Suggest an indoor evergreen or conifer to stay under lights

[ShadyStump]

I have, apparently, the only kitchen sink in the western world without a window to look out while doing dishes. In stead there is a plain gray painted wall.
I find this unacceptable.

I want to install a small shelf and keep a little shohin there. Maybe a landscape painting behind it. There is a 4 bulb light fixture on that wall, like is often found above the sinks in bathrooms. I was thinking of replacing 1 or 2 bulbs with grow bulbs.
Here's what it is.


Here's the tough part.
I'd like something resembling the native flora here in southern Colorado, but that's going to be tough. It's a semi-arid climate, dominated by piñon juniper woodlands. Sunburns on lightly overcast days are not unheard of here. A juniper of some sort seems nice, but I'm not sure it'll work. I've pretty much nixed pines of any sort.

I have lots of ficus already, but I don't want that for this project. I bought a little mass produced juniper over the weekend, but it's already unhappy it looks, so I'm not sure I can make it work with anything less than the brightest lights burning 20 hours a day.
Doesn't have to be a conifer, that just feels right.

Any suggestions on trees or other problem solvers welcomed.
Thanks!

Edit: And dear God, don't tell me it's not possible! If I wanted to give up before even trying, would I have posted this? I like trying stupid, impossible things on occasion.

 

[leatherback]

Consider podocarpus

 

[Potawatomi13]

To personal knowledge no known conifer survives well or thrives without natural solar radiation. Raise tree under fake lights, put under natural sun tree will Sunburn if not die.

 

[ShadyStump]

Consider podocarpus

I'll research it. Thanks.

To personal knowledge no known conifer survives well or thrives without natural solar radiation. Raise tree under fake lights, put under natural sun tree will Sunburn if not die.

Doesn't have to be a conifer. It's the image I'm after, the illusion.
I considered rosemary, but never had luck growing them in shady outdoor areas even, so dropped it.
Though something edible wouldn't be inappropriate to the location.

Again, I do plan on some hefty lighting, and it would be one of the most humid and warmest spots in the house.
And I have no qualms with failing a couple times in the attempt.

Wasn't there a guy who managed to grow bonsai indoors under normal fluorescent lights for decades, the primary limiting factor being the species' needs for dormancy? Theoretically, my juniper might work once it's recovered from it's abuse, but grow very slowly.
I'm just saying that it's been proven possible.

 

[HorseloverFat]

People around here, keep Italian Stone Pines and Norfolk Island Pines in windowsills... not sure about full-blown lamps.... but they do NOT “thrive”

If your lamps are strong.. you could grow Rosemary or Thyme... purchase large nursery stock, and “whittle” down to a decent starting point.

You could do, Lil arid/trop compound-leaved plants... styled like conifers...

 

[HorseloverFat]

Wasn't there a guy who managed to grow bonsai indoors under normal fluorescent lights for decades, the primary limiting factor being the species' needs for dormancy? Theoretically, my juniper might work once it's recovered from it's abuse, but grow very slowly.
I'm just saying that it's been proven possible.

This is a rough avenue, friend...

Like the one person that claims “Jailhouse Acid” or “Bananadine” works..

I switched my Rooms downstairs this year, separating my living, from growing “quarters”... Now I have ONLY lamps in my rooms.. and the difficulties where numerous.. things like ventilation AROUND pots, and side/under light all became VERY relevant once I took that natural light/heat transfer out of the equation. Things have balanced NOW.. I purchased MORE lamps, more fans.. arranged the supplementary lights to provide MOST angles.. yadda-yadda-yadda...

My rooms would kill a Juniper, QUICK.. just saying.

 

[Paradox]

Wasn't there a guy who managed to grow bonsai indoors under normal fluorescent lights for decades, the primary limiting factor being the species' needs for dormancy? Theoretically, my juniper might work once it's recovered from it's abuse, but grow very slowly.
I'm just saying that it's been proven possible.

There was one person (out of thousands) and I forget his name right now. He was able to keep Juniperus procumbens nana alive. However it wasnt as simple a set up as just under s couple of grow lights in the corner of a room. It was an elaborate setup with high intensity lighting and he had some kind of cold room to give them a dormancy period. I dont know the exact details of his set up but iirc, it was a rather technical setup. You will not be able to keep a juniper alive in a house year round without some kind of dormancy period.

 

[HankDio]

Here's a great little indoor evergreen. Needs no water, no sunlight, and it will look good all year round. They're also impossible to kill. You can even switch out the foliage if you get tired of the evergreen.

 

[Carol 83]

There was one person (out of thousands) and I forget his name right now

Jerry Meislik?

 

[cmeg1]

In theory,if you like experimentation,get a good led.Humidity should be between about 40-60%.
if too humid it will not transpire and get deficiencies as lots of mineral ions are taken up through transpiration process.Also a very light breeze from a fan …..or else moisture will stay at leaves and be wayyy humid and molds and deficiency and such.
Low on the salts and higher on the water….I would get a cheap $100 ro filter for pure water and use 2 part hydro nutrients ( I have a perfect recipe, send a pm).
Temps are best at 75-80f,but if you cannot….well you cannot.
I will say Co2 is usually boosted by 50% in a winter home……….if not doubled!!!!!!
Mine is always 500-1000 ppm…….ambient is 380 ppm or so….
I run my tents at 1000 ppm and get crazy vigor.

Here are recomende lights for windowsill?
right now…..light is your limiting factor.

HLG SABER 150

HLG SABER High efficiency 150W Full Spectrum LED BAR. Passive cooled. 4ft length provides a great spread with minimal shadows. 315pcs full spectrum white LEDs and 14pcs Deep Red 660nm

horticulturelightinggroup.com

 

[cmeg1]

Light and nutrients….low salt….more water…….they will actually do ok.

a purpose and spacious refridgerator will get a dormancy hovering at 35 f.

2 mnths will suffice.Just plop them right in and it will suffice………small trees only.DO NOT LET FOLIAGE TOUCH WALLS OF FRIDGE.
Here is mine.THEY SURVIVED JUST FINE….Except many losses from touching walls of fridge.
I have even stored seedling cuttings right after rooting for mnths!!!


Or go TROPICAL DUDE!!!!

 

[HorseloverFat]

Light and nutrients….low salt….more water…….they will actually do ok.

a purpose and spacious refridgerator will get a dormancy hovering at 35 f.

2 mnths will suffice.Just plop them right in and it will suffice………small trees only.DO NOT LET FOLIAGE TOUCH WALLS OF FRIDGE.
Here is mine.THEY SURVIVED JUST FINE….Except many losses from touching walls of fridge.
I have even stored seedling cuttings right after rooting for mnths!!!
View attachment 407272View attachment 407274View attachment 407275

Or go TROPICAL DUDE!!!!

Fantastic Info! Thanks!!!

 

[cmeg1]

Long and short I prefer not to store my Pines in the refrigerator.
I use it when neccessity.
All of these total indoor except the last two pics are after being outside for a mnth or so………
They will burst into growth outside in a way that is un-acheivable indoors.

 

[cmeg1]

Indoors you can REALLY
manipulate light recipes for some of the most awesome starters.

Curenntly starting zelkova and Trident maple under extremely blue enhanced spectrum so they dwarf all out ,but pop seriously low buds and internodes on like a 1” seedling.Then I can put into regular indoor grow to let leaders run and then chop hard to base when they’re 1” thick!!!
A very nice start to clump style( the chop back/base thickening method). Instead of fusing whips together.
This resulting healing of chop sites makes a very nice clump style base after letting new growth run over and over.

LOOK WHAT A 30-50% total blue enhanced light recipe did to these JBP seedling cuttings.They set terminal buds at only 1/2” tall.
I thought this a bit rediculous,but am revisiting this for my Clump style starters currently.
If I dwarf them or create like 10 internodes in first inch…..I could get like to s of leaders to extend.That way when I perform first chop back ( completely to the base), there would have been sufficient,if not superb nebari swelling….several escape leads insted of one….chop back when like 3/4” thick or something.
I actually learned this technique from Bonsai Focus Magazine…….I’m just trying to build on it.

OK….I BETTER QUIT!!!
I HONESTLY WAS ATTEMPTING TO HELP….NOT TO CLAIM YOUR THREAD @ShadyStump

 

[cmeg1]

Also I highly suggest growing your hardy dormancy requiring material outside and let harden naturally outdoors…..then give the required 1000 hrs dormancy in fridge( quite quickly actually).A mere 5 weeks!!!!
Then start to growth indoors early extended season…
Grow indoors nice extended season….till’ about mid Summer then to have a natural Autumn prep to dormancy outdoors again……indoor fridge….etc.

Totally doable and quite fun….especially reaping the extra co2 levels indoors…….and quite short internodes of the blue spectrum enhanced lighting that is so available.
And a big gain on growing season grow cycle.

 

[cmeg1]

a 5 or 6 mnth seedling cutting!!!!!

 

[Shogun610]

Light and nutrients….low salt….more water…….they will actually do ok.

a purpose and spacious refridgerator will get a dormancy hovering at 35 f.

2 mnths will suffice.Just plop them right in and it will suffice………small trees only.DO NOT LET FOLIAGE TOUCH WALLS OF FRIDGE.
Here is mine.THEY SURVIVED JUST FINE….Except many losses from touching walls of fridge.
I have even stored seedling cuttings right after rooting for mnths!!!
View attachment 407272View attachment 407274View attachment 407275

Or go TROPICAL DUDE!!!!

Damn hahah , talk about I’ll be right back I’m gonna grab a cold one .

 

[Paradox]

@cmeg, how many years have you kept pines alive totally indoors with no outdoor time at all and giving them a dormancy period in a fridge?

 

[Crazy Diamond]

@cmeg1 have you ever tryed to root branch cutings from JBP?

 

[TinyArt]

@ShadyStump -- just a thought (without experience to back it) -- if/when light is the only issue to manage, could you rotate several trees, so that they all stay healthy while you still get to enjoy each on the shelf for a couple of days?