Shohin azalea… hard cutback update

RaginCajun

Mame
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West Monroe, Louisiana
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8b
Just wanted to drop an update on this azalea I shared a few weeks back. I hard pruned the whole thing, it has bounced back well and produced lots of back budding. I’m taking the John geangel approach, sacrificing flowers for a couple yrs to build the tree faster. I should be able to prune it again in late may or early June. And then a little thinning again in the fall. Im feeding it with Dr earths acid lovers in baskets. And it gets hit with a maintenance dose of fish emulsion every time I water. It’s in kanuma soil with yamagoke on top. That’s a #6 or #7 tokoname pot. Can’t wait to get it into a pot.
I’m open to suggestions or advice, it’s much appreciated. Thank you.
 

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Gotta love an azalea with a Chunky trunk!

While I love @johng ’s approach and have for years, this trunk calls out to me for something a bit more esoteric. Long arm? Standard short display azalea…with discrete branching… whatever. Your tree, your choice

A couple technical items that might help..

A. Fertilizer. Azaleas do not like a lot of fertilizer. Too much and the roots can get damaged and the media gets clogged up, upsetting the balance of H2O and O2. For example.

So perhaps a regular dose of fish emulsion every 3 weeks in spring and 4 weeks in summer - fall… with maybe 1/8 dose of Osmocote Plus early spring and Sep.
Or One run of Dr Earth as was described in spring and one in fall.
Or just a single dose of Osmocote plus in Spring followed up by 1/4 dose in early fall ((Sep) in your area.

B. When installing Yamagoke moss, the soaked moss (for about 0.5 hour) gets tucked in wads into the media to yield about 1/4” thick complete cover.

See image below. Moss installed to look like the plant on the right to yield coverage as per the plant on the-left.

image.jpg

Love to see how this tree progresses!

cheers
DSD sends
 
Just wanted to drop an update on this azalea I shared a few weeks back. I hard pruned the whole thing, it has bounced back well and produced lots of back budding. I’m taking the John geangel approach, sacrificing flowers for a couple yrs to build the tree faster. I should be able to prune it again in late may or early June. And then a little thinning again in the fall. Im feeding it with Dr earths acid lovers in baskets. And it gets hit with a maintenance dose of fish emulsion every time I water. It’s in kanuma soil with yamagoke on top. That’s a #6 or #7 tokoname pot. Can’t wait to get it into a pot.
I’m open to suggestions or advice, it’s much appreciated. Thank you.
Your azalea looks very healthy, and hard pruning in early spring will help you direct new growths where you want them to be. I wrote a blog on a one-year progression of hard pruning a shohin Chinzan. I hope this would help.

 
Your azalea looks very healthy, and hard pruning in early spring will help you direct new growths where you want them to be. I wrote a blog on a one-year progression of hard pruning a shohin Chinzan. I hope this would help.

Thank you! Your blog was very helpful, as this is an imported azalea. My mentor bought it at a shohin club show in Dallas and brought it to me.
It grew vigorous last yr, as well. It was a big globose bush before I hedged it. I appreciate you.
 
Gotta love an azalea with a Chunky trunk!

While I love @johng ’s approach and have for years, this trunk calls out to me for something a bit more esoteric. Long arm? Standard short display azalea…with discrete branching… whatever. Your tree, your choice

A couple technical items that might help..

A. Fertilizer. Azaleas do not like a lot of fertilizer. Too much and the roots can get damaged and the media gets clogged up, upsetting the balance of H2O and O2. For example.

So perhaps a regular dose of fish emulsion every 3 weeks in spring and 4 weeks in summer - fall… with maybe 1/8 dose of Osmocote Plus early spring and Sep.
Or One run of Dr Earth as was described in spring and one in fall.
Or just a single dose of Osmocote plus in Spring followed up by 1/4 dose in early fall ((Sep) in your area.

B. When installing Yamagoke moss, the soaked moss (for about 0.5 hour) gets tucked in wads into the media to yield about 1/4” thick complete cover.

See image below. Moss installed to look like the plant on the right to yield coverage as per the plant on the-left.

View attachment 539794

Love to see how this tree progresses!

cheers
DSD sends
Thank you.
I’m not exactly sure what you mean about the design of the tree, forgive me. Are you suggesting that I cut the branches back shorter and keep the whole design hedged so that the branches are really tight and can’t be made out as well? I think I know what you mean but I’m struggling to explain atm lol.
I have read in Rick Garcia’s book that too much fertilizer will cause dead zones in the root ball which will manifest into root rot or a very weak tree. Azalea roots will not grow where the soil is really rich with fertilizer or where there are dead roots.
I usually keep organic solid in baskets or teabags on all of my trees and also feed a maintenance dose of fish emulsion for all my trees at 1/4 strength. This particular tree has been getting watered every 3-4 days. Others needing water every day or every other. Stuff in cement tubs or big training pots aren’t getting watered at all right now, it rains frequent enough to maintain a healthy o2/h2o ratio in the soil this time of yr. I’ll throw in some humic acid once every other week or 3 also. You think that’s too much?
As for the moss, it may not appear like it but it’s actually pretty dense. I’d say 1/2” at least for sure. I performed soji on it earlier in the spring, replaced about an 1” of kanuma and the whole layer of spent yamagoke that came with the tree. Is that okay or not?
I appreciate you a bunch. You’ve been very active and typically respond to everything I post, I am grateful for your time and honesty.
 
Your azalea looks very healthy, and hard pruning in early spring will help you direct new growths where you want them to be. I wrote a blog on a one-year progression of hard pruning a shohin Chinzan. I hope this would help.

Do you still have that little Chinzan from the blog post? I’d love to see how it’s come along and especially in flower.
 
Do you still have that little Chinzan from the blog post? I’d love to see how it’s come along and especially in flower.
Yes, I do. Will have to take a photo tomorrow. In the 2019 Bonsai on the Bayou convention, I used it in a 7-point shohin display. It is the left most shohin in a blue pot.
 

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Thank you! Your blog was very helpful, as this is an imported azalea. My mentor bought it at a shohin club show in Dallas and brought it to me.
It grew vigorous last yr, as well. It was a big globose bush before I hedged it. I appreciate you.
He probably got it last June at the Lone Star Bonsai Federation ‘Tiny Trees on the Trinity’ convention in Fort Worth. The vendor, David Kreutz, specializes in imported satsuki azalea.
 
He probably got it last June at the Lone Star Bonsai Federation ‘Tiny Trees on the Trinity’ convention in Fort Worth. The vendor, David Kreutz, specializes in imported satsuki azalea.
That sounds about right. She’s retired now and is blessed to be able to travel all over doing bonsai and other art stuff. She has won best Texas native at one of the bigger Texas shows multiple times.
Will you be at the convention in Houston this year?
 
That sounds about right. She’s retired now and is blessed to be able to travel all over doing bonsai and other art stuff. She has won best Texas native at one of the bigger Texas shows multiple times.
Will you be at the convention in Houston this year?
Could she be Dawn Koeting? I will be at the Houston convention. If you are coming, we can look each other up.
 
Could she be Dawn Koeting? I will be at the Houston convention. If you are coming, we can look each other up.
Yes sir, Mrs. Dawn is my very good friend and bonsai mentor. She is such a joy and loves to share bonsai info!
I got to hang with her a couple weekends ago at “C’est Bonsai”. You should have seen the tree she entered into the “C’est Bonsai” event at Underhill bonsai in Folsom,Louisiana.
 
Yes sir, Mrs. Dawn is my very good friend and bonsai mentor. She is such a joy and loves to share bonsai info!
I got to hang with her a couple weekends ago at “C’est Bonsai”. You should have seen the tree she entered into the “C’est Bonsai” event at Underhill bonsai in Folsom,Louisiana.
Dawn is a good friend. We visited her last fall when my wife and I did presentations and workshops on azaleas and kusamono, respectively, at The NOLA Bonsai Society.

What color is the flower? The leaves are lanceolate, and David had Hakurin and Chinzan, both with that leaf shape if I remember correctly.
 
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Do you still have that little Chinzan from the blog post? I’d love to see how it’s come along and especially in flower.
Just took photo of this Chinzan this morning. I had it back into the deeper terracotta pot after the show as our weather is very hot, 90-100+F in the summer. Not good to keep it in show pot. Just a couple of flowers now. Several other azaleas on the bench are flowering with various colors.
 

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For azalea, I use miracid granular fertilizer in those little plastic baskets they sell. It's slow release and formulated for acid loving plants. My azaleas seem to appreciate it.
 
Dawn is a good friend. We visited her last fall when my wife and I did presentations and workshops on azaleas and kusamono, respectively, at The NOLA Bonsai Society.

What color is the flower? The leaves are lanceolate, and David had Hakurin and Chinzan, both with that leaf shape if I remember correctly.
The flowers are rather small and are pink. Mrs. Dawn sent me a few names of different specimens as she was sending me the photos so I could choose one. I believe this one she said is Hakurin but not really sure. Leaves are small too.
Our summers are similar here, last summer was brutal. I just put my shade structure up today, actually taking a break right now lol.
I hope we get to meet up at the convention in a couple weeks. My name is Trent, btw. Trent Cardin. It’s a pleasure talking with ya and thanks for your time and willingness to share.
 
For azalea, I use miracid granular fertilizer in those little plastic baskets they sell. It's slow release and formulated for acid loving plants. My azaleas seem to appreciate it.
Thank you. I’ve heard a lot of people love miracid. I typically use all organic fertilizer for all my plants.
 
Thank you. I’ve heard a lot of people love miracid. I typically use all organic fertilizer for all my plants.
I use organic for everything else except the tropicals when they are inside for the winter because it is stinky
 
I use organic for everything else except the tropicals when they are inside for the winter because it is stinky
Yeah definitely don’t use organic fertilizers when plants are inside ha!
I’m fortunate to have the perfect sun room with 3 4’ fluorescent lights and the whole exterior wall is windows. Facing southeast. They don’t skip a beat.
 
Thank you.
I’m not exactly sure what you mean about the design of the tree, forgive me.
Sorry for the delay, we both had to get ready for a study group….

Guess what I was trying to convey was… at least in my mind , this azalea trunk reaches out to me asking for a design if not better, bigger…or perhaps more formal design than the basic johng pattern. (Not implying his pattern isn’t great.😉)

Here’s an example of a design of one of the trees was thinking about. It’s working towards a long arm azalea, as suggested before, long arm on left. Hino Maru

IMG_1192.jpeg

Glad @Chuah dropped in, as he has a really good design for his chinzan and another possible approach for the tree… His clip and grow skills are awesome btw.
Are you suggesting that I cut the branches back shorter and keep the whole design hedged so that the branches are really tight and can’t be made out as well? I think I know what you mean but I’m struggling to explain atm lol.
Not sure ever mentioned cutting back hard, but @Chuah demonstrated an awesome example of this process…..
I have read in Rick Garcia’s book that too much fertilizer will cause dead zones in the root ball which will manifest into root rot or a very weak tree. Azalea roots will not grow where the soil is really rich with fertilizer or where there are dead roots.
This is true. Given one does not apply properly or care for their tree properly, this can indeed happen.

There are well over 200 satsuki and other azalea we work on. 90+ cultivars. None seem to be affected by dead roots or fertilizer pockets….

Both quantity and quality of the nutrients (and delivery time) are most important then organic or inorganic..

Personally don’t care what fertilizer anyone else uses, organic or chemically derived, as long as the azalea gets an acidic based fertilizer with needed micronutrients at low doses. Do it your own way. (But please keep an open mind to the ideas of other experienced practitioners .)

But there is a downside to each

We see lots of azaleas not doing well due to gunked up media. Biogild and Holly Tone types tend to be the worst. Constant application of fish fertilizer will also gunk up the media. Rather do soji only when it’s absolutely needed. (Also don’t like lugging watering cans around at frequent intervals.)

We recycle all our media, APL and Kanuma/Pumice. If you do so, you’ll know right off which batch came from organic fertilizer users and/or tree s that have not been repotted for a long time.

Chemical fertilizer can damage the roots of azaleas if one doesn’t recognize azaleas need less fertilizer then other trees. A couple years ago we actually counted the number of pellets wanted of Osmocote Plus for azaleas in various pot sizes to avoid this issue. This was equated to a measuring spoon to speed up application. 1/16” of TSP is our smallest pot ferts

However we only apply Osmocote Plus twice a year. After flowering and early September when the temperates recede a liquid fertilizerr supplement is used. For example weak dose of miracid, humic+kelp.
I usually keep organic solid in baskets or teabags on all of my trees and also feed a maintenance dose of fish emulsion for all my trees at 1/4 strength.
Tried them.. no time, lots of plastic and chasing tea bagscaround. . However the area of media under the applicator was always gunky afterwards .

Never understood what a maintenance dose was? Isn’t it a term used for fertilizer applications for a refined tree…?
This particular tree has been getting watered every 3-4 days. Others needing water every day or every other. Stuff in cement tubs or big training pots aren’t getting watered at all right now, it rains frequent enough to maintain a healthy o2/h2o ratio in the soil this time of yr. I’ll throw in some humic acid once every other week or 3 also. You think that’s too much?
Watering is an individual thing, varying by location, media used, size and style of pot, time of year and tree type. So can’t comment on this. But sounds like you have a handle on watering.

Fertilization is an intentional process. Each tree has its own profile. If you think that’s appropriate based upon experience with azaleas, that’s ok. The impression was the tree wasn’t getting enough micronutrients.
As for the moss, it may not appear like it but it’s actually pretty dense. I’d say 1/2” at least for sure. I performed soji on it earlier in the spring, replaced about an 1” of kanuma and the whole layer of spent yamagoke that came with the tree. Is that okay or not?
Only need to do this process if the soil is properly absorbing water. Soji is only done to enhance percolation. Out here we don’t do it, as percolation is good for three years if Yamagoke moss is used.

Moss replacement is only done for percolation or aesthetic reasons. If one does replace or remove Yamagoke, it’s possible to wash and dry the removed moss, rehydrate and use again…. And save some bucks side a new tree 😎

I appreciate you a bunch. You’ve been very active and typically respond to everything I post, I am grateful for your time and honesty.

Thanks

Cheers
DSD sends
 
The flowers are rather small and are pink. Mrs. Dawn sent me a few names of different specimens as she was sending me the photos so I could choose one. I believe this one she said is Hakurin but not really sure. Leaves are small too.
Our summers are similar here, last summer was brutal. I just put my shade structure up today, actually taking a break right now lol.
I hope we get to meet up at the convention in a couple weeks. My name is Trent, btw. Trent Cardin. It’s a pleasure talking with ya and thanks for your time and willingness to share.
Hakurin is predominantly white with some pink flowers. Chinzan has all pink flowers. Will get together with you Trent.
 
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