Asus101
Yamadori
Oh and solt, you still owe me those trident seedlings 
Collecting. With or without permission?
- Thread starter Asus101
- Start date
Vance Wood
Lord Mugo
Anything that is set or placed along the side of the road as garbage is fair game. The state cannot argue that it still belongs to the depositor of the garbage because if they did, they would be arguing against their own policy concerning the search and seizure of aforementioned garbage without a warrant during a criminal investigation.
Asus101
Yamadori
And its why here in Aus we can freely pick up anything on the side of the road on hard rubbish weeks. Can find some good stuff sometimes.
bretts
Shohin
- Messages
- 273
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- 7
What gall telling me to get of my arse and research you are a (deleted). It's getting hard to find any crappy-er trident seedlings than I had planned for you.
Some decent points and thanks for clarifying about your progress with permission. I must admit I planned on giving a National park or two a call today to see but did not get around to it. I had thought that would be a dead end and we are not collecting on national park land. I will let you know how I go.
Asus101
Yamadori
meushi
Mame
Befriending the game wardens, forest wardens and park rangers is a sure way to land not only authorizations but also pointers to interesting zones.
My grow boxes and bonsai shelves are all coming from reclaimed wood/furniture... the stuff thrown by Germans can be shocking at times.
Asus101
Yamadori
Well with about 6 people wanting to beat me up, Im not sure whos for me or who's against me anymore...
milehigh_7
Mister 500,000
That is precisely what I am suggesting. Our love for bonsai as an art and a spiritual encounter with life should guide us to pursue wild things with thought and concern for the earth and all its interrelationships.
Is this an argument against collecting? Hardly, it is an argument for common sense and concern for the earth. I don't need some law to tell me that if I go trying to collect any and all bristle cone pines in the Sierra Nevada I may do permanent harm to the earth.
Further, if one does not care about causing harm to the earth, don't give me hypocritical crap about bonsai being spiritual.
If I need a law to tell me that this is wrong, well pity my powers of perception.
Attila Soos
Omono
Hey, I'm all for hunting as long as the humans and the animals have equal chance of living or dying. If the animal is shot, the human wins. If the animal can escape harmless, the human should be shot..
. Level playing field...my friend.
PaulH
Omono
Hey, I'm all for hunting as long as the humans and the animals have equal chance of living or dying. If the animal is shot, the human wins. If the animal can escape harmless, the human should be shot..
If you are serious that's a frightening, inhuman attitude.
milehigh_7
Mister 500,000
Hey, I'm all for hunting as long as the humans and the animals have equal chance of living or dying. If the animal is shot, the human wins. If the animal can escape harmless, the human should be shot..
So, what you are saying is that you support the right to arm bears?
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treebeard55
Chumono
You're going in an interesting direction, MH. Not to hijack this thread, but you seem to be saying that our attitude toward bonsai, and our personal reasons for being involved (philosophical, esthetic, and other) will inform our decisions about collecting. If so, I certainly agree. Maybe this rates a thread of its own.
I think the one concept that sums up my own approach to collecting would be "stewardship." That implies care for the trees, care for the environment, and respect for the rights of any other humans involved.
There are situations where items are clearly abandoned; other times when, by the common consent and understanding of all in a given society, permission is implicit. But I think one must be sure such exceptions apply in any given case. If in doubt, ask. Then you don't have to worry about explaining your approach to collecting in a court!
Attila Soos
Omono
Relax, all in good fun.
(but I recommend those cage fights between lion and human - they really hold one's attention).
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Attila Soos
Omono
Maybe not armed bears, but I would love to see some heavily armored chipmunks..with bow and arrow.
Bill S
Masterpiece
Mile High the problem with your argument is greed, there are those that will unscrupulously collect just for the sale. Most of us collecting will try hard to do the best thing for the tree and it's old neighborhood, it's not the pure numbers of trees taken to trees in the ground, it's about perception,
Attilla the problem with the hunting thing is there is a need for it, it can be quite bad for many animals living in an over animal populated areas, unless of course you advocate getting rid of the people and give the land back to the animals. A bullet is much kinder than being mauled by wolves or Coyotes whilst in the process of starving. And NO I won't eat tofu, and I won't give up my guns either. On the other hand the guys that set up the internet hunting site where you shoot ( I mean really shoot) game with a mouse click, they otta be put on the other end of that deal, and see how many would pay to shoot them.
If done well 99% would never know you were there digging trees, and it's probably 99.9%, you would need to know a small tree somewhere was not there anymore. The one that gets me is this - "Hey can anybody ID the tree I just collected" this burns my _$$(patooty), with all you need to know and do collecting, how does one collect something they don't know what it is
Next time I hope it's poison oak or ivy or something really uncomfortable.
Attilla the problem with the hunting thing is there is a need for it, it can be quite bad for many animals living in an over animal populated areas, unless of course you advocate getting rid of the people and give the land back to the animals. A bullet is much kinder than being mauled by wolves or Coyotes whilst in the process of starving. And NO I won't eat tofu, and I won't give up my guns either. On the other hand the guys that set up the internet hunting site where you shoot ( I mean really shoot) game with a mouse click, they otta be put on the other end of that deal, and see how many would pay to shoot them.
If done well 99% would never know you were there digging trees, and it's probably 99.9%, you would need to know a small tree somewhere was not there anymore. The one that gets me is this - "Hey can anybody ID the tree I just collected" this burns my _$$(patooty), with all you need to know and do collecting, how does one collect something they don't know what it is
Next time I hope it's poison oak or ivy or something really uncomfortable.Attila Soos
Omono
If done well 99% would never know you were there digging trees, and it's probably 99.9%, you would need to know a small tree somewhere was not there anymore. The one that gets me is this - "Hey can anybody ID the tree I just collected" this burns my _$$(patooty), with all you need to know and do collecting, how does one collect something they don't know what it is
I agree on this - talking is what gets us in trouble most of the time. As Al/Smoke once said, "I can do many things, but being quiet is NOT one of them"
Anonymous User
Banned
Hey, I'm all for hunting as long as the humans and the animals have equal chance of living or dying. If the animal is shot, the human wins. If the animal can escape harmless, the human should be shot..
With that attitude, your ancestors would have died of starvation long before you were conceived.
Vegetarian is just an old Native American word for "Bad Hunter."
Will
(Hunter, Fisher, Gatherer)
Anonymous User
Banned
Think about this......there is no need for it because most humans are quite content letting other people do their killing for them.....
Will
Attila Soos
Omono
Nothing wrong with hunting for food. I did it many times, back in the old country, where we didn't have much to eat back in the late 70s. I hunted pigeons, wild bore, pheasant, rabbit, even caught frogs (they taste great, btw.). We did a lot of killing those days, all for food. We had a ration of 4 pounds of meat per month, so we had no choice.
Also, killing overpopulated wildlife, I can understand that. There are places where due to lack of large predators, the deer population is out of control. Hunting them would serve a useful purpose.
But killing for fun?.... hm,... that's something else. I guess some people are born that way, human nature, born instinct, whatever. Not much we can do about it.
Jeffrey Dahmer, anybody...?
Also, killing overpopulated wildlife, I can understand that. There are places where due to lack of large predators, the deer population is out of control. Hunting them would serve a useful purpose.
But killing for fun?.... hm,... that's something else. I guess some people are born that way, human nature, born instinct, whatever. Not much we can do about it.
Jeffrey Dahmer, anybody...?
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