When and how do I find trunk base - pine nursery stocks

[Manbris]

Hi all- first time posting here. A novice on pines and bonsai in general and based in the north of England.

I have several Scots and mugo pines trees from local nursery- 10-15 years old. The trunk base seemed to be buried in the pot but sure how deep.

Is it safe to dig in a couple of inches now to look for the base of the trunk? How to do it without damaging the bark? Or should I wait till spring/late winter during repot? Any advice would be appreciated.

Pics below - mugo

 

[RODERLO]

Hi and welcome!

In all actuality you could consider repotting mugo’s right now. Many reputable growers have good success repotting during the july/august period.
I’d strongly recommend checking out this Mugo tutorial by our late member Vance Wood:

Resource icon

Compiled Vance Wood on Mugo Pines

Jun 5, 2015

Posts compiled from Bonsai Nut by Vance Wood from 2010 onward on mugo pine care and development

• Lazylightningny
• mugo pine pine care
• Tutorials

There is a section in it that’s specifically focussing on how to treat nursery stock Mugo’s.

Good luck!

 

[Paradox]

I agree that some people can and do repot mugo after father's day in some areas of the U.S. with success, I would follow the advice of others near you in England as to timing.

Imo its getting a tad late in northern areas of the U.S. to repot now.

As to your question about finding the base. You can dig down/scrape away the soil very carefully without damaging the trunk. If you aren't comfortable doing it, it is perfectly fine to wait until you repot the tree.

 

[leatherback]

Is it safe to dig in a couple of inches now to look for the base of the trunk?

Absolutely

How to do it without damaging the bark?

Just be gentle, work with care and do not scrape the trunk..?

 

[Manbris]

Thanks so much - really appreciated.

 

[Shibui]

You can actually be a little more aggressive than the above seem to suggest.
These trees appear to have been in the pots for a few years so there will be lots of roots growing all through the pot and back up around the trunk and roots. You will almost certainly have to break some small roots to get down to the larger roots at the base of the trunk but that's not a problem for the trees. All trees have way more roots than they actually need - just in case so losing a few won't have any effect. The tree will just set about growing some more.
Try raking out away from the trunk. You will break a few roots that are growing across but you don't want those anyway. The important roots for good nebari are those that grow radially away from the trunk.
As for damaging the trunk, you don't need to go right up to the trunk. The roots you are looking for grow out and away from the trunk so you'll still find them even if you stay 1 cm from the trunk itself. After working out what's what you can then dig the soil away closer to the trunk a little more carefully if you are worried about damaging the bark. Personally, I would not be so worried about possible bark damage. There won't be mature, flaky bark below ground level and any minor damage to the bark will soon heal.

 

[Manbris]

Thanks again. Just raked a bit more - the thing is both trunks are covered with moss close to the base/neglected over time. When I pick the moss or take close to the trunk - the flaky bark fall a bit too. Shall I leave it to try out for a while? The moss should die back on the new location. Just received these last couple of days.

The plus is trees are very healthy- full of mycelium and roots.

Also the Scots pine martham - dwarf

 

[Shibui]

The tree looks very healthy and strong. The big problem with overgrown pines is getting the branches and trunk back down to a reasonable length when pines do not back bud easily. Hopefully you have plenty of close in side branches to cut back to. The tree will initially look very sparse and open but, hopefully, the reduction will also stimulate some back buds on the bare branches. If that does not eventuate you'll need to either quit or try some more advanced techniques to get new growth closer to the trunk.

Moss clings to bark so I'm not surprised the flaky bark peels off when you try to remove the moss.
I use vinegar mix to kill moss. It is very effective but even dead moss clings on tight.
I'm not sure you need to be quite so obsessive over the bark at this stage. The tree is many years off showable. Flaky bark only takes a few years to regenerate so losing some at this stage is not the end of the world.

You have a lot of branches growing from low on that trunk in the final picture. I guess a lot of those will need to go at some stage but I would not be removing them all in one go. might leave too many joined scars and cause sap flow problems. Probably stage the chops over several years to allow new sap flow past the scars to establish before taking the next batch.

 

[Manbris]

The tree looks very healthy and strong. The big problem with overgrown pines is getting the branches and trunk back down to a reasonable length when pines do not back bud easily. Hopefully you have plenty of close in side branches to cut back to. The tree will initially look very sparse and open but, hopefully, the reduction will also stimulate some back buds on the bare branches. If that does not eventuate you'll need to either quit or try some more advanced techniques to get new growth closer to the trunk.

Moss clings to bark so I'm not surprised the flaky bark peels off when you try to remove the moss.
I use vinegar mix to kill moss. It is very effective but even dead moss clings on tight.
I'm not sure you need to be quite so obsessive over the bark at this stage. The tree is many years off showable. Flaky bark only takes a few years to regenerate so losing some at this stage is not the end of the world.

You have a lot of branches growing from low on that trunk in the final picture. I guess a lot of those will need to go at some stage but I would not be removing them all in one go. might leave too many joined scars and cause sap flow problems. Probably stage the chops over several years to allow new sap flow past the scars to establish before taking the next batch.

Thanks so much. Indeed - I will watch carefully and see.

On the last point, what could we do to reduce the cut scars on the trunk. Do we cut in more to the trunk or use paste?

What sort of rough timeline to plan? Do I need to half bare root for 2 years then select branches for how many years? Sorry not sure the best process

 

[TrevorLarsen]

With pine you don’t really need to seal wounds since pines produce so much sap, but I have seal some of them so you can. I would follow the Vance Wood guide, I have done about a dozen following the guide and it has work flawlessly.
It is possible to find good material just look for a thick trunk and dig around in the soil to check.

 

[Shibui]

On the last point, what could we do to reduce the cut scars on the trunk. Do we cut in more to the trunk or use paste?

I'd use both - or time.
My trials with sealers show that any sealer helps the cut heal over. Reducing the cut helps reduce swelling as the cut heals.
Time alleviates most problems.
So: reduce cuts, seal cuts or wait. The choice is yours.