300 JPB and 500 JRP from seed

[Norcalkbonsai]

Got the JBP planted tonight. I did 147 in a EB Stone seedling starter mix with a little extra perlite added.

The second tray I did boom mix. Used a lot of small stuff in the mix.


I forgot to get sand. I had bought a 5 gallon bucket of lava from Lotus and it was no joke 90% super fines. So I figured I would use this as a replacement for sand.
At first I tried doing the , as Jonas described it, the “tedious” method. I poked individual holes for each seed.

It was indeed insanely tedious. No way I’m doing almost 1500 seeds like that! My back could never take it haha. So the second batch a put down a little lava, sprinkled the seeds around then covered them with more lava fines.
Then I put them in my grow room. Used @kingsville grower Christmas light tech and decided to use domes for now. I’m still drying my last harvest so humidity is low for the time being. Currently have them under roughly 400 watts of led. The cob led bar is 250 watts and the smaller bars are 75 watts a piece. I don’t have the lights to close at this time. I decided they did not need the light of the luxx 1000 de hps yet. Think that will come after cutting and rooting if outside weather is still not good enough.

 

[cmeg1]

Thanks for showing your techniques!I am continuing ti figure out how to get better success rates on these seedling cuttings.Any rooting hormones you may use?

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Thanks for showing your techniques!I am continuing ti figure out how to get better success rates on these seedling cuttings.Any rooting hormones you may use?

I’ve always used dip n grow with good success with marijuana but I did grab a small thing of some kinda gel at the grow store the other day. Going to try a few with it and see. I doubt there will be much difference as dip n grow is a staple, but maybe the gel will be better? I’ve always got the most enjoyment trying new and different things with growing, always trying to improve. I’ve read your whole thread and really enjoyed it. Here’s a little tip I’ve learned that hands down made the biggest difference to my grow... VPD. Was the single largest improvement to both vigor and yield for me. I try to keep my room at 78* and around 70% humidity. There are charts that will show you the ideal humidity for any given temp. But the hotter you get the harder it is to keep humidity. I use a ultra sonic? Humidifier I believe. Works great.

 

[cmeg1]

Yea I read something about that.Dip n gro seems way better than gel for the pines.And right when stems turn deep red like jonas sais.I tried later and they just callous big time.
I will have to look into vpd.Thanks.It is great when all knowledge and results are shared.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Yea I read something about that.Dip n gro seems way better than gel for the pines.And right when stems turn deep red like jonas sais.I tried later and they just callous big time.
I will have to look into vpd.Thanks.It is great when all knowledge and results are shared.

Vpd is vapor pressure deficit I believe. It is the temp and humidity where plants can photosynthesis best I think? I never cared to get to much into the science I just know that when I started following the chart my yields damn near doubled, plants grew at an outstanding rate. Just something to look into. I’m surprised it was not talked about in the class you took as I feel climate controls are the single most important factors. I tried a lot of different nutrient lines over the past 6 years, not much of a difference growth wise between all of them

 

[cmeg1]

Vpd is vapor pressure deficit I believe. It is the temp and humidity where plants can photosynthesis best I think? I never cared to get to much into the science I just know that when I started following the chart my yields damn near doubled, plants grew at an outstanding rate. Just something to look into. I’m surprised it was not talked about in the class you took as I feel climate controls are the single most important factors. I tried a lot of different nutrient lines over the past 6 years, not much of a difference growth wise between all of them

Cool.My room is changing.Getting an 8x4 tent.Game changer.I’ll have to adapt.Got condensation in my wall.Hope it works out.Will actually give me more room.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Went and got some sand at Home Depot and sowed about 600 red pines. These I did in the 60/40 peat perlite mix Mark suggests.


Will do the other 600 red pines in boon mix.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Cool.My room is changing.Getting an 8x4 tent.Game changer.I’ll have to adapt.Got condensation in my wall.Hope it works out.Will actually give me more room.

I used tents when I first started growing. They work but heat becomes and issue. I saw you got more of the hlg boards, that will be a considerable amount of heat in a closed tent. I would get a couple good inline fans, I like the can fan max pros for the price, and run the exhaust out of your house. If condensation build up is a issue get a good dehumidifier. I spray my whole room down with bleach every couple months to help keep spores in check. Knock on wood, I have not had any mold issues in the 5 years I’ve been growing in that room. And as I said, I now run 70-80% humidity.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

After 7 days the first few black pines are starting to pop up. Strangely they are all in the boon mix container.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Bit of a surprise tonight, found 5 red pines had broken ground. Exactly 1 week after planting. Especially surprising as these spent only 5 days in the fridge

Have roughly 30 black pines up now. The boon mix batch is continuing to pop more seeds earlier. But the red pines made me think. Both trays that are coming up early are both in the middle. Both likely receiving better heat from the Christmas lights. So I think bottom heat is more important than media choice.

Couple pics of the room. Was finally able to get past harvest cleaned out and the last of the red pines under light and on bottom heat. Super excited for this spring.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Had a tray of red pines sprout a bunch over now.
Current totals are now looking to be 70 black pine and 50 red pines. Only about 1200 more to go
Some of the black pines are starting to open

 

[cmeg1]

Had a tray of red pines sprout a bunch over now. View attachment 279133View attachment 279134
Current totals are now looking to be 70 black pine and 50 red pines. Only about 1200 more to go
Some of the black pines are starting to open View attachment 279135

Had a tray of red pines sprout a bunch over now. View attachment 279133View attachment 279134
Current totals are now looking to be 70 black pine and 50 red pines. Only about 1200 more to go
Some of the black pines are starting to open View attachment 279135

Cool! What is that mix? With the dark brown.Almost looks earthy

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Cool! What is that mix? With the dark brown.Almost looks earthy

All my fines, mostly super fine lava with a little Akadama and pumus in there. Had bought a 5 gallon bucket of lava and 2/3 of it was sand fine. Didn’t have sand at home and didn’t feel like going out that day, so I used it at first. Looks to work as good as sand

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Roughly 120 black and 130 red pines are up. I think I under watered and may have killed some. But at the same time more sprout every day. So could just be them sprouting at different rates.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

Made some cuttings tonight.
Got 36 black pine and 18 red pines done tonight. Need to get more lava and will do more tomorrow.
The 4” had huge holes on the bottom.
So I made a 1/4”+ mix and lined the bottom of each pot with it.

Filled each with standard boon mix

Then took a screwdriver and made a small well that I filled with a peat perlite mix.

Bunch of red pines. I will be doing a lot of red pines as there are already lot of people doing black.


Gently pull them out. I went by @markyscott suggestion to wait till first real set of needles start to come out. Used a razor blade to make the cut. Made sure to sterilize everything with 99% alcohol and wore gloves.
After they were cut I put them in water to keep stems moist.

I then used mostly dip n grow but did some in a rooting gel. Here’s hoping most root.

 

[Norcalkbonsai]

I have probably 600 plants planted at this point. 250 of them I just cut the tap root on. The other 350 I did cuttings. The cuttings are starting to pop some good roots. The very first batch I did some were not mature enough and died. But it was less then 10. Most are looking great and are outside now.

 

[LCD35]

I think marky scott his mix is better for root development. I used a coarser bonsai mix and it resulted in a few long roots for every seedling. Not optimal if you aren't going to make cuttings.

I've also seen good roots after cutting from 50/50 peat/perlite @kingsville grower used with his, as documented in his thread. Perhaps the important part is keeping it most for early rooting vs boons mix? Just speculating. My seeds are on the way and I intend to use either seedling mix or peat/perlite. Please keep documenting!

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I've also seen good roots after cutting from 50/50 peat/perlite @kingsville grower used with his, as documented in his thread. Perhaps the important part is keeping it most for early rooting vs boons mix? Just speculating. My seeds are on the way and I intend to use either seedling mix or peat/perlite. Please keep documenting!

All of my pines (scots, JRP, JBP, Ponderosa) send out huge taproots in coarser mixes, which I assume Boons mix is - I never looked it up. I see the same happening in the woods; if there's sand or rocks, they send down huge tap roots. In damp forest soils however, they spread evenly and all around instead of making a tap root. I think that's the secret, at least for the early stages: don't allow that tap root to form by using a mix that holds moisture well. It might just be that the tap root dies due to high soil moisture, I'm not sure about that. But I'm starting to shy away from using bonsai soils for my seedlings.