Scots Pine new needles' issue - what could it be

[LeoMame]

Hello Bonsai people,

a quick question about scots pine needles discoloration. I'm having some (I'd say roughly 10%) new needles -from this year- which shows this discoloration. From the top and a peculiar 'twist' (see photo). I can't rule out anything, but the tree is well fert and watered, I check it twice a day.

The tree receives full sun for 3 hrs a day, and since it sits in a very shallow nanban type of pot needs water once per day (of course depending on wind and such). The substrate drains perfectly.

Another Japanese Red Pine shows similar symptoms on some of the new foliage. Wind, heat, underwater, overwater?

Ah also, all trees have been treated with fungicide/pesticide on a good schedule, according to this season.

Thank you for all the kind help and suggestions!

Leo

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Over fertilization can cause needles to twist and the ends to burn from salt stress.

It would help if you post a picture of the entire plant.

 

[Potawatomi13]

! Some here "over" fertilize and have great results health/growth wise. Define over fertilizing not including just dumping it on trees. For one pro Ryan Neil recommends heavy fertilizing of developing trees. Think that is not cause of this. Perhaps tree gets too little Sun or when Sun shines roots get too hot in tiny pot? Agree pics of whole tree, location where tree sits also might help.

 

[Paradox]

Yea I agree we need pictures of the whole tree and closeup of the areas of the tree effected. Picture of just a couple of needles is kind of hard to judge what is going on.

 

[LeoMame]

Of course, here are the photos of the whole tree and the discolored needles. It needs some refinement and foliage balance (on my agenda already!)

As you can see the general colour is ok imo, and fertilizing should not be the issue, as it is on just Biogold, 3 teabags of it, plus microelements every 15 days.

Thank you again for your support!

 

[clem]

I don't see any brown spots or bands, so it doesn't seem something of fungal origin.
It doesn't seem to be very serious for the moment, as there are very few brown needles

 

[Paradox]

I agree it isn't a huge concern but I do think it is something you do want to get a handle on.

I will say you're a braver person than I.
I don't think I'd feel comfortable to have that tree in such a minimalistic pot and soil.

 

[LeoMame]

I was in the garden this morning, and while checking the trees I realised there might be a bit of a whiteflies issue: by tapping the pads of this tree and some others I can see some hemipteras -most likely whiteflies- flying around. Not clouds of them, but some. And after tapping, they were landing back on the trees.

Do you think this needle damage can be consistent with a whitefly situation? I will of course spray my trees and set up sticky traps here and there, let's see if this stops the needles' problem.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Mama Mia! In such tiny "pot" surprised tree has any green needles. Otherwise see very good eye for style and have very similar Lodgepole Pine Literati in development. Perhaps an aside but strongly suggest somewhat larger/deeper pot so not all soil heaped above pot

 

[We're all Mad Here...🎩]

Speaking of Scots pine...bought this half off today, but it seems more mugo...any opinions?

 

[Paradox]

Bark looks like a scots to me

 

[We're all Mad Here...🎩]

Bark looks like a scots to me

Well that's refreshing, thanks. Seems like a decent $50 tree. I like the look of your tall slender tree, but this may have a different future...

 

[LeoMame]

Today I slip potted mine into a deeper and larger plastic bowl, luckily I knew the original soil composition so I could recreate it exactly. Lots of nice, fine roots which I just gently accommodated into the new container. You can see I didn't fill the bowl all up to the edge, I still added a significant quantity of soil but as this is a tree with a minimalistic, bunjinesque style in refinement stage, I wanted to keep the growth under control (but still protecting the root mass).

The proportions feels much better, so now I also have an idea on which pot to purchase next spring. Also changed the angle towards left, loving how it occupies the space now; will do the refinement this fall according to the new angle.

 

[LeoMame]

Hello again B'nutters, i'm back here because the yellowing is progressing and now it's a bit worrying since the tree is shedding last year's needles (while the new ones are displaying this issue here). Here's some photos:



also, I had something similar on one of my JRP:






I know it's almost impossible to diagnose anything through some pictures but of course I'm very eager to know what you think.

Thank you as usual

 

[Potawatomi13]

Grasping straws. Any abnormal HOT weather recently.

 

[LeoMame]

Grasping straws. Any abnormal HOT weather recently.

Very hot but not recently... Here in Italy we had several heatwaves in July and maybe one at the beginning of August, but the tree was always well watered (2 times a day at least). The needles started to get discolored in September, do you think that no matter the watering care it could have been just too hot for it?

All in all this is a mountain pine, and we experienced 40+ degrees at times. Possibly too much even if the soil never really get dry..?

 

[JeffS73]

I feel for your situation. The JRP looks fungal to me. Personally I'd treat as dothistroma, I.e. remove worst needles, cut in half needles with similar tips, i.e the yellowing/ brown spot needles. Thin it out a bit and ideally place somewhere out of rainfall with good airflow. Only water soil. None of this will cause a problem if it isn't fungal.

The Scots, remove fertiliser and water thoroughly to flush out fert. I originally thought dehydration due to hot summer, but could be dehydration from too much fert in such a small volume of substrate. Pines can have a long lag time in their response, so it may well get worse before better. Don't over water. Good luck, it's a lovely tree.