So the holiday presents came in and I am the proud owner a beautiful new Chinese elm from Brussel's Bonsai (it really is nice). I placed it in the mulch pile and mulched over the top and then realized the tree came in from Mississippi to New York in January and probably didn't have much of a chance to acclimate to more of a winter. I leave my other Chinese elms out all year round, but wonder if this one should be brought in and placed in the grow tent before we get a real freeze. (Also, would the answer be different for a trident that is dormant coming from the same place?).
New Chinese Elm - Inside or Outside?
- Thread starter dbonsaiw
- Start date
penumbra
Imperial Masterpiece
I feel you have done the best you can do. Good luck.
Michael P
Omono
Ask Brussel's what conditions these trees were kept in before they were shipped to you. If they had already been in freezing weather, they are probably OK with the pots mulched. But if they were kept in a greenhouse and protected from cold weather, maybe not. Ask for their recommendation.
Paradox
Marine Bonsologist
I just got a Chinese elm from them as well
If yours is like mine, it's all leafed out which means it's not ready for dormancy.
I put mine in my garage where its ~50 to 60 degrees most if the time I think putting it outside this year is dangerous for the tree because being from Mississippi where it is much warmer, it's not ready for our winter.
Next fall it will be able to prepare for dormancy and it will go in my cold frame with the rest of my hardy trees.
I would be slightly less wary of the trident if in fact it is dormant but there is a considerable difference in temperature between here and Mississippi
Currently it's 57 in Olive Branch Mississippi where Brussel's is. It's 37 here.
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penumbra
Imperial Masterpiece
I have mentioned this before for what its worth. The only Chinese elm I ever killed was an attempt to winter one inside, so if that is what you are going to attempt, proceed with caution. I have 8 of them now in an unheated coldframe that I bought in the early winter. (December)
rockm
Spuds Moyogi
Your elm and trident likely came from greenhouses at Brussels. I would be careful about putting them out in freezing weather this winter. If they were mine, I'd find somewhere that stays above freezing and keep them there until spring. Next winter, outdoors.
The responses are appreciated. Seems I am in a bit of a pickle. I'm just going with it and will leave em out. Trident seems to be dormant. Elm is indeed in leaf. I gave it some extra mulch and will try frost cloth. I can move it to an unheated garage, but the door is always open (teenage kids) and its not much warmer in there with all the holes in the walls. I can also move it to a sunken window nook where it should get some heat from the house and also some sun.
leatherback
The Treedeemer
If you have it outside already, the damage is done. I would keep it in the garage.
I spoke to Brussel's. First, some words of praise - the customer service is excellent. I was also very impressed with the trees I received. It is far better material than most of the stuff I bought. I should have hit them up earlier and not wasted money on junk.
That said, the advice was keep the trees above 20 degrees and I should be fine. I don't see sub-20 temps here anytime soon. Will purchase some frost cloth and hope for the best. Can always move it if temps drop. I added some extra mulch as well.
That said, the advice was keep the trees above 20 degrees and I should be fine. I don't see sub-20 temps here anytime soon. Will purchase some frost cloth and hope for the best. Can always move it if temps drop. I added some extra mulch as well.
JackHammer
Chumono
I am hot and cold on Brussels. I really want to like them but I have 2 of their extra large trees, one Chinese elm, the other a ficus and they both have deep wire bite in the trunk. It is a little unfortunate, especially because they were some of the more expensive trees. :/
Of the many difficulties I have encountered in bonsai, finding good starting material is up there and has remained somewhat elusive. Granted, I am not spending thousands on a tree (money aside, I'm not sure I can care for it and not even sure what I'm looking for at that price), but I haven't exactly been shy about the spending either. I have otherwise tried all manner of starting material. And have come to some odd conclusions based on my particular experiences and NY prices.
I enjoy going to my local bonsai shop, but it's really a glorified nursery. I know nothing about bonsai and manage to teach these guys something every time I go because I think they are somewhat clueless (the ability to airlayer a deshojo, for example, shouldnt be a surprise to someone in this field for so long). There is a great selection of really young trees, but no bonsai work has been done to them. It's a stick in the dirt that they charge no less than $60 for. Their soil is miserable and they insist on repotting the trees into bonsai pots and packing in the organic soil. I do not even let them take it out of the nursery container and they give me a few bucks off for saving the pot. A trunk with any type of character is rare. And the specimen trees are full of really ugly grafts and really no branch work - its just a bigger version of the stick in the dirt.
Nursery stock could be great depending on price and one's ability to find something decent to work with (as well as an appetite to start anew on nebari). I had little luck in this department and NY nurseries are very expensive (like $600 for a smallish coral bark maple with awful grafts). I tend to hit the nurseries after Halloween when things are half off. Still expensive for what I'm getting and I really haven't seen anything that screams "bonsai me, please". The 2 good trees I got at nurseries I butchered - that's on me.
I'm still a big fan of the Home Depot maples. Granted, I've managed to butcher these as well, but I have not given up hope. I believe I can make something decent out of one of these. And at $15/tree I will sure as hell keep trying. From my experience, the difference between a $15 HD maple and a $1,700 JM from Brussel's, for example, is just not worth it. I believe I can get the $15 HD maple into a decent pre-bonsai in a few years and save myself a boat load.
I have field grown trees and seedlings from a range of sellers. I've mostly been happy, but these still need a good deal of development to get them into bonsai mode. I pulled the trigger on one giant BC and that will be my prized tree for now (as soon as it makes its way to NY and not in the winter).
Which brings me to Brussel's. As for complaints, many of the trees are "S" shaped and kind of typical. But that's not really a complaint. I need to learn the wheel before I can reinvent it. I have no new bonsai style to introduce to the world just yet. I'm still getting my bearings. Frankly, extreme trunk movement makes it easier for me to imagine where branches will one day be. There are many up sides to Brussel's, IMO. At around $350, the trees have a nice trunk caliper. There's movement, of course, and even some taper. But best of all, when I removed the moss there was an actual nebari.
I feel like I actually now own some pre-bonsai (as opposed to the step before pre bonsai). The form of the trunks is done. I will need to add taper with some sacrifice branches, potentially shorten at least one of the trees, and get started on branch work. The trees are on their way (provided they survive this winter). When I first saw Brussel's prices I had sticker shock. I now view most of these as good deals. The JMs are still ridiculously expensive. I also haven't gotten into pines just yet, so I just skip over those (that may be where the wire marks are most prevalent).
