Chinese Juniper Growth Rates

[Khaiba]

Hey guys,

I have a few questions regarding chinese junipers and was hoping some of you kind souls could help me out

1. Does anyone know roughly how fast the unnamed Chinese Juniper grow (as in cm/in per year)? I'm hearing many different opinions and lengths regarding their growth rate.
2. Are Shimpaku generally referred to as "normal" chinese junipers? If I understood correctly, not all chinese junipers are Shimpakus, so wouldn't they be a particular variety/cultivar and therefore different from plain chin.juniper?
3. What is the fastest growing chinese juniper used for bonsai? I have an Itoigawa Juniper so far, which I heard grows as quickly as the normal chin. juniper, but am unsure what this really means (see 1.).

Cheers,
Khai

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

It depends on a lot of factors.
Age of the material is a big one, as well as starting size, how much work has been done, how long your growing season is, how much water they take in, nutrients.. The list goes on.

My itoigawa are throwing out 15-20cm extensions every year. My chinese juniper in a tiny pot does 2-5cm.

It's very hard to estimate. In the best situation you can get a meter per year on a large plant. In the worst situation zero.

 

[sorce]

I missed you amongst all that cultivar talk! Lol!

Welcome to Crazy!

It really depends on what they're planted in, water, sun, and genetics.

"Fast growing" is out there, put "Juniper" with it, and it's even further out there.

Typically, slow growing thousand year old trunks are brought down from the mountain, then if they grow too fast, we graft slower, more compact folaige on.

No one needed a fast growing juniper till that dude in the white bonsai van showed up!

Local grows fastest always.

Sorce

 

[Khaiba]

My itoigawa are throwing out 15-20cm extensions every year. My chinese juniper in a tiny pot does 2-5cm.

Do you think the difference could be the pot size? 15-20cm a year seems pretty decent to me. It seems that the Hollywood Juniper (Kaizuka) grows at about the same rate so I am currently looking for one of those for propagation.

I missed you amongst all that cultivar talk! Lol!

Welcome to Crazy!

Haha, I guess it's pretty obvious how fanatic I am with specific varieties and cultivars
I just don't want to look back in 5 years regretting that I didn't do my research and should have gotten a different plant/species.

I'm still wondering about the term Shimpaku though. When people say chinese juniper do they usually mean Shimpaku or the unnamed variety?

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

I'm still wondering about the term Shimpaku though. When people say chinese juniper do they usually mean Shimpaku or the unnamed variety?

Nursery people mean the unnamed variety. Shimpaku is a variety rather unique to the bonsai world.

 

[JoB]

I have 2 chinese juniper which are 4 years old and currently in colanders... They have between 12 and 15cm extentions this year. I have very little experience so not sure if that is about average

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Do you think the difference could be the pot size? 15-20cm a year seems pretty decent to me.

Pot size plays a good part. I grow them in a peat based potting mix in a big pot and they seem to like it.
But 15-20cm extensions don't automatically mean they grow fat and big. It just means they spread wide pretty fast. Those extensions in turn need about a year of unhindered growing before they seem to start giving back and bulking the tree.
Thickening trunks to a 'for bonsai' size from a decent cutting size will take roughly 5-7 years. I have tiny cuttings (<10cm) that put out just 4cm a year, those will take 10 years probably.

I don't want to ruin your day or anything, just want to put things in perspective.

 

[Khaiba]

Nursery people mean the unnamed variety. Shimpaku is a variety rather unique to the bonsai world.

What about bonsai nursery people? I asked the owner of a bonsai shop nearby whether the Chinese Juniper cuttings he sells are of a specific cultivar and he said it's the "normal" Chinese Juniper.
He also said that it grows really slowly so I thought that maybe he means the normal Shimpaku instead.

 

[Khaiba]

Pot size plays a good part. I grow them in a peat based potting mix in a big pot and they seem to like it.

I'm planning on putting mine in the raised bed in the garden (open bottom), not sure if they grow much faster then (compared to being in a pot).
Fortunately, I am mainly focusing on doing forest/groups rather than solitary bonsai, so the trunks don't have to be as thick and taper isn't all that important if I understood correctly.
My plan is to leave them in the ground for 2-4 years and then put them in training pots.

Anyone have any recommendation for what kind of species to use in forest/group plantings?
So far I have Chinese Junipers, Chinese Elm, Larix kaempferi (jap. Larch) and bought some Hinoki cypress seeds (non-dwarf varieties are almost impossible to find!).

Was also thinking of doing a Deshojo (acer pal.) forest through cuttings, but I am unsure if they survive well on their own roots. Anyone have experience with ungrafted japanese maples?

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

What about bonsai nursery people? I asked the owner of a bonsai shop nearby whether the Chinese Juniper cuttings he sells are of a specific cultivar and he said it's the "normal" Chinese Juniper.
He also said that it grows really slowly so I thought that maybe he means the normal Shimpaku instead.

“Normal Chinese Juniper” to a bonsai nursery could be procumbens nana. Without photos, this is a guessing game.

 

[sorce]

Sorce