[bretts]

This from Walter

I use feed that is meant for regular houseplant s for bonsai. There is no such thing as bonsai feed. It is an invention of folks who either have too much time or too much money or both. Bonsai are regular plants, Only they need MORE feed than regular plants because we cut off things constantly and want them to regrow fast.

There are folks out there who have an agenda. They want to sell you akadama, biogold, bonsai feed water softeners and such stuff which you don't need. Or they just want to believe books which were written forty years ago. All this is just modern professional garden know-how applied to bonsai.

 

[rockm]

Harry,

THanks for looking that up. I'd checked out that Dallas before. Prices aren't that bad, but shipping adds. I'll have to think about it. Money's tight nowadays. I've put the last of my BioGold stash on a few trees and am feeding Miracle Grow every two weeks. Trees are happy...

I take Walter's advice to heart, Bretts. I have found, however, that a BioGold/plain old Chem fert combination does add something. The BioGold acts as a longer term feed filling in some gaps between Miracle Grow applications (especially in rainy times). Over the years, I have seen a difference in growth and quality of growth using both. It's not hugely dramatic, but it's there.

 

[FrankP999]

Smoke
What do you think of adding liquid humic acid to homemade fertilizer cakes made with Plant-Tone?

Frank