Small windswept shimpaku juniper - initial styling

[NeyensNeuro]

Hey folks! I've dabbled in bonsai for about a year, but I'm pretty new to this forum. I bought a tiny shimpaku today and thought that the young, flexible tree would lend itself well to a windswept!

My questions are:

1) Which side should be the front? There are two long branches on one side, a short branch between them on the opposite side, and an abrupt apex.

2) Are there special pruning rules for windswept? (i.e. - should I remove more foliage near the trunk and focus on distant growth?)

3) Can I choose almost any branch angle as long as they face the same way?

Thanks in advance for the input!

 

[Michael P]

Nice start!

1) I like both one and three.

2) Not really. Once the major branches are in position, one would prune as appropriate for Shimpaku, keeping mind that you want long tapering pads of foliage.

3) I don't quite understand your question. Branch angles should be similar for a harmonious design, and windswept branches are usually near horizontal.

One thing you didn't ask about is the trunk angle. Windswept trunks typically lean away from the direction of the wind, the same as the branches. Your trunk leans toward the direction of the wind. In windswept we assume that the trunk is bent by the same force as the branches. You will see exceptions to this, but it hard to make it believable.

You may be able to change the lean of the trunk with wire, or by changing the planting angle in a future repot.

 

[NeyensNeuro]

Thank you! I knew something didn't hit right. I was able to shift the trunk , and I have it angled in the direction that I plan to repot.

With a young tree like this, having undergone some pruning and wiring, I probably shouldn't repot until at least next spring right?

 

[SouthernMaple]

Huge fan of 3, but it could be because I am right brain dominant, but 1 is fine just to me not as good. I personally would shorten the higher of the two branches by a few nodes so that the lower branch is longer.

 

[NeyensNeuro]

Huge fan of 3, but it could be because I am right brain dominant, but 1 is fine just to me not as good. I personally would shorten the higher of the two branches by a few nodes so that the lower branch is longer.

Agreed, on both accounts! I think the top branch also needs to be pruned so that the bottom can thicken

 

[Deleted member 47471]

Hey folks! I've dabbled in bonsai for about a year, but I'm pretty new to this forum. I bought a tiny shimpaku today and thought that the young, flexible tree would lend itself well to a windswept!

My questions are:

1) Which side should be the front? There are two long branches on one side, a short branch between them on the opposite side, and an abrupt apex.

2) Are there special pruning rules for windswept? (i.e. - should I remove more foliage near the trunk and focus on distant growth?)

3) Can I choose almost any branch angle as long as they face the same way?

Thanks in advance for the input!

Very nice start. Option 3 looks good. If you want to create a more dramatic effect, extend the branches in the same direction as the trunk lean. For example, if trunk leans far to the left side, the branches go left. Rotate tree 180 if you prefer the right-sided lean. Whichever you prefer, this positioning creates a dramatic "in the moment" kind of effect as if to display a long-standing wind swept tree, after years of wind and pressure, is now being pushed over by the wind as you view it.

Example: https://www.bonsai-nbf.org/blog-archive/2023/3/27/in-memoriam-marybel-balendonck

 

[czaczaja]

3 looks better than 1 as the middle branch is in the back and not blocking the trunk like it is in 1. I would even go as much as leaning the tree further towards the right side to emphasize the flow.

 

[Paradox]

Its a good start.
My only criticism is that you should bend the trunk more toward the direction that the branches are going.
Right now you have a very straight trunk and the long "windswept" branches.
If this tree was truly growing in an area that is windy enough from one direction to make the branches grow like that, then the trunk should also have grown toward the direction that the branches are going. This will make the overall picture more convincing for a windswept tree.
Keep in mind, windswept is one of the most difficult styles to do convincingly.

 

[SouthernMaple]

Its a good start.
My only criticism is that you should bend the trunk more toward the direction that the branches are going.
Right now you have a very straight trunk and the long "windswept" branches.
If this tree was truly growing in an area that is windy enough from one direction to make the branches grow like that, then the trunk should also have grown toward the direction that the branches are going. This will make the overall picture more convincing for a windswept tree.
Keep in mind, windswept is one of the most difficult styles to do convincingly.

i totally disagree. I feel that a "very straight trunk" is defined in picture 2. Picture 3 has a great subtle slanted trunk and by moving the trunk to the left would straighten it out.

 

[Paradox]

i totally disagree. I feel that a "very straight trunk" is defined in picture 2. Picture 3 has a great subtle slanted trunk and by moving the trunk to the left would straighten it out.

The trunk is leaning in the opposite direction of where the branches are going (ie into the wind) - referring to picture 3 here.
Trees that would be in that windy of conditions to cause the branches to extend only on one side of the trunk would not grow into the wind like that.
So it doesn't look like a convincing picture of a windswept tree, sorry
If the trunk was bent a little bit more toward where the branches are going, ie more of a curve to it, not straight, it would make for a better picture imo

 

[Wulfskaar]

I like when the trunk is leaning into the wind rather than also being swept. I think it gives the tree a more powerful appearance and doesn't make it look off balance.

 

[SouthernMaple]

The trunk is leaning in the opposite direction of where the branches are going (ie into the wind) - referring to picture 3 here.
Trees that would be in that windy of conditions to cause the branches to extend only on one side of the trunk would not grow into the wind like that.
So it doesn't look like a convincing picture of a windswept tree, sorry
If the trunk was bent a little bit more toward where the branches are going, ie more of a curve to it, not straight, it would make for a better picture imo

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[Paradox]

I guess when you don't understand physics and how it effects the natural world, the complete opposite of what actually happens seems plausible

 

[SouthernMaple]

I guess when you don't understand physics and how it effects the natural world, the complete opposite of what actually happens seems plausible

no i understand physics, but I also understand different opinions and accept those and try to live my life viewing things non linear. If everyone agreed on everything this world would be a very boring place.

 

[Paradox]

no i understand physics, but I also understand different opinions and accept those and try to live my life viewing things non linear. If everyone agreed on everything this world would be a very boring place.

Yet you'll criticize me on one part of my opinion (I did say it was a good start but offered an alternative to better the tree) after 2 months on a thread that the OP hasnt been seen in 9 months.
Had I realized the first poster hasn't been seen since May, I never would have even commented on this in November, 6 months after the fact.
Sadly its a good chance the tree is probably dead anyway.

 

[SouthernMaple]

Yet you'll criticize me on one part of my opinion (I did say it was a good start but offered an alternative to better the tree) after 2 months on a thread that the OP hasnt been seen in 9 months.
Had I realized the first poster hasn't been seen since May, I never would have even commented on this in November, 6 months after the fact.
Sadly its a good chance the tree is probably dead anyway.

Thats kind of a negative thing to say... i hope his tree is still alive.

I wouldn't take what I said to be a criticism, just another opinion. The OP was wondering what people had to say about his tree and the options available to him. Giving him different opinions is the best advice we can give him and allows him to look at his styling options from angles he may have never thought of.

As for the timing to my response to you get used to it. I don't do things like you do.

 

[Paradox]

Thats kind of a negative thing to say... i hope his tree is still alive.

I wouldn't take what I said to be a criticism, just another opinion. The OP was wondering what people had to say about his tree and the options available to him. Giving him different opinions is the best advice we can give him and allows him to look at his styling options from angles he may have never thought of.

As for the timing to my response to you get used to it. I don't do things like you do.

I didn't say I hope it's dead, but the unfortunate reality is we haven't even seen this person in 9 months and it unfortunately does happen too often with first trees.

Also don't assume to know me or how I do things based on what I type on this forum.

You've never met me, and you do not know me in the slightest.

Nor I you for that matter. You can't know anyone based on words typed from behind a fake moniker on a message board.

 

[BThibodeaux]

I am a noob. I was originally thinking about a windswept design for my new juniper.

In my mind I was thinking the same you, trunk leaning into the wind, and the branches with the wind. As I thought about the physics I did not know if this was correct, but the image in my head portrayed power in the face of adversity.

Ultimately as I worked with tree during its first styling, I ended up with a literati as that was the way the trunk and branches felt best.

But one day I think I will try a trunk leaning into the wind.

 

[Joelshack2362]

I am a noob. I was originally thinking about a windswept design for my new juniper.

In my mind I was thinking the same you, trunk leaning into the wind, and the branches with the wind. As I thought about the physics I did not know if this was correct, but the image in my head portrayed power in the face of adversity.

Ultimately as I worked with tree during its first styling, I ended up with a literati as that was the way the trunk and branches felt best.

But one day I think I will try a trunk leaning into the wind.

The best way to learn is not through the forums but getting out their and getting your hands dirty. Make mistakes and learn from it. Definitely be alot less drama then this website...lol

 

[Gabler]

The best way to learn is not through the forums but getting out their and getting your hands dirty. Make mistakes and learn from it. Definitely be alot less drama then this website...lol

I spent about ten years on and off killing trees before I took to the internet to figure out what I was doing wrong. I've grown more from three years using this website than I did in ten years dabbling on my own. The great thing about this website is that you don't need to learn as many things the hard way.

To be clear, I'm not suggesting that you can just read about bonsai and immediately know how to do it. You have to go outside, test new skills, and refine your understanding as necessary. However, it is equally incorrect to say that you'll learn more by getting your hands dirty than you can online. You need both theory and practice. This website is a great resource for the former (and it really doesn't have much drama).