Wire- Copper, Aluminum...Galvanized Steel

[Newish in Oregon]

I've seen lots of discussion about copper and aluminum but not much on galvanized steel. So far my experience is only with aluminum but wondering if galvanized might be a cheaper option. And if galvanized is worth considering, wonder about 'gauge equivalency'. [I came across a table equating 22 gauge copper to 1.0 mm aluminum up to 6 gauge copper being equivalent to 5.0 mm aluminum]

 

[leatherback]

Stee is way to stiff.

 

[Dav4]

I've seen lots of discussion about copper and aluminum but not much on galvanized steel. So far my experience is only with aluminum but wondering if galvanized might be a cheaper option. And if galvanized is worth considering, wonder about 'gauge equivalency'. [I came across a table equating 22 gauge copper to 1.0 mm aluminum up to 6 gauge copper being equivalent to 5.0 mm aluminum]

I've seen some people use steel wire, both rubber coated or either stainless or galvanized, as pot tie ins, but never to wire the branches. For wiring out the canopy, stick to, preferably, aluminum for deciduous, and copper for conifers

 

[Shibui]

You may be able to use gal wire for wiring branches but it is difficult to work with an also stands out like proverbial canine testicles. Copper and anodized al are more muted so don't distract from the tree.
I have also seen some discussion that zinc coating may leach from the wire and have some negative affect on the tree or moss. When steel wire rusts the stain ion bark can stay for years.
Cu an Al may seem expensive when you buy a roll but for the smaller amounts used on most trees the cost is really negligible.

 

[sorce]

F Zinc!

Sorce

 

[Adair M]

I’ve never used galvanized steel wire for anything for bonsai. I have used stainless steel wire for guy wires where I needed extreme strength. (Bending using a Jack.). Never for spiral wiring branches.

 

[HENDO]

I've been hooked on trying out 17-gauge galvanized steel wire for anchoring since witnessing a visiting artist here crank out several good repots with it. Rather than wrap the anchor wires across/around the root ball, he would wedge ~2-4 pieces of bamboo into the root ball directly above/between anchor holes and anchor the wire to those. It was very effective but obviously this only works with a solid root ball.

However, my attempts at using it for anchoring have not been 100% successful - it is much less forgiving than aluminum and breaks easily if twists aren't done properly. It absolutely needs to be pre-bent @90deg where it passes-through the anchor holes (I do this with aluminum anyways).

I like how it doesn't stretch like aluminum. For this reason I've also started using it for guy wiring on developing trees.

Most recently it kicked butt for this awkward ROR project, this unproportionally tall object didn't wiggle at all!

 

[MrWunderful]

Ryan Neil pushes it pretty hard, but I disagree with its use. It doesnt twist as good as copper and Aluminum, and can be more brittle. I would use un-annealed copper before galvanized wire.

 

[WNC Bonsai]

Ryan Neil pushes it pretty hard, but I disagree with its use. It doesnt twist as good as copper and Aluminum, and can be more brittle. I would use un-annealed copper before galvanized wire.

I think he mainly uses it for tie ins because it doesn’t stretch like aluminum and copper will. Of course he is potting up some pretty big and valuable stuff so I can see his point about wanting to stabilize it.

 

[MrWunderful]

I think he mainly uses it for tie ins because it doesn’t stretch like aluminum and copper will. Of course he is potting up some pretty big and valuable stuff so I can see his point about wanting to stabilize it.

I definitely see why he uses it. I am more comfortable with copper or aluminum, and prefer a slight stretch for tie ins, actually. But i dont really work with high quality conifer yamadori like he does, either.

 

[Newish in Oregon]

Thanks all for your input. Sounds like galvanized wire's only potential use would be for tie ins. I hadn't thought about zinc's impact on moss. Zinc salts are sold as a moss control on roofs; some also install zinc sheet metal at the roof peak so zinc ions slowly leach out and control roof moss.

 

[leatherback]

Oddly enough.. I do not have stretch in my aluminium wire, as far as I know.

 

[Adair M]

I use aluminum wire for tie-ins on my trees. I have several gauges to choose from. I have heard that Ryan uses the galvanized steel for shohin! Really??? I can’t imagine having a tree that needed to be tied into a shohin pot using steel wire. If you have to get it THAT tight, you’re likely to bust the pot tightening the wire!

The chopstick in the root ball thing is a useful technique to have in your bag of tricks, but is not required for every repot. I recently repotted over a dozen trees, and I had to do the chopstick thing on one of the trees. And even on that one, it was a case of being extra cautious. The wire cage I make works for 95% of the repots.

 

[HENDO]

I use aluminum wire for tie-ins on my trees. I have several gauges to choose from. I have heard that Ryan uses the galvanized steel for shohin! Really??? I can’t imagine having a tree that needed to be tied into a shohin pot using steel wire. If you have to get it THAT tight, you’re likely to bust the pot tightening the wire!

The chopstick in the root ball thing is a useful technique to have in your bag of tricks, but is not required for every repot. I recently repotted over a dozen trees, and I had to do the chopstick thing on one of the trees. And even on that one, it was a case of being extra cautious. The wire cage I make works for 95% of the repots.

What exactly is the benefit of the chopstick in the root ball technique? I thought it was very interesting but wasn't 100% sure of why you would do that over the wire wrap/cage technique - perhaps to reduce some tightening/restriction effect of the wire against the root ball?

All I know is that I'm terrible at the chopstick technique and that most of my plants don't yet even have a root ball that would support it.

 

[Newish in Oregon]

The chopstick in the root ball thing is a useful technique to have in your bag of tricks, but is not required for every repot. I recently repotted over a dozen trees, and I had to do the chopstick thing on one of the trees. And even on that one, it was a case of being extra cautious. The wire cage I make works for 95% of the repots.

I just barerooted and repotted almost all of my trees [most for the first time], tied them in with aluminum and think they'll be all right. But since I'm very much at the learning stage, I'd be interested in a few pictures of the chopstick rootball technique and how the more experienced craft their wire cages

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I used galvanized steel on my spruce for the finer wiring. The silver on the grey bark is harder to spot than darker copper. When heated up before use, it'll turn rusty in a few weeks, I use that stuff to wire seedlings and leave the wire on. Within a year or so, it's rusted away if it isn't overgrown.

For tie wires I use 1.5mm plastic coated steel, simply because it's cheap and holds for roughly a decade. Same goes for guy wires. I can put more tension on steel than on alu wire. My alu wire tends to snap when I twist and pull.

 

[Munch9]

Well If you are looking for a cheaper option, even cheaper than a cheap Al wire, you can try find some electrical wires, heard someone that used it before wires were widely available.

 

[Adair M]

I used galvanized steel on my spruce for the finer wiring. The silver on the grey bark is harder to spot than darker copper. When heated up before use, it'll turn rusty in a few weeks, I use that stuff to wire seedlings and leave the wire on. Within a year or so, it's rusted away if it isn't overgrown.

For tie wires I use 1.5mm plastic coated steel, simply because it's cheap and holds for roughly a decade. Same goes for guy wires. I can put more tension on steel than on alu wire. My alu wire tends to snap when I twist and pull.

If your aluminum wire snaps as you “twist and pull”, then you aren’t doing it right!

You are correct when you say it will snap when you “twist and pull”. Don’t do that! When you are tightening the aluminum, start the twist with only mild pulling pressure. Then, stop twisting, and pull to tighten. Once you have tighened, stop pulling, then twist. The process is pull to take out the “looseness”, then stop pulling, twist to take up the slack you just created. If necessary, pull, then twist again until it’s solid. In fact, when I’m twisting the final couple of twists, I actually push the pliers forward, rather than pull!

 

[Forsoothe!]

I've used all kinds of cheaper steel wire and it's harder to remove from the tree (for me). I don't wire for pretty, so I don't care what it looks like, but for me getting it back off is always a pain in the ass. Almost always that's cutting it off, loop-by-loop to save the branches from damage. I favor aluminum for smaller gauges and copper for larger gauges. The more wiring you do, the less you care about costs because there is no substitute for the effects.

 

[Tidal Bonsai]

No one has ever recommended using galvanized steel wire to wire trees, lol!

I tried using galvanized steel for tie downs and guy wires last season because all the cool kids were doing it. Galvanized steel is not stainless steel, so it will rust and corrode when kept wet. I actually helped repot a tree that was purchased from Mirai, and the galvanized steel completely disintegrated after approx. 5 years in the pot. There was nothing holding the tree in at all!!! On the bottom of anderson flats, the galvanized steel rusted and snapped in as little as one season! On the bottom of regular pots where there is airflow, it has held up well over the past year. However, it will leave rust marks on the bottom of your nicer pots.

Its great for guy wires because the 18 gauge galvanized steel is stronger than 18 gauge copper. However, I have decided to stop using it for tie downs once my roll runs out, and switch back to aluminum. Aluminum is more brittle, but will last a lot longer since it wont rust. I have also noticed a big difference in between Japanese aluminum bonsai rolls and American. Its worth the extra money for the real Japanese aluminum wire, hands down!