Failed airlayer

What is the recommended procedure for an airlayer that fails? 2x?

First I wrapped it with sphagnum and didn’t get roots. Worried the sphagnum was staying too wet which then caused the layer to fail, I hung a 4” pot and filled it with soil. That one also produced no new roots. (Bigbox hormone the first time and clonex the second, I think.)

I’m getting definite callus material but can’t coax a root out of it.

I’ve got bigbox hormone, clonex gel (.3%), hormodin 3 (.8%), and Dip&Grow (1%) if anyone thinks any of those is better than any other for this case.

I’m quite successful with Japanese maple airlayers and have been successful with tridents, but this one is being …complicated. The payoff seems worth it so I keep trying. I’d rather not go to the trouble of approach/thread grafting roots. Is that what it’s going to take?

Thanks for your experienced help.

What is this plant?

That is a big trunk. I would plant it outside and hill layer it. It may take awhile but you should succeed.

This is a trident maple. That portion's about 18-20" up so I don't think planting it outside and hill layering it is going to work.. I *think* this is the one I offered to Dav4 but he said he had enough projects ...after Smoke annihilated it. (Smoke was right.) The only thing worthwhile about this plant is the portion I'm trying to take off it. And the base of it MIGHT be something. I haven't looked at it in 2 years.

I got impatient and don't usually get any participation on my posts here so with the advice of my teacher (and reading the pertinent section of Meriggioli's BONSAI MAPLES, I'm trying again. Its mostly insanity because I feel like the large parts of what I'm doing, I've already done ...and I know what the results of those attempts were.

I had some kelp/humic sitting in a mason jar next to where I was working, so I used that to moisten the sphagnum I tore into smaller pieces. I didn't bother processing it thru a sifter, but found this gave reasonable returns. After getting it thoroughly wet, I squeezed as much out of it as I could. I cut off a small branch that I'd used to secure the pot last time and widened the debarked section of trunk. (Mind you, in the previous two failures, it's never "bridged" that section. It simply calluses.) I then wiped that section with alcohol and let it dry for a minute or two. Next, I painted on a generous amount of Clonex gel along a thin strip of the outer-most callus tissue before crafting a baggie out of a-couple-seasons-ago kanuma bag I had kept for just such an occasion. Its blue and I suspect has zero magic qualities, but keeps me from having to savage a ziploc bag. Maybe the blue will cut out a bit of light. I paid particular attention to how the plastic was affixed at the top, because my first failure with this one I diagnosed as the sphagnum staying too wet. As a final step, I wrapped the plastic in aluminum to keep it dark in hopes of giving the roots no excuses.

I was reminded to cut some holes in the bottom of the plastic, so that'll be a task for tomorrow, since I already sat it back in the yard.

Thanks for stopping by. Here's hoping.

https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/pretty-raw-trident.36421/ <- I was right about Dav4 & Smoke.

Looks like you've got freshly pruned branches on top. You need as many leaves above as possible to power the roots

Looks like a cork bark variety of trident. Could that be the issue?

I've also had a devil of a time getting tridents to air layer. They don't bridge or die. They just swell like crazy, build up huge callous tissue, and sit there.

mrcasey said:

I've also had a devil of a time getting tridents to air layer. They don't bridge or die. They just swell like crazy, build up huge callous tissue, and sit there.

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My experience as well. The only layers I’ve had work are smaller/younger tridents (between 1-3 years old) that I’ve threaded through washers. Chunky tridents that I’ve tried to air layer have all just formed monstrous callous but zero roots.

bwaynef said:

What is the recommended procedure for an airlayer that fails? 2x?

First I wrapped it with sphagnum and didn’t get roots. Worried the sphagnum was staying too wet which then caused the layer to fail, I hung a 4” pot and filled it with soil. That one also produced no new roots. (Bigbox hormone the first time and clonex the second, I think.)

I’m getting definite callus material but can’t coax a root out of it.

I’ve got bigbox hormone, clonex gel (.3%), hormodin 3 (.8%), and Dip&Grow (1%) if anyone thinks any of those is better than any other for this case.

I’m quite successful with Japanese maple airlayers and have been successful with tridents, but this one is being …complicated. The payoff seems worth it so I keep trying. I’d rather not go to the trouble of approach/thread grafting roots. Is that what it’s going to take?

Thanks for your experienced help.

Click to expand...

Have you ever attempted the tourniquet method?

Or a method similar to the below thread's suggestion ie one season of tourniquet and the next attempting the airlayering?

I'll tag @Shibui since 'trident' is not in the title of the thread and it might not enter his radar. I don't have much experience with this problem air layering tridents, but he might who knows!

I've personally done 3 varieties (fuyo-en, mino yatsubusa, and rough bark) and they all worked (though not at all as most Japanese Maples, for me). I know that's not helpful, but I did want to confirm that in principle it works

eugenev2 said:

Have you ever attempted the tourniquet method?

Or a method similar to the below thread's suggestion ie one season of tourniquet and the next attempting the airlayering?

Air layering a trident maple in the summer

I'm hoping to air layer the top half of my trident maple, because the trunk is too tall, and want to see if I can get a "free" tree out of the trunk chop. It's just getting to the hot part of the summer in Georgia... Did I miss my window this year? Or can I go ahead and start the air layer in...

www.bonsainut.com

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From my experience/understanding, the tourniquet method is instrumental in creating a swelling from which callus material grows before roots. I'm not having problems getting callus material (or swelling for that matter), and there seems to be little danger in bridging between top and bottom, as that's never been the issue on this particular airlayer.

Canada Bonsai said:

I'll tag @Shibui since 'trident' is not in the title of the thread and it might not enter his radar.

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Thanks for the summosn @Canada Bonsai but not sure I can be any practical help.
As mentioned by @SeanS tridents layer real well when threaded through washers or sheet metal so I'm very surprised they don't layer above ground.
Just trying to think if I have ever layered trident?? JM but maybe not trident as they are so easy to grow from scratch.

I haven’t had good luck layering large tridents… at all. If I’m not building the tree from a seedling, and sometimes even then, I always plan on adding root grafts to the existing root system to improve it. I always have a tray of seedlings available for just this reason. I know you’re not trying to improve the existing root system here, but that’s where my experiences in attempting and failing at layering tridents came from. Good luck.

bwaynef said:

https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/pretty-raw-trident.36421/ <- I was right about Dav4 & Smoke.

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Well that was fun to read

Could you bury the whole thing up to the attempted layer, re-open the would and treat it as a ground layer? All that callus has made for an interesting base.

yashu said:

Could you bury the whole thing up to the attempted layer, re-open the would and treat it as a ground layer?

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bwaynef said:

That portion's about 18-20" up so I don't think planting it outside and hill layering it is going to work

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I applied 5 threadgrafts to the portion I'd been trying to layer off. I'll check back in summer and see if its safe to remove. (It'll need another 5 roots grafted in, but that can happen later.)

I love your approach to this one. When all else fails add more trees

bwaynef said:

I applied 5 threadgrafts to the portion I'd been trying to layer off. I'll check back in summer and see if its safe to remove. (It'll need another 5 roots grafted in, but that can happen later.)

Click to expand...

This is a great solution. I think I'd probably leave it attached to the parent until next spring to allow those grafts to get really strong before separating.