Low vigor Japanese Black Pine

[cheap_walmart_art]

Looking for some advice to turn this guy around. I picked up this JBP last fall and the club member told me at the time it was ready to wire. It looked pretty healthy at the time so I went ahead and put some movement in. Lately though, it's not a dark green I see on other pines and it definitely looks like some branches are dying. It stays in full sun but we have had a very wet spring. So far in my hobby I've had bad luck with pines and generally try to avoid them, but this one was a good deal and I gotta learn sometime. Candles are extending but I'm not sure if they look healthy or if my I experience is just making me thibk the while tree looks low energy. See pics below.

 

[Dav4]

I bet it’s staying too wet. What’s the soil like? Is it in a terra cotta pot?

 

[Brian Van Fleet]

It’s fine. Let it grow. Yes, you killed a small shoot wiring, but that’s not the end of the world.

 

[Shibui]

I think Brian is correct about that dying shoot - bending has disrupted the sap flow and that one will almost surely die. Losing a branch may change the design but just move on, reassess and use others instead.

Yellow needles is quite common. Normally for me it is lack of fertiliser and quickly changes back when I remember to apply. I see you already have fert bags on the pot. What sort and how long have they been there, when replaced, etc?
Nutrient deficiency is not always straight lack of fert. Sometimes something is stopping the tree from absorbing or using the nutrients properly so it does not matter how much you apply. Need to find the cause. Poor roots is one cause. Try to lift the rootball out of the pot to inspect the roots. Check for healthy white root tips, soggy soil, etc. If the soil falls away from the roots there is a problem - Root prune and repot. Usually results from poor conditions - too dry, too wet, not enough light, poor mix. Try to work out what and make changes. Incorrect balance of nutrients can also lead to nutrient deficiency. Some home made recipes do not contain all the necessary elements so the tree is limited, not by what is there but by what is missing. Commercial ferts are designed to supply all that is needed.
Root bound is another reason for trees unable to absorb water and nutrients. Eventually the soil gets so packed with roots that water (and soluble fert) cannot penetrate even if you water and fertilise as well as you can. If root ball is solid, repot soon.

You can see there are many, sometimes conflicting, reasons for poor tree health. Without knowing background and seeing some aspects it is much harder to pinpoint a possible problem and solution.

 

[Tbwilson33]

I was told that JPB will get lighter green in full sun and a darker green in part sun/shade

 

[cheap_walmart_art]

Thanks for the advice everyone. To answer some of the questions:
-It is in a Terra Cotta pot. I have not looked at the roots.
-The Fert bags are a 9:1 mix of cottonseed meal and kelp powder, recipe is from Bonsai Empire's intermediate online course.
-Fert bags were applied two weeks ago, that the first it's been fertilized since I acquired it back in August.

So after reading the advice I will try to get it out of the pot this weekend and take a look at the roots. If the roots look healthy I'll leave them alone and let it grow. If the soil is too soggy I'll pull back on watering and let it dry a bit.

 

[Dav4]

I had a JBP I acquired that was in a terra cotta pot, akadama based soil, that turned pretty yellow over the winter 2 years ago. The combo of the terra cotta pot and the old akadama kept the roots too wet. Re-potting into a pond basket with fresh soil turned things around pretty quickly.

 

[Shibui]

My bet is on the roots being OK and nutrient deficiency being the culprit here. No fert since August and an unknown period before that. 2 weeks is not long enough for fert to take effect, especially a slow release cottonseed recipe which can take time to break down to provide nutrients. If roots look OK I would use a liquid fert for a couple of weeks but wait to see how the roots look first.

 

[Potawatomi13]

If roots look OK I would use a liquid fert for a couple of weeks but wait to see how the roots look first.

Then get rid of junk bags and use liquid in future. Most of personal trees in terra cotta pots and doing great. Boycott plastic junk baskets.

 

[Shibui]

There is a place for many different methods. Organic fert has a place but you need to understand it is slow release. Takes time to start providing nutrients but then releases slowly as it breaks down. Liquid fert is quick acting but also quickly leached away. I use all sorts of fertilisers depending on the needs at the time.
As for pots, trees will grow in almost anything as long as you can match your care to the physical properties of the mix and container. That is one big problem for people who buy trees from here and there. Each is in a different mix and different type of pot so you need to match watering and feeding to every different pot.
I'm with you on colanders and pond baskets. Haven't seen any advantages over what I currently do. Seems to be a bit of a bonsai fad but still willing to be convinced.

 

[cheap_walmart_art]

So I finally had a chance to pop this guy out of the pot and the rootball is not overly wet, it's also pretty tight. It's covered in white cottony stuff with a musty odor though. I'm hoping it's beneficial fungi but is anyone able to tell me if that's what I'm looking at here?

 

[just.wing.it]

Looks like one of the beneficial fungi to me.....almost looks like too much, like that Great White stuff, can clog up the soil I think.

 

[cheap_walmart_art]

Looks like one of the beneficial fungi to me.....almost looks like too much, like that Great White stuff, can clog up the soil I think.

Yeah I did some research and it does look like pics I saw of mycorrhizae in container plants. The soil around it was definitely damp but not sopping wet. I also have no idea if the musty smell is just the fungus or a sign it's staying too wet. Water does soak down from the top of the soil in under just s few seconds and drains out the bottom.

 

[Dav4]

Take a closer look at the roots. I definitely see mycorrhizae but I’m wondering if I’m also seeing root mealybugs.

 

[Adair M]

Part of the problem is some needlecast. Spray with copper fungicide and Daconil on alternate weeks. I also apply Bonide Granular Systemic Fungicide to the soil this time of year.

My specific drill is: if I see needles with tiger stripes or brown tips that’s not due to my breaking them, I’ll spray. If I see no (or minimal) evidence of needlecast, I don’t spray, but I just apply the Bonide Granular. (Also sold as Clearys 3336). The Granular Systemic if used regularly can prevent the needlecast from starting. I apply it now, in spring, as candles are extending, and again after decandling. Needlecast attacks and infests new needles as they are forming. Once you see the tiger stripes, it’s too late. The idea behind the spraying is to prevent new spores from the existing infestation from spreading.

You might also want to start giving your tree a weekly dose of fish emulsion.

 

[cheap_walmart_art]

Ok, I took it out of the pot again and examined it closely - did not see signs of root mealybugs based on some videos describing them. I even went over it with a hand lense and just see what looks like basic mycelium to me.

I gave it a spray down with copper fungicide this morning and will pick up and apply some granules that @Adair M suggested and just leave it be and see how it goes the next few weeks. Thanks for the help, folks.

 

[Dav4]

Ok, I took it out of the pot again and examined it closely - did not see signs of root mealybugs based on some videos describing them. I even went over it with a hand lense and just see what looks like basic mycelium to me.

I gave it a spray down with copper fungicide this morning and will pick up and apply some granules that @Adair M suggested and just leave it be and see how it goes the next few weeks. Thanks for the help, folks.

Cool. I've never seen root mealy bugs in person but do know they can cause yellowing of foliage in the spring. Good luck with the tree.

 

[cheap_walmart_art]

Bonide Granular Systemic Fungicide to the soil this time of year.

I was able to pick up some Bonide granular fungicide - looks like the active ingredient is Thiophanate-Methyl at 2.08% The bag only has instructions for mass use like for lawns or acreage, though it says it works with deciduous and coniferous trees. As far as application goes, what do you usually use? I started with about half a teaspoon sprinkled evenly around the top of my soil.

 

[Adair M]

I apply about a tea

I was able to pick up some Bonide granular fungicide - looks like the active ingredient is Thiophanate-Methyl at 2.08% The bag only has instructions for mass use like for lawns or acreage, though it says it works with deciduous and coniferous trees. As far as application goes, what do you usually use? I started with about half a teaspoon sprinkled evenly around the top of my soil.

spoon on my smaller trees and a tablespoon on my larger ones.

 

[BackyardBonsai]

I apply about a tea

spoon on my smaller trees and a tablespoon on my larger ones.

Since this is systemic, will it kill the spore if it is already inside the needle? If it does then why do we need to spray externally?