[Podocarpus yamma] Seeking advice on **how hard** this specie can be 'pushed', thanks to any experienced Podo growers!!

[SU2]

I collected a Podocarpus (finally!) some time back, acclimated it, let it grow a while, then cut-back to its final trunk-line and just let it grow again.

It's now/still doing excellent, always looks healthy & is growing with vigor. I intend to begin SOME interventions, but - from roots-to-shoots-to-wiring - I am simply not aware how hardy this specie is in those specific respects so am here hoping anyone w/ experience with them can provide insight into how well, relative to "normal vigorous broadleafs", how well Podocarpus:
#1 - can handle heavy-bending of branches like guy-wiring already hardened wood into new positions;
#2 - can handle heavy root-reductions;
#3 - how well it can handle a "hyper-growth" setup (full FL sunlight + high nitro "Walter Pall style" feeding&watering, this is - of course - in an excellent substrate from porosity to pH to CEC!!
#4 - defoliation/leaf-prunes: Is this something that can be utilized during Development of the specimen, or only comes into play once it's in Refinement stage?

I'm not planning/wanting to do root-reductions (#2) right now but just curious because it dictates how-large of a rootmass I'm going to allow it "during Development", as I always want more roots but realize I need to be able to hard-prune them once Development is over and a tree moves into Refinement (actually to that end, I'll be slip-potting / up-potting this Podo into a root-maker container instead of its current 5gal regular nursery-container )

Thanks a TON for any&all advice, figure a picture would be proper to attach even if just for fun, you'll note that I didn't actually "cut-back to final trunkline" but instead "removed cambium from such spots, upwards" which leaves me with those bare stumps (obviously not styled/used yet, just 'blank canvas' jins, I simply used a rasp-disc on my grinder to remove vascular tissue / leave wood, instead of simply cutting-back!), being coniferous - IE having non-porous wood - should mean I can do deadwood on this specie!




(PS-- can anyone tell me if this is 'regular', or 'dwarf', cultivar of Podo? So stoked to have my 1st (large-ish) Podo yamma, *finally* after several years of hunting!!!)

 

[SU2]

For answers/replies Re 'What can they tolerate well?', any&all comparisons to other specie would be greatly appreciated!! Esp if they're tropicals like ficus, red maple, BC's, bougies crape myrtles etc!

 

[luvinthemountains]

I am excited to see how this progresses for you. I have a similar specimen that I bought from Wigert's. I wonder if they also collected it from the landscape, because it looks very similar to yours!

Regarding your questions:
#1 - can handle heavy-bending of branches like guy-wiring already hardened wood into new positions; Have not tried this but I have found horizontal (perpendicular to trunk) branches weak and they seem to die off before upward-growing shoots under unideal conditions like the dry oven we had here in July. It killed all the horizontal branching.
#2 - can handle heavy root-reductions; I haven't had the guts to do this yet, but as I understand they are sensitive to root reduction and require heavy watering afterward.
#3 - how well it can handle a "hyper-growth" setup (full FL sunlight + high nitro "Walter Pall style" feeding&watering, this is - of course - in an excellent substrate from porosity to pH to CEC!! Not sure, but mine has been in intense, high-UV sunlight all summer and has done great. I was fertilizing heavily with chemical fert until most of my trees started getting leaf scorch, but not the podocarpus. And that was in high-CEC soil, so in inorganic soil I don't think it would be a problem as long as you can water it sufficiently.
#4 - defoliation/leaf-prunes: Is this something that can be utilized during Development of the specimen, or only comes into play once it's in Refinement stage? My specimen mentioned above was fully defoliated (partially by me - the rest of the way by goats ) in early spring, and looked dead for several weeks before sprouting new growth. Two trunks never came back. That response might have been due to the time of year. I may defoliate in the future, but only when the tree is actively growing.

 

[SU2]

Have not tried this but I have found horizontal (perpendicular to trunk) branches weak and they seem to die off before upward-growing shoots under unideal conditions like the dry oven we had here in July. It killed all the horizontal branching.

Would LOVE to hear elaboration on this! For context Re "horizontal V upward-growing", are you referring to just the way that side-branches are oriented, or are you comparing side branches (as a whole) to the top "leader-primary"? Also....and am just wanting to be sure we don't miss anything here...but lower branches just generally grow with less vigor, so am hoping you consider this (IE if you have a 3' long top-leader primary, and just several smaller side-primaries that you keep pinching to push-growth in the top-leader, it wouldn't be too surprising to hear the lower branches being that weak)

But yeah I'm eager to hear *any&every*thing you can tell me Re die-back on Podo's, am in love w/ the specie and after half a decade finally got my first yamma so am crazy eager to see it thrive, so far it seems closer to a BC, than to a Juniper, when it comes to dieback, and when it comes to showing stress (that's the problem w/ Junipers IMO is the delay from stressor to reaction is so delayed that my "play with it" style of bonsai doesn't mesh well ) But yeah so far it does seem pretty quick to show stress on new/juvenile foliage, but not on older foliage!

Sorry to hear you lost the horizontal branching, that sounds....extreme! Would be curious to hear if you attribute it solely to unusually-warm (and dry) weather, or if you weren't dealing/handling that period properly (because my understanding is it should love that kinda condition in a 7a zone, provided it's irrigated of course!)

I haven't had the guts to do this yet, but as I understand they are sensitive to root reduction and require heavy watering afterward.

Well crap....that's always annoying (root sensitivity) but thankfully I've found that, so long as you Develop your specimen using root-maker type containers, that you can get away with FAR more (which makes sense, since such pots produce wayyyy more homogeneous rootplates, dense with feeders/fine roots, compared to 'regular container roots' wherein the feeders favor the tips/ends of the roots!)
Re heavy watering that's always been an odd one to me....I think it may be better phrased as "at that time, they become very sensitive to drying out, so ensure your irrigation is on-point", I mean surely it's not that the tree wants a different h20//02 ratio, or that it's processing more water with less roots, or that you're needing to flush fertilizer salts at such a time!

Not sure, but mine has been in intense, high-UV sunlight all summer and has done great. I was fertilizing heavily with chemical fert until most of my trees started getting leaf scorch, but not the podocarpus. And that was in high-CEC soil, so in inorganic soil I don't think it would be a problem as long as you can water it sufficiently.

I use quite high CEC mixes, but very large particles & well draining (ie properly rinsed!) and can push growth in most species faster than I've seen documented elsewhere, so am beyond stoked to read this If it likes full sun & high nitro, it's likely to be a heavy grower....going to up its nitro this afternoon (how much nitro were you giving when you got leaf scorch? Do you suspect it was simply too much salt (ie causing the roots difficulty up-taking water from soil, even pulling water from the roots), or that the nitro-induced growth was too-quick, too-soft, and got ravaged by the sun? (soft, wimpy growth is a hallmark of quick-growth, but it's especially susceptible to pests & sun scroching!)

My specimen mentioned above was fully defoliated (partially by me - the rest of the way by goats ) in early spring, and looked dead for several weeks before sprouting new growth. Two trunks never came back. That response might have been due to the time of year. I may defoliate in the future, but only when the tree is actively growing.

Heh goats, so that was your post I read in another thread (as I know Podo foliage isn't super desirable to mammals)
Will bet dollars-to-donuts that the response, while certainly influenced by time-of-year, was primarily influenced by the tree's vigor prior to the insult (ie, good on you, your Podo was healthy-enough or rather 'had enough reserved photosynthates' to handle that.
But, Re defoliation-in-general with Podo's.....may I ask why?? If you haven't touched the roots then I know it's not a finished-specimen yet, so why do any "real" defoliating?? You're just removing tissue / solar-panels in doing this...it stunts the tree (and gives us smaller leaves as-result of the stunting) which is utilized for showing finished specimen but, short of that, my understanding was it's almost never a proper practice (IE there's exceptions, like defoilating part of a primary that's shading-out a lower, weaker primary, but defoliating to defoliate is a treatment that weakens the tree and is undertaken explicitly to reduce/stunt the next flush of leaves, for purposes of showing-off a finished bonsai IE exaggerating the scale by shrinking the leaves)

Very curious for both your thoughts, & experience, in regards to defoliation and to removal of "growing tips" on Podo's, their ability to back-bud is amazing I may've mentioned already but I know a very vigorous Podocarpus (in-ground) that hasn't gotten any pruning yet it still pops buds on its main trunk, through inch-thick bark

(any pics of yours you could post a URL of? Am totally in love w/ these Buddhist Pines, was quite surprised to learn they were conifers

 

[luvinthemountains]

lower branches just generally grow with less vigor, so am hoping you consider this

The lower branches were the ones below horizontal, the upper ones were at acute angles, so I assumed. But yes, you are right - apical dominance may have played a role!

Sorry to hear you lost the horizontal branching, that sounds....extreme! Would be curious to hear if you attribute it solely to unusually-warm (and dry) weather, or if you weren't dealing/handling that period properly (because my understanding is it should love that kinda condition in a 7a zone, provided it's irrigated of course!)

We did get very hot and dry weather in early summer, but the die-back started before that and I think the heat just finished it off. Together with improper fertilization!

I think it may be better phrased as "at that time, they become very sensitive to drying out, so ensure your irrigation is on-point", I mean surely it's not that the tree wants a different h20//02 ratio, or that it's processing more water with less roots, or that you're needing to flush fertilizer salts at such a time!

Sure - that's fair. I can't find it now but I read a gardening blog post where the author reported having trouble with transplant shock with podocarpus in the landscape, until they started flooding the roots regularly while getting re-established.

how much nitro were you giving when you got leaf scorch? Do you suspect it was simply too much salt (ie causing the roots difficulty up-taking water from soil, even pulling water from the roots), or that the nitro-induced growth was too-quick, too-soft, and got ravaged by the sun?

Actually, the fast-growing shoots up top that I am getting now with recovery and better care have seemed to be invincible to intense sun. No, I believe the leaf scorch was definitely due to salt-induced drought conditions in the roots. I was using an MSU formula, K-lite fertilizer - 12-1-4, I think.

Re defoliation-in-general with Podo's.....may I ask why?? If you haven't touched the roots then I know it's not a finished-specimen yet, so why do any "real" defoliating?? You're just removing tissue / solar-panels in doing this...it stunts the tree (and gives us smaller leaves as-result of the stunting) which is utilized for showing finished specimen but, short of that, my understanding was it's almost never a proper practice (IE there's exceptions, like defoilating part of a primary that's shading-out a lower, weaker primary, but defoliating to defoliate is a treatment that weakens the tree and is undertaken explicitly to reduce/stunt the next flush of leaves, for purposes of showing-off a finished bonsai IE exaggerating the scale by shrinking the leaves)

I would only call what the goat did "defoliation." Actually, all I did was heavily reduce the canopy. As you can see in my thread, it was quite the bush when I got it, so I wanted to open it up for light and air to pass through and to stimulate back-budding. That being said, I have been studying up on the effects of defoliation on manipulating the growth of developing specimens as well. When properly timed, it can result in a hormonal response that triggers back-budding and/or extension, thereby accelerating wood formation. So I am using it more and more even on developing specimens.