ID of odd Chinese Elm?

[luvinthemountains]

I acquired this little elm from Kawa no Oka Bonsai a few months ago. It was nicely trimmed when I received it, and I did some additional thinning once it had gotten settled in. All of the extensions that have grown out since then have this odd weeping habit. The leaves also come in dark green and quite small, around 1 cm. Here it is pictured next to my other chinese elm, which just had a bunch of very vertical extensions removed:



I wonder if this is a dwarf cultivar? I have only ever grown standard parvifolia and hokkaido. Alternatively, it could just be a standard that has become pot-bound or something. Any help?

 

[Hack Yeah!]

More of a bump here than help... trunk looks a little more zelcovish??

 

[TN_Jim]

More of a bump here than help... trunk looks a little more zelcovish??

yea, is zelcovish

 

[Forsoothe!]

Not Zelkova, maybe U.p. "Frosty'...

the edges of the leaves appear to be "frosted" or whitish. Fairly indistinct except decidedly lighter than the rest of the leaf.

 

[Shibui]

Frosty was my first reaction when I saw the photo too. The white edges on the 'Frosty' I had would fade at certain times of the year then come back at other times but it never had that weeping habit shown in the photos here. This one also has distinctly crowded leaves indicating very short internodes.
A very interesting variant. If it does not have a name it probably should get one. Interested to see what growth characteristics it has. The short internodes may mean slow development but if it grows fast enough it would make good ramification.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

There is a dwarf cultivar that has leaves like frosty, but the growth pattern of a yatsubusa. I have one, but never got a cultivar name for it. It came to me from another bonsai fanatic who also didn't have a cultivar name.

[EDIT] Nevermind. I just went out and looked in my garden and it is not the same cultivar. [/EDIT]

 

[luvinthemountains]

The short internodes may mean slow development but if it grows fast enough it would make good ramification.

I believe I have now correctly identified this as Catlin elm. I was not so sure at first, but the description on Brent Walston's site clinched it for me. Smooth bark, dark green leaves, tight internodes and horizontal branching (as Brent calls it). He mentions that trunks are slow to thicken, so I think I will plan on keeping the tree at this size and work on ramification. To your point, @Shibui, while the shoots grow fairly well - what you see here grew out in a couple of months - I read that they have a tendency to only bud from one node after pruning. I am hopeful, though, that repeated pruning will ramify the canopy.

 

[Shibui]

Definitely different from what I know as Catlin elm. The ones I grow do have small leaves but no white variegation and new shoots grow long and thin with nodes further apart but maybe you are correct and I have misidentified my trees.

 

[luvinthemountains]

Definitely different from what I know as Catlin elm. The ones I grow do have small leaves but no white variegation and new shoots grow long and thin with nodes further apart but maybe you are correct and I have misidentified my trees.

A very diplomatic answer!

I hope in the future to meet owners of confirmed Catlins that I can compare to in real life. For now, I will keep it as a tentative identification. I should mention I am pretty sure the white edging on the leaves is not variegation, but rather mineral buildup from overhead watering. Our municipal water comes from deep wells with high levels of dissolved minerals. I pulled a couple of leaves off and with rubbing it seemed to come off mostly.

 

[PA_Penjing]

By accident i stumbled across this today. If I'm not mistaken your elm is a "Fuiri" cultivar

"New leaves are very pale lime green and silvery and retain this look until late spring when they turn darker green retaining their thin silvery edge. Bark is smooth gray roughening slightly with great age. Slower than the cork types to trunk up due to the lack of the cork adding to the caliper but growing about as fast as the species." that description is from evergreen gardenworks, no pictures but I have heard of this cultivar before, it seems a better fit than catlin