Composting for Bonsai? (Latest Podcast, Modern Soil Science - Mirai)

[RobertB]

Just finished the latest podcast put out by Mirai, "Modern Soil Science with Ian Hunter" which was pretty interesting and pretty much over my head. I am going to listen to again and take some notes to research.

One thing I kind of picked up on is it might be a decent idea to mix some screened compost into your container with re-potting. Sounds like it can help get your micro organisms established quicker.

I know some on here do that. Just wanted to hear some opinions on it. I might try it, in a more enclosed and more closely monitored environment, of coarse on a smaller scale since it would only be used for my pre-bonsai as i dont have any bonsai yet.

Also, the discussions on fish, humus and kelp were pretty interesting. This is mostly what i wanted to research.

 

[Colorado]

It sounded to me that Ryan and Ian were both proponents of using compost tea instead. You get all (most?) of the benefits of compost, without adding a lot of organic matter into your growing medium.

 

[Deleted member 21616]

here we go ?

 

[coh]

One thought on this. At the start of the podcast and also in the following live stream, Ryan indicated that he considered much of the discussion with Ian to
be "theoretical". I know I won't be going out and dousing all my trees with fish hydrolosates (or whatever it was) or home-made manure tea or bottled humic acid. I would
possibly test on small samples of experimental trees first (or wait for others to risk their collections).

 

[BobbyLane]

here we go ?

 

[Gary McCarthy]

Since you're a Bonsai Mirai member I would take advantage of Ryan's live Q&A or forum Q&A to ask some follow up questions.

 

[coh]

Since you're a Bonsai Mirai member I would take advantage of Ryan's live Q&A or forum Q&A to ask some follow up questions.

(you don't have to be a mirai live member to listen to the podcasts, they are freely available)

 

[RobertB]

I use some organic in my soil, mostly because thats what i have available to me and because all of my trees are prebonsai. I will probably not buy bonsai soil until i get closer to a bonsai pot.

So replacing some pine bark with some sifted compost is ok for me.

 

[0soyoung]

Clearly there is an imminent need for bonsai to be 'Certified Organic'.

A new criterion for entry into an exhibition?

 

[River's Edge]

Clearly there is an imminent need for bonsai to be 'Certified Organic'.

A new criterion for entry into an exhibition?

This likely creates the need for a certification committee!
The likely candidates should all be certifiable as well!
I believe this brings us back to the compostable part.
The good news is that there is likely no shortage of qualified candidates.
The bad news is that it may catch on.
Who took the popcorn?

 

[Wilson]

I always use fish, and algae liquid ferts. Also I dig the humates, they seem to be a good addition to the mix. I have been using Rich Earth humates, it's granular.

 

[amatbrewer]

Clearly there is an imminent need for bonsai to be 'Certified Organic'.

A new criterion for entry into an exhibition?

It would also have to be gluten free.

 

[fredman]

Just finished the latest podcast put out by Mirai, "Modern Soil Science with Ian Hunter"

You maybe have a link to it? Would love to watch that.
I been experimenting with organic ferts on and off. I plan to go full out as soon as possible.
I'm over chemicals....period !

 

[Anthony]

Fermented Oil seed meal can be 8 N......
Most compost is 1 N.......
So if you use compost tea, what do you think you will get?
Compost may also have been used as a cide [ eg. fungicide ]
Compost encourages microbes.............

See Garden Myths.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[River's Edge]

You maybe have a link to it? Would love to watch that.
I been experimenting with organic ferts on and off. I plan to go full out as soon as possible.
I'm over chemicals....period !

Given the fact that inorganic molecules and organic molecules are identical. Given the fact that all inorganic chemicals come from natural sources. And it is difficult to find any evidence that plants can tell the difference where the elements come from that they need.
You may wish to review a broader scope of the research available on this issue! There is some interesting reading found in the text of Modern Bonsai Practice ( 2016). Problems exist with the misuse of either type. It is a good area to become familiar with.
By the way i use both, i have no particular axe to grind.

 

[Wilson]

You maybe have a link to it? Would love to watch that.
I been experimenting with organic ferts on and off. I plan to go full out as soon as possible.
I'm over chemicals....period !

Here ya go Fred, enjoy!
https://bonsaimirai.com/node/741

 

[fredman]

Here ya go Fred, enjoy!
https://bonsaimirai.com/node/741

Thanks buddy

 

[Mike Hennigan]

Lets be clear, they were talking about composting in order to make compost tea, to use as a supplement for promoting a healthy micro-biome in the soil. Not as a soil component. You can talk to Anthony about that though, I'm sure he will give you the run down on marbles as well.

The podcast episode was fantastic. Some of it was the two of them throwing around speculative ideas about how Ian's knowledge of soil science (NOT bonsai soil science lets be clear) could be applied to bonsai. But they are very clear about what was speculation and what was real tested science. I think a lot of what Ian observes in soil science in the fields of agriculture or horticulture has the potential to be applied to bonsai. The big takeaway for me was that when you're using organic fertilizers with more complex molecules that must break down... in essence you are really feeding the soil and the microbe community first which then makes the nutrients available to the plant. And how this approach can often create stronger, more disease resistance plants, as opposed to a purely miracle-grow fed plant. That was a light bulb moment for me, and really help me put into context why you would want to use organic ferts instead and how exactly they work.

 

[Colorado]

Given the fact that inorganic molecules and organic molecules are identical......
You may wish to review a broader scope of the research available on this issue!

This is a gross oversimplification. Ice molecules and liquid water molecules are also identical. Yet I have a hard time believing one could propagate a plant in a block of solid ice the same way one could propagate a cutting in water. This is just one example.

And the implication of your position is that organic and chemical fertilizers have the same effect on the environment. If this is your stance....well.....?

You may wish to review a broader scope of the research available on this issue!

 

[River's Edge]

This is a gross oversimplification. Ice molecules and liquid water molecules are also identical. Yet I have a hard time believing one could propagate a plant in a block of solid ice the same way one could propagate a cutting in water. This is just one example.

And the implication of your position is that organic and chemical fertilizers have the same effect on the environment. If this is your stance....well.....?

You may wish to review a broader scope of the research available on this issue!

LOL
Made no implication with respect to environment. Made no statement with respect to effect on the environment.
My position is that both can be misused and i use both with no axe to grind.