$12 Chinese elm suggestions

[19Mateo83]

So I picked this little guy up at a local nursery advertised as “Chinese elm pre bonsai $11.95”. Anyone have any suggestions where to go with it? I’ve heard that they can be frustrating as to growth rates and ramification. It is in horrible soil and that needs to go first but I would like to let it get acclimated to outdoors before I do anything. I’ve heard these guys can withstand off reason repots? It came from a greenhouse so I’m doubting it got a proper “winter”. All suggestions and tips are welcome!

 

[Crazy Diamond]

They need to get very long strong branches to thick up the trunk, I would put it in the ground with a wood plank to get radial roots and let it grow one or two years, then chop it

 

[River's Edge]

They need to get very long strong branches to thick up the trunk, I would put it in the ground with a wood plank to get radial roots and let it grow one or two years, then chop it

I would wire for movement in the lower trunk at the same time as repotting and then plant in ground or grow box for several years to thicken the trunk. Be sure to arrange the roots when repotting and be prepared to do root work regularly with reasonable frequent timing for best results. I would suggest very two years until you are satisfied with the basic form of the root spread. They can get thicker more difficult roots to work with quite quickly. Placing on a board or tile is a good suggestion when the form allows during a repot.
It may not be advisable the first go around out of the nursery pot.

 

[PA_Penjing]

Who told you they were frustrating? They should grow 7' a year where you live. On top of that they can be trimmed back multiple times a season to fast track ramification. I'm newer to elms but my biggest worry is how I'm ever going to slow growth down once they are "finished". And I'm in zone 6 PA. That said, they are really fun trees. I can't give advice without knowing what you envision for the end product. I would just let it get healthy this season. It'll be fine in garden soil for the time being. Unless of course it's hella root bound already

 

[19Mateo83]

Who told you they were frustrating? They should grow 7' a year where you live. On top of that they can be trimmed back multiple times a season to fast track ramification. I'm newer to elms but my biggest worry is how I'm ever going to slow growth down once they are "finished". And I'm in zone 6 PA. That said, they are really fun trees. I can't give advice without knowing what you envision for the end product. I would just let it get healthy this season. It'll be fine in garden soil for the time being. Unless of course it's hella root bound already

I don’t think the roots will be an issue.

 

[Colorado]

Nice starter, I would not say Chinese elm is “frustrating” as a bonsai subject. I would actually argue it is one of the best deciduous species of tree for bonsai! Small leaves, good bark, relatively robust growth, cold hardy to a degree…what more can we ask for?!

 

[Shibui]

I like Chinese elm as a great bonsai plant too. They grow relatively quick, respond to pruning very quick and with profuse new shoots. Also quite hardy.

At some stage you'll need to decide on the basic style you want form this tree. Chinese elms are often grown as 'broom' style which requires different development to informal uptight and most other bonsai styles.

I'll back up @River's Edge on Chinese elm frequently developing just a few thick roots. Frequent hard root pruning seems to be the best cure for that. All those roots at the bottom of the pot could be coming from one or 2 long, thick roots from the trunk. Check early before developing a thick trunk as remedy is so much easier earlier than after.
Chinese elms can be repotted and root pruned later than many species but I still repot in spring if I'm intending much root reduction. Maybe it would be Ok late but I'm still more comfortable doing heavy root reduction before it gets a good canopy of leaves going.

I would not bother with wire and bend a trunk like that. Wired bends are rarely as attractive as a bend from pruning so I'd be chopping the trunk at some stage to get the initial bend and branching. Looks to me like you'll need a trunk chop at some stage to make best use of the lower trunk.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I think Chinese elm is probably the single easiest / best species for bonsai beginners. It is the tree that I recommend first when people are starting out and are looking for a tree that can handle a lot of abuse.

It grows in most USDA Zones in the US - hardy from zones 4 through 9+. It will grow well in fun sun to partial shade. It is a strong grower, can be pruned aggressively, back-buds easily, and can be easily propagated via air-layer or cutting. Numerous cultivars exist that offer a range of interesting characteristics.

I honestly don't know of a single weakness... with the possible exception that it is so common that it doesn't get the credit it deserves

 

[Apex37]

I did a fun experiment over the winter where as a complete noob decided to try his luck with leaving these outside all winter, not really knowing what the hell I was doing. Well one made it, the other didn't. Funny enough the rough bark Chinese Elm was the one that pulled through (I'm definitely okay with this). Next year I'll have to provide more protection during freezing temps and snow. Now this is by no means a controlled experiment where I can say that rough bark variety is more cold tolerant, but it SEEMED to be the case here. Both were on same watering schedule, location, and pot types. Either way, I love Chinese elms and they are some of the most forgiving and hardy trees, just maybe don't leave them in sub freezing temps.

 

[HorseloverFat]

All great advice/thoughts and experiences shared here..

Gotta touch on one point.

It grows in most USDA Zones in the US - hardy from zones 4 through 9+.

The folks I converse with from BABS say that we are right on the cusp of Parvifolias needing protection.(in containers).. because we exist in a USDA Zone 5a.. but AHS Index of 2 or 3 here in the "armpit" of the peninsula... "thumbpit"?

I just wanted it noted.. Parvifolia only need protection if your as cold as I.. or colder..

MOST areas of Zone 5 would be alright, in containers, unprotected as well.

 

[rollwithak]

I would wire for movement in the lower trunk at the same time as repotting

i 2nd that

 

[19Mateo83]

All great advice/thoughts and experiences shared here..

Gotta touch on one point.

The folks I converse with from BABS say that we are right on the cusp of Parvifolias needing protection.(in containers).. because we exist in a USDA Zone 5a.. but AHS Index of 2 or 3 here in the "armpit" of the peninsula... "thumbpit"?

I just wanted it noted.. Parvifolia only need protection if your as cold as I.. or colder..

MOST areas of Zone 5 would be alright, in containers, unprotected as well.

So no worries for me here in 7B then

 

[bonsaiboy60077]

I have a chinese elm that I keep outside all summer in the chicago area, and indoors under grow lights for the winter, had it for around 2 years now, and just repotted it into a new bonsai pot this week. strong little tree.

 

[19Mateo83]

i 2nd that

I tried wire. Two wraps of 10guage copper and it still won’t bend.

 

[rollwithak]

I tried wire. Two wraps of 10guage copper and it still won’t bend.

Might need bigger wire. Also, not sure if the trunk split/raffia method can be applied on Chinese maple, look up some videos if you haven’t seen this already. Could be a fun project.

 

[LanceMac10]

I did a fun experiment over the winter where as a complete noob decided to try his luck with leaving these outside all winter, not really knowing what the hell I was doing. Well one made it, the other didn't. Funny enough the rough bark Chinese Elm was the one that pulled through (I'm definitely okay with this). Next year I'll have to provide more protection during freezing temps and snow. Now this is by no means a controlled experiment where I can say that rough bark variety is more cold tolerant, but it SEEMED to be the case here. Both were on same watering schedule, location, and pot types. Either way, I love Chinese elms and they are some of the most forgiving and hardy trees, just maybe don't leave them in sub freezing temps.

Interesting. I've killed a dozen or so Chinese Elms, (yes, very frustrating!), but the one cork-bark I have left is unfazed.....late winter/early spring is when they usually kick it......

....they do not respond well to thaw-freeze cycles is about my best idea of the issue.....certainly no Chinese Elms in any landscaping here, but plenty local varieties plenty hardy.....



But yes, great first tree to start out on.......grow it out hard and cut back if you don't like the direction.....you'll have to rub buds off, they'll be so many!!!

 

[bonsaiboy60077]

Interesting. I've killed a dozen or so Chinese Elms, (yes, very frustrating!), but the one cork-bark I have left is unfazed.....late winter/early spring is when they usually kick it......

....they do not respond well to thaw-freeze cycles is about my best idea of the issue.....certainly no Chinese Elms in any landscaping here, but plenty local varieties plenty hardy.....



But yes, great first tree to start out on.......grow it out hard and cut back if you don't like the direction.....you'll have to rub buds off, they'll be so many!!!

thats why the one i have lives inside under grow lights for the winter in Chicago

 

[dbonsaiw]

Chinese elms can be repotted and root pruned later than many species but I still repot in spring if I'm intending much root reduction. Maybe it would be Ok late but I'm still more comfortable doing heavy root reduction before it gets a good canopy of leaves going.

I've heard that Chinese Elm can be repotted at really any time. Is that indeed the case? Could Mateo's tree be repotted now even though in leaf?

 

[19Mateo83]

I've heard that Chinese Elm can be repotted at really any time. Is that indeed the case? Could Mateo's tree be repotted now even though in leaf?

I’ve heard this too but I don’t want to be that guy that kills this little elm as soon as I get it lol. Can anyone confirm this?

 

[Shibui]

I've heard that Chinese Elm can be repotted at really any time. Is that indeed the case? Could Mateo's tree be repotted now even though in leaf?

In my warmer climate Chinese elms do not always lose leaves in winter. Waiting for leaves to drop before repotting is futile. We've adapted to repotting even if they have leaves and no problem. I still repot in spring, usually before new growth starts because that's convenient and I feel safer.
Growers further north from me (warmer and into tropical zones) tell me that Chinese elm never lose leaves there and rarely stop growing. They also got frustrated with waiting for dormancy and tried repotting even if there's new shoots - no problem there either.
Take home for me is that Chinese elm does not care when it is root pruned and will survive even when root pruned when growing.

From the photos it appears this Chinese elm is dormant, even though there are still leaves. I'd have no problem repotting now in your early spring.