Shohin maple design help

[Haidr]

Hi all, I just purchased this maple tree. It’s got all sorts of branches coming out of everywhere, I read somewhere there should be one branch coming out of a single point in maples. Should I remove one branch at the marked area? Can someone please help to shape this bonsai better. Thanks.

 

[Shibui]

Where possible, a single branch is preferrable. Not only does that simplify the design and make it easier to look at, multiple branches tend to cause areas with multi branches and shoots to swell, causing inverse taper which quickly becomes ugly.
Sometimes, especially in smaller bonsai, there's just no other option so we have to tolerate extra close branching. In this case I think you can remove some branches to geta better result.

First up, is the side shown the best front for this tree? I'm wondering whether the other side might look better? The answer to those questions will determine which of those branches should go.
Then you'll need to address all the other places with multiple shoots.

The next thing to look at will be the long internodes on some of the branches.

 

[Haidr]

Thanks for your reply @Shibui. I’ll attach other pictures of the bonsai but I think the one I attached earlier is the better for the front. I have removed the larger branches from the top and removed some obvious ones to keep V shape at the end of each branch. Wired/ tied some branches to bend them slightly. Your suggestion on what branches to remove/ shape would be helpful.

 

[Shibui]

I understand you feel the original pic should be the front but I can see a few cons for that choice - Apex falls away to the back. Largest branch grows directly toward the front.
From the opposite side (img6993) That largest branch grows from the rear to give depth to the composition and apex moves forward. Only a couple of smaller branches to remove to open up that side of the trunk and one of those is already opposite that larger branch so one or the other needs to go if possible.
Smaller trunk also has an apex growing toward the new front so changing front is viable for both trunks.
To earn a place in this tree that smaller trunk really needs some bends. At the moment you have the dichotomy of a distinctly sinuous main trunk next to a very straight, smaller trunk. You may be able to get some movement with wire but bends made by pruning - cut and grow - seem to be far more natural to me. I'd prune low and regrow the trunk slowly, a bit at a time, from one of the lower side shoots.

IMHO your real problem is the cluster of shoots right at the top. I note you have shortened all the shoots but left them all. Clusters like that are common on JM and so is the resulting swelling which is already becoming evident and will only get worse if all those shoots are left.
That bunch of shoots also sits on the longest straight section of trunk in the entire tree. My eye keeps coming back there to both the straight, thick trunk and the lump at the top,
You could try removing the back half of the top clump but that may not solve the problem long term. Many of mine have just grown back bigger than before.
The small branch below the apex grows out and up toward the side I favour as front. That branch could provide an excellent replacement for the upper segment. It is growing in the right direction, it is shorter and thinner than the current top section. If you develop it you could get a new apex with more branches spread out rather than clustered together. That replacement would probably be a 2-4 year project - develop that new branch so it's stronger and better ramified before removing the current apex.

All those reductions may be a bit too much to cope with for now. Feel free to discard my views or take plenty of time to consider any major changes. They are, only someone's opinion, after all

 

[Haidr]

Thank you @Shibui for taking the time for such an elaborate response. I agree with your assessment, specially the about the top clutter and the straight trunk with the larger curved one. It doesn’t just looks right. I wanted to address those issues but lack the required knowledge. I have attached a picture with the changes that would potentially improve the bonsai long term.
1. Cutting the top clutter and growing the thinner branch underneath.
2. Cutting the straight trunk and growing the lower branches will move movement to better align with the curved main trunk. (Or it should be be cut lower)

 

[Shibui]

I see you have already wired that upper branch down. Good choice as a branch if you were to retain the upper section but, if it is to become the replacement trunk it will need to go back upward.
Here's what I would try to aim for in the next 3-5 years.

Please not you do not have to chop the top now. It may even be better to wire that branch upward this summer and try to develop it into a mini apex while the top is still on the tree. Reason is that when it becomes the top it will tend to grow stronger, with long internodes. While the top is still dominant that branch should grow slower with shorter internodes and will be much more in scale when you replace the top. Also less chance of dieback if the replacement leader is a bit stronger.
Downside is the chop. Cut now and it can start to heal over while the new top grows. Later chop will mean healing will be correspondingly further down the track.
I wonder whether that Ebihara partial cut method might be worth trying in this case?

Please note that my experience is that JM do not look great if chops are made straight across. It may initially seem a good idea to leave a side branch but that seems to look awkward in the longer term, often developing a swollen area.
I get much better results with a sloping cut through the node. Leave the branch you need as replacement but remove the opposite branch. That may seem to be counterproductive when you really want a side (or back) branch at the bend. Rest assured that more than 9 out of 10 new buds will emerge from the branch collar and one of those can be developed as the required side branch.
Here's the cuts I would make - seen from the side

Note the chop on the rear upright branch - for the same reason as the minor trunk chop - to develop bends and taper.
Both rear and 2nd trunk could be chopped this year to begin developing replacement trunks.

You may find that Spring shoots are strong, with very long internodes. No use for what you need. Usual advice for trimming JM is to cut shoots back to 1 node but that's no use if the first internode is 3 or 4 cm long. Do not hesitate to remove shoots with long internodes completely. New shoots will soon emerge from the basal branch collar. Initial growth in Spring tends to be long and strong. Replacement shoots that grow later in Spring or early Summer tend to be shorter with close nodes - much better to develop ramification on smaller bonsai.

 

[Haidr]

Thank you again for your help @Shibui. I understand and I’ll do a bit of reading on Ebihara partial cut method for the top chop in the coming years. Meanwhile I’ll do the rear and 2nd trunk cut this season. Also, Going to remove the top wire to let it grow up to be the new apex. Just a few more questions please.
1. Now would be a good time or I should wait for winters end to cut?
2. Should I do a slopping cut for the mini trunk also?
Please tell what would you suggest from the picture attached cut 1,2,3 for the mini trunk. And is cut 4 fine for the top branch.

Appreciate your support to people who are relatively new to the hobby.

 

[Haidr]

If cutting the branch from here. Will new branches grow below the cut?

 

[Shibui]

All trunks should grow mostly toward the selected 'front' of the tree. To achieve that, I think cut marked 2 in purple would be best. You can start off with cut 3 - straight across - and complete cut 2 after that new leader has developed some strength.
Now should be a good time to do major pruning on maples. I did some today. You may see some clear fluid weeping from the cut. That's not usually a problem long term but if it's copious or you are worried a quick root prune will stop any bleeding immediately. The closer to leaf out, the more cuts seem to bleed. I prefer to prune maples soon after leaf drop or after leaf out when they do not seem to bleed much.

If cutting the branch from here. Will new branches grow below the cut?

New shoots will always grow below a cut. The question is how far below?
JM can only shoot from dormant buds at previous nodes. You can usually identify nodes by a slight ridge or raised bump on the stem.

I cannot see any sign of nodes in the dark blue section. There's a possible node at the point of the red arrow (might just be a black mark on the bark?) Even if that's not a node, there is ALWAYS node at the base of every shoot.
If you choose to cut at your blue line that branch will just die back to the closest node below the cut. No problem, just remove the dead part next season. If I'm correct about that node it will shoot there. If that's just a black mark it will shoot from the joint at the main trunk. You can regrow that branch either way, hopefully, without the long internodes but with plenty of side shoots for ramification.

 

[Haidr]

Thank you for your response @Shibui. I have made some drastic cuts. There was no sap flow as I waited for some time before applying the cut paste. I could not stand the swollen apex that would have ruined the taper of the tree more and more with new growth so I removed it. Hopefully once it starts to heal then I would try the sloppy cuts next season. Also, I have cut back the straight branches and hopefully will put some bending in the new ones that grow. Appreciate your help and advice as always.

 

[MrBonsai19]

Nice work ! Tree has lots of potential. My 2 cents would be the second trunk is not working in harmony with the primary trunk. It lacks movement and directionality that mirrors the parent and makes it a bit jarring. You can definitely work to keep it and grow it into a shape that works better for the overall look, but I would much rather see the little shoot on the inside of the first curve wired upward to become a second trunk that mirrors the movement and directionality of the parent trunk and grows in a manner that is much more consistent with a subordinate trunk line.

 

[Haidr]

Nice work ! Tree has lots of potential. My 2 cents would be the second trunk is not working in harmony with the primary trunk. It lacks movement and directionality that mirrors the parent and makes it a bit jarring. You can definitely work to keep it and grow it into a shape that works better for the overall look, but I would much rather see the little shoot on the inside of the first curve wired upward to become a second trunk that mirrors the movement and directionality of the parent trunk and grows in a manner that is much more consistent with a subordinate trunk line.

View attachment 605748

I will keep all these suggestions in mind and hopefully will help the tree grow into something more interesting. Agree on the second trunk, I even considered removing it all together but the only concern is that it is going to leave a nasty scar right at the bottom of the main trunk. If there is any method of minimising the scar I would happily take it off. I think the tree would look better without that straight branch sticking out.